Hmm . . .

[AlphaChiGirl]

For Olivia (and for anyone who knows)...
Would it be possible for you to disassociate with your sorority--like, rescind your membership? Honestly, if it's making you that unhappy, I would suggest cutting the sorority from your life altogther. I have heard, however, that NPHC groups do not allow disassociation. If this is true, why?

[12dn94dst]

I'm writing this for the perspective that Olivia_396 is a member of a sorority.

To all,

Cutting herself off from the sorority would not solve the problem. The hurt would still be there and she'd only be running from the issue. The thing to do, as others have said, would be to sit down with the women whom she feels have wronged her. I'm not saying today or tomorrow, but at some point in time, she needs to deal with these women and the pain she feels. In the meantime, this woman needs to allow herself to be surrounded by the THOUSANDS of POSITIVE members in her sorority. She needs to know that yes, what happened was inappropriate but it is by no means representative of the organization. This is not a time for the members to turn their backs on her, NOR is time for her to turn her back on the rest of the membership. It is a time to embrace her and show her what TRUE SISTERHOOD is and should be. It is a time for her to remember the words of the OATH that she took, of her own free will, to maintain a LIFETIME COMMITMENT to her sorority. The notion that she should just disassociate herself from something she wanted as a result of something she allowed to happen is, in MY OPINION, excuse my french, BULLSHIT. I don't know how anyone else treats their family, their SISTERS, their SORORS, but I don't let mine walk away when are hurting. I don't let them turn their back on me. I don't let them walk away with out resolving the issue.

"When my sister's in trouble, so am I."

And I'm done.

------------------
Kelli
12-DN-94
SSU c/o 1997

[AKAtude]

I think I'll let her walk away.

Originally posted by AKAtude:
I think I'll let her walk away.

Or at least advise her to get some therapy.

WELL SAID 12dn94DST,

If Olivia_396 is honestly a member of an organization, and now she his filled with bitterness and hate towards her sisters she really does have a problem

Olivia_396 please remember that your oranization is bigger than just where you pledged. There are a lot of people who love their sorority sisters ans their sorority.

As for those people who planted the seed of distrust,hate, and bitterness, you just need to separate yourself. Separate yourself only if you can't talk to them, to let them know how you feel!!!!

So please pray on that bitterness, because life is to short!!!

[PhoenixGrad]

Unfortunately, most of the people involved with this discussion are ignoring the bigger problem. HAZING!!!! Let's be honest ladies...how many of you WEREN'T hazed in some form or fashion while you pledged. I'm hearing a lot about "turning" offending sorors in, but I know enough women who were willing to put up with ANYTHING just so that they wouldn't be called "PAPER" by other sororities and fraternities! Most women pledge when they are young, and pardon the expression, stupid. All they see are letters and colors. Most do not gain perspective about their sorority until they have graduated and are out in the real world a while. Most pledges don't want to chicken out or seen as a loser, or worse a traitor, and so they do nothing. Ladies....there is serious abuse going on out there. And it's happening on most campuses and in all types of sororities - NPC, NPHC, Latina, Asian, and Multicultural! We need to face up to this fact and deal with it.

[dstbrat]

i stand corrected! i couldn't remeber her name on the show. i still can't. do you?

[AKAtude]

Excuse me, but when I pledged I was not one of the stupid young ladies you referred to. Yes, I wanted to be an AKA or nothing at all, but not at the expense of my self-respect. I am not one to allow anyone regardless of who they are to walk over me. I treat others as I expect to be treated and that is how I approach the whole initiation process.

Unfortunately, the real vs. paper issue still remains with us, but that does not apply to everyone because we do not all think the same way. That is being stereotypical. If you encounter people who are willing to put up with anything just to gain acceptance or to belong to a particular organization, then they need to take a look at themselves and become stronger individuals.

[AKAtude]

Micheal,

I've expressed the opinion earlier if in fact her claim is true, this is a serious matter and she should take appropriate action. There is nothing that we can do for her here. If she wants to discuss the incident privately, my e-mail is available and I'll respond to her. Otherwise, I have to ask what is the point? All we can say is report the incident and seek some kind of help.

It is difficult for me to show sympathy to someone who claims to be a member of a sorority and posts this information in the form of a poem. At the same time, they have chosen to use the grinning icon to express their emotion. If this person were really angry, then why laugh about it? I guess they must have a good or warped sense of humor.




[This message has been edited by AKAtude (edited June 20, 2000).]

[Eclipse]

I always find it interesting that when people express misgiving about being hazed after the fact that people always blame the victim because they 'knew what to expect.' There is a very interesting film about the Challenger explosion of the mid-80s that explorers the psychological notion of 'group think' that I think could easily be applied to what happens in sorority/fraternity hazing incidents. In a nut shell the film showed how one of the engineers KNEW that the Challenger had some serious flaws, but his desire to maintain group cohesion was so strong that heallowed his collegues erroneous opinions to go forth, which ultimately led to the disaster. It was a chilling film, and I encourage all greeks or potential greeks to watch it before participating in membership intake. If these 40 + year old men, with multiple engineering degrees found them selves the victim of groupthink, can we honestly say that 18, 19, and 20 year old people 'knew what they were getting into?"

Originally posted by AKAtude:
Micheal,

I've expressed the opinion earlier if in fact her claim is true, this is a serious matter and she should take appropriate action. There is nothing that we can do for her here. If she wants to discuss the incident privately, my e-mail is available and I'll respond to her. Otherwise, I have to ask what is the point? All we can say is report the incident and seek some kind of help.

It is difficult for me to show sympathy to someone who claims to be a member of a sorority and posts this information in the form of a poem. At the same time, they have chosen to use the grinning icon to express their emotion. If this person were really angry, then why laugh about it? I guess they must have a good or warped sense of humor.




[This message has been edited by AKAtude (edited June 20, 2000).]

Micheal,

I've expressed the opinion earlier if in fact her claim is true, this is a serious matter and she should take appropriate action. There is nothing that we can do for her here. If she wants to discuss the incident privately, my e-mail is available and I'll respond to her. Otherwise, I have to ask what is the point? All we can say is report the incident and seek some kind of help.

It is difficult for me to show sympathy to someone who claims to be a member of a sorority and posts this information in the form of a poem. At the same time, they have chosen to use the grinning icon to express their emotion. If this person were really angry, then why laugh about it? I guess they must have a good or warped sense of humor.

My Sister,

You have great style in expressing your words. It makes me proud to have you as a sister.

Post Script: I am sure you are a ball of fire!!!!

Best Regards
M.L
Phi Lambda
"06"

[ManndingoNUPE]

I doubt if you are AKA or DST
But all I feel is pitty for thee,
If you have a problem, deal with it at the source,
And should this not fufill you, then try another course,
But your words are tired, and probably not even true,
As I said before, I have nothing but pitty for you.

[PhoenixGrad]

Look...I'm not saying that every single women out there is stupid when (or because) she pledged. What I am saying however is hazing is real...and it comes in all forms. Many think hazing is simply being harmed physically. What about mentally? What about be yelled at as if your a child? What about having to stay up all night even if you have class the next day? What about being told not to speak to other people, or not to look at other sorors, or even be able to go to the bathroom when you need to? For many people..that's just being on line. For others, that's abuse. Where is the line drawn? Do chapters take the time to find out what their pledges limits are? I personally knew of a young woman who had been verbally abused as a child. While on line she nearly had a nervous breakdown because the women kept getting in her face and yelling at her. And though the organization would have truly benefited from her being a member (she was carrying a 4.0 gpa, was a star soccer player, and a classical pianist), she couldn't hack it and dropped line. It was not only a terrible experience for her, but a great loss for the sorority!

[AKAtude]

We have had this discussion so many times in the past. All I can say is that not all chapters are alike because the members in a particular chapter creates its "personality", if you will. As I stated before, I treat people the way I would want to be treated.
No one yelled in my face, and if they did I would have yelled back. No one ever hit me because we wouldn't even get that far. I had a positive experience while on line. That is probably the reason why all of my line sisters and sorors who initiated me keep in touch to this day. I love them as though they are my biological sisters. I'm sorry everyone can't say the same.

[Serenity]

PhoenixGrad,

I understand your point. However, there is a time when we must become accountable for our own actions. This is not "placing the blame on the victim" as someone stated, but simply understanding our own personal boundaries and not putting ourselves in situations where we feel comprimised (for lack of a better word).

As college students (17-21+), most of us knew the difference between right and wrong. No matter what decision we made or the factors that contributed to our decision making, we knew the difference between right and wrong and made our decision accordingly. We may have regretted that decision later on, but ultimately it was our choice to begin with.

I know sometimes there is some gray area. Not everything is black and white. However, even posed with a dilemma you can make a choice that is, at the very least, bearable.

Before I went on line, I didn't know step-by-step what was going to take place - no one does. However, I knew EXACTLY what I WASN'T going to do to earn my letters and I stuck by that. I think most of us do.


------------------
Sincerity, Loyalty, Unity
Sigma Lambda Upsilon: Hasta La Muerte!



[This message has been edited by Serenity (edited June 20, 2000).]