Regarding 'shameless plugs' - Page 2

gphiangel624 · #1 10-05-2002, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 2017law
In terms of being a rush violation, here is 1 example, there are others, namely the UF thread, where GCers and PNMs have sought each other out and remained in contact during rush.

This is just me defending my statement with evidence to back it up. Sorry if too law school-ish, it's consumed my life for a year and a half.

~2017

Let me just say, in positive response, that Annie (Shark in Skirt) emailed me after discovering I was a member of a Greek Organization at UCR. I, having been a Recruitment Counselor last year and having been EXTREMELY careful about "pre-rushing" PNMs, was quite hesitant in responding to her. First of all, we haven't started the "silence period" yet- it is perfectly OK on my campus to speak to PNMs. Needless to say, I am not a rude person. If I receive an email from a PNM (who by the way, was able to get my email address because it's on my GC profile) who is interested in Recruitment in general, I will be kind enough to answer her questions, direct her to the proper Panhellenic people to talk to, and possibly assist her with any questions/problems she's having as a new freshman at my university. Annie has emailed me to let me know she's been enjoying life at UCR thus far, that she's met lots and lots of girls from DIFFERENT sororities and has enjoyed their company, that she's more excited about UCR than she thought she'd be. She understands the recruitment rules, as do I. The only times I've ever even seen Annie have been 1) at a Student Life sponsored event where all the sororities were represented and she seeked me out, we introduced ourselves, she continued meeting people from all the other organizations. 2) she came into my office (where Greek life is housed) to turn in a Recruitment application, I just happened to be working front desk and she recognized me. She said hi, I said hi, have a good weekend, and she was on her way. I have never even once attempted to "rush" her for my specific organization- I have various close friends in other orgs who would be just as lucky to have someone as wonderful as Annie in their organization... and you know what, no matter where she ends up, she'll still be my sister in Panhellenic, and that's all that matters to me.

This my actual job on campus: to assist any and all (especially new) students to become acquainted with the Student Organizations on my campus. If those organizations that the student is interested in happen to be GLOs, I will give my best knowledge and advice to those students. For everyone's information, I am the only student employee (of 12 in my office) that has agreed to not wear anything Greek-related, including my own letters, on the job, so as not to inadvertently recruit students or scare away those who are intimidated by social Greeks. The other 6 students who are members of social Greek orgs can wear whatever they want and speak of their organizations at any time.

On my campus, there are numerous actions that can be written as recruitment infractions. My chapter was wrongly accused last year of an infraction, yet we still did the deeds we were asked to do in order to clear it. This year, like every other, every NPC chapter is searching out behavior that will lead to another chapter getting an infraction. It's ridiculous, childish, and makes recruitment look like a bunch of, excuse me, b*tches out for blood, when aside from Fall Recruitment, the six chapters represented on my campus are extremely close and favorable of one another- we have wonderful Panhellenic unity, until it's time to bust someone.

I'm sorry if I'm sounding overly-defensive, but I have never once "dirty rushed" anyone, and because an interested PNM has emailed me asking me questions about rush in general, about the university, about Panhellenic, that doesn't mean I'm dirty rushing anyone- it's not against the rules whatsoever. I've never called/emailed/etc Annie in order to dirty rush her. She's gone out with her suitemates because she's independent and willing to meet everyone, and I wouldn't doubt if other chapter members have put in their own "shameless plugs" directly to her face- but isn't that what we want: a good name for our own organization?

Lastly, I think if GCers are concerned about how a shameless plug may affect what a GC PNM will choose in terms of chapters, then a) don't give shameless plugs (I know I'm guilty of them, too and I can stop as easy as anyone else) and b) encourage PNMs to not mention chapter names or clues that give away chapter names in their rush threads. Most of them have been kind enough all ready to do so. I don't think anyone should be hurt if a PNM does not choose your chapter- chapters vary by school as we all know and the comments made by PNMs about chapters are only first impressions... believe me, if I only went by first impressions, my best friends would not be members of a sorority that I dropped after round one. The girls that I didn't like then are now some of my best friends... don't take little comments to heart.

Again, I'm sorry if this comes off as defensive, but one comment can seem to bring on numerous allegations that just aren't true. And again, PnquinTrax, thanks for bringing up this discussion. I think we should all be just a little more careful of what we say and do- words and actions are consistently misinterpreted. I'm not even going to post my signature until recruitment at UCR is over, just in case.

RubberSoul · #2 10-05-2002, 08:24 PM

I agree that maybe we should back off with the "shameless plug" thing. I feel that we should take our cues from the PNM. If they happen to go to ABC, and you are an ABC and they say how much they liked it there and really hope to get into that house, there is absolutely nothing wrong with saying "Oh I'm so glad you liked ABC, that rocks...." or something to that effect. And as for the signatures that many of us have, that shouldn't be a problem. It's simply a matter of choosing your words carefully.......

GammaPhiBabe · #3 10-05-2002, 08:49 PM

Quote:

I'm doing my best not to add anything to the rush story threads unless I have something truly substantive to say.

I agree with this. I don't see how my saying "Go Gamma Phi!" (when it's a PNM I have never even met!) helps things. These posts just clog up the board and make the rush threads go on and on for pages. I read rush threads to hear about the PNM's experience and what rush is like at different schools, not to read 5 pages of GC members' comments about their own sororities. Besides, my letters are in my signature and my screen name. It's pretty obvious what sorority I'll be rooting for!

I think that it could really make a PNM feel bad if she has just been cut by her favorite house, XYZ, and she really doesn't fit in at ABC. Then when she comes back here to post, there are umpteen people posting "I hope you loved XYZ!!" and "GO ABC!!"

Why don't we limit our posts in the rush threads to constructive/helful advice or encouragement to the PNM who is being so kind as to give us a window to her experience.

Just my .02...

aprilxo · #4 10-05-2002, 10:23 PM

I'm not sure I have much to add, but it makes me glad to see other people concerned about this as well. Not so much that it has stood out as a problem to me, but that others are thinking about what they say and its effect on PNMs. If members of our orgs on those campuses are not allowed to outright recruit, then even if we post pride (which is good!) it shouldn't be pointed at recruiting (which has potential to be bad).

If we just blatantly used GC as an outlet for propaganda for our own orgs with no self-regulation, it could probably get pretty messy. But on the other hand, if it was mandated, GC would no longer be an open place to discuss Greek life (which makes me glad that that's not the issue at hand!

) . Moreover, if it didn't matter at all for members of other chapters to "plug," then one chapter could use another chapter's members to discuss the sorority with a PNM on GC to recruit with out a detectable "infraction." But from what I've seen that's not a worry. I trust you guys and gals--overall I consider GC to be full of pretty respectful people.

Greek love,
April

Shark In Skirt · #5 10-05-2002, 11:16 PM

As a PNM who is about to rush next week, I can honestly say that "shameless plugs" have no effect on me whatsoever... and I have a hard time imagining that these affect anybody with half of a braincell. If rushees are really taking to heart what is being said on a public internet forum so much as to have their decisions swayed, then perhaps those are the rushees are a bit weak-minded.

Shameless plugs, in my humble opinion, are just enthusastic responses from someone who was kind enough to take interest in my rush thread.

XOXO,
Annie.

gphiangel624 · #6 10-05-2002, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Shark In Skirt
If rushees are really taking to heart what is being said on a public internet forum so much as to have their decisions swayed, then perhaps those are the rushees are a bit weak-minded.

I couldn't have said it better!

gphiangel624 · #7 10-05-2002, 11:22 PM

Oops, forgot to disclude my signature!

Carol

PenguinTrax · #8 10-06-2002, 08:29 AM

Wow, my little posting sure stirred up a bunch of discussion!

I'm glad everyone seems to be taking my post in the manner in which it was meant - think before you post. Don't worry about taking letters out of your sigs or anything else, that's just going too far in my opinion. Just weigh carefully what and HOW you say things, before hitting the submit button.

And if all else fails...there's always the edit feature.

justamom · #9 10-06-2002, 09:29 AM

I guess the bottom line is-If you are going to err, err on the side of caution!

Good discussion!

Shark In Skirt · #10 10-06-2002, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RubberSoul
And as for the signatures that many of us have, that shouldn't be a problem. It's simply a matter of choosing your words carefully.......

Just curious.... how would one dictate what is appropiate in a signature and what isn't?

It's really wonderful that GCers are so concerned over PNMs... but isn't Greek Chat primarily for Greeks, first and foremost?

As a PNM, I appreciate, without a doubt, all of the help and advice that's been given to me on this forum, and yet, I'm also amazed that those of you in a GLO are willing to censor yourselves in a forum that was basically created for those in Greek Letter Organizations... I hope you won't change yourselves to be too "PC" in order to cater to the PNMs on this board, which I think, are far less in numbers than actual Greek members. I love you folks just the way you are.

XOXO,

kdonline · #11 10-06-2002, 01:46 PM

Another concern is... would the university PHC's see these posts as rush infractions?

Could we, perhaps, be putting our own GLOs at risk, because of posting in PNM's threads?

As for the incident of personally knowing PNMs and/or seeking them out - I don't see how that is a rush infraction. You meet people all the time, and yes, they'll know of your GLO, but just because you met, doesn't mean you are inviting them to your house.

Personally, I have kept an eye on all the UF threads, because that's my alma mater. I think maybe once I saw someone who has posted that they saw a GC PNM during rush - this, I don't think, was too smart.

I think if there is a GC PNM rushing at your school, you should not post in their thread until after rush. Because, imagine what would happen, should a PHC rep from your school see that message?! It would just be messy - so why take the risk?

But seriously, I am curious to find out if any of these posts could be seen as rush infractions, from either end.

valkyrie · #12 10-06-2002, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GammaPhiBabe
I agree with this. I don't see how my saying "Go Gamma Phi!" (when it's a PNM I have never even met!) helps things. These posts just clog up the board and make the rush threads go on and on for pages. I read rush threads to hear about the PNM's experience and what rush is like at different schools, not to read 5 pages of GC members' comments about their own sororities. Besides, my letters are in my signature and my screen name. It's pretty obvious what sorority I'll be rooting for!

I think that it could really make a PNM feel bad if she has just been cut by her favorite house, XYZ, and she really doesn't fit in at ABC. Then when she comes back here to post, there are umpteen people posting "I hope you loved XYZ!!" and "GO ABC!!"

Why don't we limit our posts in the rush threads to constructive/helful advice or encouragement to the PNM who is being so kind as to give us a window to her experience.

Just my .02...

Very well said, and I agree completely! I can remember at least one PNM commenting that the "shameless plugs" made her feel uncomfortable. Aside from that, I'm sorry and I don't mean to sound rude, but they are really boring to read. We are all proud of our organizations, and that pride is reflected in many of our signatures. Rather than cheering for my organization in particular, I just hope that every PNM here finds the best home for her, and of course I have *no way* of knowing where that would be!

thetakates · #13 10-06-2002, 10:59 PM

I want to agree with the first part of the Thread....Shameless Plugs can be really really nerveracking for the PNM. I never went through formal recruitment, but I knwo that the process is very very nerve-racking! I also know that every organization at every school is very very different. I know other chapters of my sorority that are very different from the one that I am in and if I would have gone to that school I would have never fit into that chapter at all. It is different for everyone and everyone needs to be respectful of that! My 2cents anyways

sbhill2 · #14 10-06-2002, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RubberSoul
I agree that maybe we should back off with the "shameless plug" thing. I feel that we should take our cues from the PNM. If they happen to go to ABC, and you are an ABC and they say how much they liked it there and really hope to get into that house, there is absolutely nothing wrong with saying "Oh I'm so glad you liked ABC, that rocks...." or something to that effect. And as for the signatures that many of us have, that shouldn't be a problem. It's simply a matter of choosing your words carefully.......

I agree with RubberSoul and a lot of other posts around here. I don't think what we're doing with the 'shameless plugs' is such a great idea in all. We need to try to let these girls do it on their own. Signatures don't need to be taken out most definately - its just a way of showing pride in our organization and I think when a PNM see's that on here they read it as pride too. So in that respect its a good thing. Not to say that those of us who have put in 'shameless plugs' are bad representatives of our organization b/c I am just as guilty of shameless plugs as most of y'all. I think we just need to take an extra step from now on in the rush stories by PNMs to support them without the plugs. So let's all try to do this so that PNMs can have a good rush experience and good experience with GC.

I hope that message made sense. I was having trouble finding the right way to say thigns so that y'all could understand my point of view. If it doesn't make sense, PM me and I can try to fix it.

AchtungBaby80 · #15 10-07-2002, 09:49 AM

Right, if I were a PNM, all these "Go ------!" and "------ is the best!" things that people say would not affect me whatsoever. Nor would they make me feel uncomfortable. But that's just me. I think we're being a little overly sensitive here, though...if a PNM can't handle it, then she shouldn't be on here posting her story. You know, the comments PNMs make in their rush thread might offend some members. The road goes both ways. Toes are going to get stepped on sometimes, but personally, I'll be darned if I'll get upset over something I read on the internet.

And if it's a rush infraction to be communicating with PNMs during rush, then why don't we just delete all the rush threads and solve the problem that way?