Catholics in Frats

[Beryana]

Originally posted by hendrixski


This thread is very insightful and cleared many things up for me. In summary as it pertains to this thread: Many GLO's were started by Freemasons, and the rituals are similar. The Church has however lifted its ban on laymen joining freemasons a while ago.

Actually I would have to say that you are incorrect on both accounts. The Catholic Church has never lifted the ban on joining Freemasons. . . .

I would also have to say that many GLOs are not based on Freemasonry, but that too is very difficult to say as I have never (nor ever have any desire to) see/experience the Mason's rituals nor any other GLO's ritual. . . but based on the other thread with other member's saying they are not similar, etc I'm basing that statement on what had been said.

[TPARose]

I'm assuming that the case of the matter is that if such thing was said about joining socities, they didnt include GLO's. Otherwise, Theta Phi Alpha would be in a stitch, as it was originally founded on the morals of Catholic womanhood, although it has expanded to all religions now (I for one, am not catholic.)

I am not well informed about the free masons as one should be, but from my understandance, they were ridgedly anti-catholic. They were in fact.. anti anything that didnt fall into the "White Anglo-Saxon Presbyterian" area of things. This might be the reason that the pope had such qualms with them.

And truth be told.. I think that now, more then any time in history, we have freedom of religon. Final message:
No matter your religion, Go Greek!!

[aephi alum]

Originally posted by TPARose
I am not well informed about the free masons as one should be, but from my understandance, they were ridgedly anti-catholic. They were in fact.. anti anything that didnt fall into the "White Anglo-Saxon Presbyterian" area of things. This might be the reason that the pope had such qualms with them.

The Masons are not anti-Catholic or pro-WASP. To be a Mason, you do have to believe in a God of some description, but you don't have to be of a particular faith. My husband, for instance, is a Mason and is Jewish. The prohibition against Catholics becoming Masons came from the Catholic Church, not the Masons.

[Beryana]

Originally posted by aephi alum


The Masons are not anti-Catholic or pro-WASP. To be a Mason, you do have to believe in a God of some description, but you don't have to be of a particular faith. My husband, for instance, is a Mason and is Jewish. The prohibition against Catholics becoming Masons came from the Catholic Church, not the Masons.

And the prohibition (which included excommunication!!) was because the Masonic organization/beliefs goes against the teachings of the Catholic Church. This would make it anti-Catholic. . .

[dekeguy]

Actually, the RC Church lifted the ban back in the 60's when Pope Paul VI met with the Duke of Kent, Grand Master of England and they realized that there was no difficulty between Legit Masons and Catholics. It was a misunderstanding of huge proportions. Please see my postings in the Masonic thread. Later on the current Pope, John Paul II reiterated that there was no reason why a catholic lay person could not join the Masons. The only reservation is that in order to join the Masons Catholic Clergy must obtain approval of their Bishop, or their Father Superior if they are members of professed orders such as Jesuits or Franciscans. This has to do with lines of authority and appearance of active endorsement rather than cordial relations based on non hostile non opposing philosophies.
There are Masons who are a bit anti-Catholic and there are Catholics who are a bit anti-Mason just as there are Greeks who are anti-GDI and GDIs who are anti-Greek. This simply is not a perfect world. The key point is that after a couple of hundred years of mutual misunderstanding the Masons and the Catholics are on friendly terms and the Pope apparently thinks this is just fine with him.
As to Masonry being purely WASP, one should remember that the Order is rather a lot older than this country and one will find regular legit Masons of every faith, every race, and every philosophy so long as they all believe in a Supreme Being and live up to the obligation one takes at initiation. In some countries most Masons are Catholics
As an OBTW, I am a practising Catholic, when I was at School in England and later in my JYA in England I was an acholyte who regularly served Mass for Cardinal Basil Hume, and I am a Mason who has been Master of my Lodge and served as M.E.Z. of my Royal Arch Chapter.
If I can answer any specific questions please post or send me an email.

[Beryana]

These are some sources for my information with regards to the Catholic Church's stance on Freemasonry:

http://www.dioceseoflafayette.org/wo...es-121000.html
http://www.cin.org/mateo/freemasons-...-position.html
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14071b.htm

The present legislation of the Church is contained in canon 1374:
Can. 1374 A person who joins an association which plots against the Church is to be punished with a just penalty; one who promotes or takes office in such an association is to be punished with an interdict.

In the previous Code (can 2335), Masonry is explicitly mentioned. As the declaration of 26 November 1983 explains, the omission of the name "Mason" in the present Church law is due to an "editorial criterion." Masonic associations are thus included under a more general heading which could include any other association conspiring against the Church (e.g. a specific communist party).

******** I don't see any question in the matter. . . .If there is other, more recent Canon Law (than 1983) that states otherwise I would LOVE to see it - seriously

Sarah

[aopirose]

The Church never lifted its ban on Masonic Membership. The Code was revised by striking the word Masonic to make it broader. That way other anti-Cathloic associations could be covered. Many people took the revision as a "go ahead" since it was no longer specifically mentioned.

"QUAESITUM EST
Declaration on Masonic Associations
Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith

It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church's decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous code.

This sacred congregation is in a position to reply that this circumstance is due to an editorial criterion which was followed also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as they are contained in wider categories.

Therefore, the Church's negative judgment in regard to Masonic associations remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable with the doctrine of the Church and, therefore, membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful, who enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion.

It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what has been decided above, and this in line with the declaration of this sacred congregation issued Feb. 17,1981. [1]

In an audience granted to the undersigned cardinal prefect, the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication of this declaration which had been decided in an ordinary meeting of this sacred congregation.

Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Nov. 26, 1983

Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger Prefect

Father Jerome Hamer, O. P. Titular Archbishop of Lorium
Secretary

Notes

1. Cf. AAS 73 (1981) pp. 240-241"


The Codes referred to in the above are the 1917 code of canon law (canon 2335) (previous) and the 1983 code (canon 1374) (revised). Cardinal Bernard Law restated these beliefs in a 1996 letter to the U.S. Bishops. http://showcase.netins.net/web/clear...mason.html#004

Bishop Fabian Bruskewitz issued the following statement that (published in Southern Nebraska Register, March 22, 1996):

"All Catholics in and of the Diocese of Lincoln are forbidden to be members of the organizations and groups listed below. Membership in these organizations or groups is always perilous to the Catholic Faith and most often is totally incompatible with the Catholic Faith.

Planned Parenthood
Society of Saint Pius X (Lefebvre Group)
Hemlock Society
Call to Action
Call to Action Nebraska
Saint Michael the Archangel Chapel
Freemasons
Job's Daughters
DeMolay
Eastern Star
Rainbow Girls
Catholics for a Free Choice

Any Catholics in and of the Diocese of Lincoln who attain or retain membership in any of the above listed organizations or groups after April 15, 1996, are by that very fact (ipso facto latae sententiae) under interdict and are absolutely forbidden to receive Holy Communion. Contumacious persistence in such membership for one month following the interdict on part of any such Catholics will by that very fact (ipso facto latae sententiae) cause them to be excommunicated. Absolution from these ecclesial censures is "reserved to the Bishop."

This notice, when published in the Southern Nebraska Register, is a formal canonical warning.

By mandate of the Most Reverend Bishop of Lincoln.
Reverend Monsignor Timothy Thorburn, Chancellor March 19, 1996"

[MysticCat]

Originally posted by aopirose (in part)
Cardinal Bernard Law restated these beliefs in a 1996 letter to the U.S. Bishops. http://showcase.netins.net/web/clear...mason.html#004

Thanks for linking to this very thorough treatment of the question. As Cardinal Law explains, Masonic membership is still banned, but no longer leads to automatic excommunication.

Turning back to the question that started this thread, it would seem that any prohibition on membership in a GLO would depend entirely on the specific GLO in question. Certainly, no GLO is likely to engage in the political agitation or anti-clericalism that has characterized Freemasonry in Europe and South America at times in history. And I think that few, if any, GLO's are likely to present the thorough and detailed philosophical system that Freemasonry entails.

That said, it is certainly true that many GLO's, fraternities primarily, were influenced by Freemasonry and turned to masonic ritual for inspiration in crafting their own rituals, as can be seen at this site. Absent any specific prohibition on a specific GLO, then one must use one's best judgment as to the compatibility between the teachings/principles of the GLO in question and the teachings of the Church. I think investigation will show that this was one of the reasons for the founding of specifically "Catholic GLO's" -- an prospective member would be sure that there would be no such incompatibility.

My 2 cents.

[Senusret I]

That's definitely an unfair generalization, one that we as North American GLO members should definitely avoid, seeing as how our own system has its own negative stereotypes.

Originally posted by DeltaSigStan

2) NOt true. In the Phillipines they have GLOs, but they're basically street gangs for those fortunate enough to go to college. My cousin is in Beta Kappa Epsilon at the University of Manila. I've been told of drive bys and murders that GLOs there have been a part of.

[DeltaSigStan]

Originally posted by dardenr
That's definitely an unfair generalization, one that we as North American GLO members should definitely avoid, seeing as how our own system has its own negative stereotypes.

Gee, I guess when people I know in the Phillipines who are in fraternaties are the ones telling me this. I didn't just wake up and make that "generalization". I have been told this by MANY who know. My uncle who was also in a fraternity in the Phillipines told me not to wear my letters when I take a trip there because I might get myself killed.......That enough for you?

[dekeguy]

Beryana, AOPiRose, and MysticCat81,
Thank you for the thought provoking comments and links to pursuasive authorities. I need to refelect on all of this as I have been operating on info provided by my Archbishop. I do not want to run counter to Cardinal Ratsinger but I wonder if this issue might have canonical jurisdiction implications. When the Jesuits were surpressed as an Order in the 1700s the bull of supression was not applicable in some Patriarchal jurisdictions which allowed the Order to survive and flourish until general restoration some decades later. Because of the apparent confusion in applying a uniform policy where Metropolitans and Ordinaries have widely differing policies I wonder if there are more layers yet to peel back. I was concerned by certain inaccuracies in Cardinal Law's link which made me think that I need to do more research and seek guidance from a senior prelate. In any case, I appreciate the food for thought.

[Senusret I]

peace

[AphiCutie]

I go to a Jesuit school whose president is not only a Jesuit but a Greek. He will be replaced next year as president with another Jesuit and Greek.

[DGMarie]

There is an entire women's npc sorority started by a Catholic priest, correct?

[adduncan]

Originally posted by DGMarie
There is an entire women's npc sorority started by a Catholic priest, correct?

Yes, Theta Phi Alpha, founded for Catholic girls in Michigan who were not allowed into other fraternities for women.

It's part of NPC and nonsectarian now, but they require that new intiates "respect the religious history" of the organization.

Adrienne (PNAM 2003 and Trivial Pursuit Master<g>)