Transgender women in sorority life?

[anna7363]

The campus I'm on doesn't require a recommendation btw

[carnation]

The campus has nothing to do with it. Several individual sororities do and that is supposed to apply to all their chapters.

[anna7363]

@theatalady, I think your comment completely encapsulates the situation. All you people who are alumni and in nationals made these policies to keep trans women out of sororities on purpose. You are well aware that it is a very rare person who could have any chance of meeting all your set requirements. Maybe a dozen trans women on earth were born in a state where there birth certificates could get changed, is from a family that has 20,000 dollars to burn on surgery, and has a family accepting enough to transition under the age of 18.

Yes this did happen! You know why I care? Because I have a transgender sister who is 14 years old and to know she will not have the same opportunities in life I have had breaks my heart. That the insane requirements you people make will mean she can never join sorority life, she can never go to a woman's college, she may be raped out of spite because of attitudes like yours. I never said this girl was fully transitioned, I said no one really knows.

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by anna7363

@theatalady, I think your comment completely encapsulates the situation. All you people who are alumni and in nationals made these policies to keep trans women out of sororities on purpose. You are well aware that it is a very rare person who could have any chance of meeting all your set requirements. Maybe a dozen trans women on earth were born in a state where there birth certificates could get changed, is from a family that has 20,000 dollars to burn on surgery, and has a family accepting enough to transition under the age of 18.

Yes this did happen! You know why I care? Because I have a transgender sister who is 14 years old and to know she will not have the same opportunities in life I have had breaks my heart. That the insane requirements you people make will mean she can never join sorority life, she can never go to a woman's college, she may be raped out of spite because of attitudes like yours. I never said this girl was fully transitioned, I said no one really knows.

1. To your first point, it is a rare individual who has transitioned fully at 18. Most trans people I know waited until college or moving out of their family homes before they felt comfortable enough to begin the process of transitioning. Everything that goes along with transitioning would make the importance of sorority membership pale in comparison. I would say this about anyone pursuing any major life change. Parenthood. Marriage. Insert big life event or change here.

2. You should have just come out with this story instead of fabricating a story about the trans woman that caused a mean minority of your sorority to violate your rules for voting on members. Unless this is a fabrication as well, and then you might as well be honest.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by anna7363

@theatalady, I think your comment completely encapsulates the situation. All you people who are alumni and in nationals made these policies to keep trans women out of sororities on purpose. You are well aware that it is a very rare person who could have any chance of meeting all your set requirements. Maybe a dozen trans women on earth were born in a state where there birth certificates could get changed, is from a family that has 20,000 dollars to burn on surgery, and has a family accepting enough to transition under the age of 18.

Actually, no, I think when these policies were made back before any of us were born, they were made to keep men and high school girls out of sororities. Transgender people weren't even on the radar. It's something that will be addressed more and more as the years go on, I'm sure.

[mama3delta]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Actually, no, I think when these policies were made back before any of us were born, they were made to keep men and high school girls out of sororities. Transgender people weren't even on the radar. It's something that will be addressed more and more as the years go on, I'm sure.

Yep

[anna7363]

@thetalady, Oh and by the way, I am absolutely sure there are trans women (a few, definitely not a lot) in sorority life. It is almost a statistical impossibility that it hasn't happened at least once or twice.

[thetalady]

Originally Posted by anna7363

@thetalady, Oh and by the way, I am absolutely sure there are trans women (a few, definitely not a lot) in sorority life. It is almost a statistical impossibility that it hasn't happened at least once or twice.

Originally Posted by anna7363

Lets also not forget the fact we probably have a bunch of trans women in our sororities already.

Originally Posted by anna7363

I am absolutely sure there are trans women (a few, definitely not a lot) in sorority life. It is almost a statistical impossibility that it hasn't happened at least once or twice.

OK, so is it "a few", "not a lot", "a bunch" or "one or two"?

What was your purpose with this tirade? What did you think you were going to convince all of us to do? Do you think if you scream and act nasty, stomp your feet and call us names that the whole sorority system would apologize & change because you demand it? Let us know how that works out for you.

I still think you are a big, stinkin' liar, so angry that you make vile and unwarranted accusations. Now throw your flounce and slam the door on your way out.

[anna7363]

I'm kind of disappointed that the response that has come from everyone is essentially to call me a liar. If that is the reality you choose to accept then there is nothing I can do to convince you all. I never said its a common thing to transition at this point and I didn't use my sister as a defense for the girl who was rushing because its not my place to out her. She can come out one day when she is ready. Not when I do it for her.

[snowflakemom]

First, you need to let us know if your sorority is a local, NPC, NPHC, professional etc. and what country you are in (for the Title IX rule). Otherwise we don't know what guidelines apply.

Second, something in this situation doesn't ring true to me. You had this situation in your sorority AND your 14 year old sister is transgender? Maybe it's just my part of the country but transgender isn't that common in young people.

[sigmagirl2000]

Originally Posted by snowflakemom

First, you need to let us know if your sorority is a local, NPC, NPHC, professional etc. and what country you are in (for the Title IX rule). Otherwise we don't know what guidelines apply.

Second, something in this situation doesn't ring true to me. You had this situation in your sorority AND your 14 year old sister is transgender? Maybe it's just my part of the country but transgender isn't that common in young people.

The high school where I teach has at least 7 transgendered students I can think of. 3 are legally transitioned. I do not know if they have had surgery, but I do know that legally they are changed in our systems..... And that's just a public high school of 1800ish students.... Thus it IS possible....

[AGDee]

Title IX is a law, passed by the US legislature and signed by the President. Unless we want all our organizations to go fully co-ed, we are unable to initiate someone who is biologically male. We didn't make the law except that we did fight to keep our single gender status. It is unfortunate, but until someone was fully transitioned, we could not initiate them.

[Sen's Revenge]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Title IX is a law, passed by the US legislature and signed by the President. Unless we want all our organizations to go fully co-ed, we are unable to initiate someone who is biologically male. We didn't make the law except that we did fight to keep our single gender status. It is unfortunate, but until someone was fully transitioned, we could not initiate them.

That is not at all what Title IX addresses, AGDee. Title IX does not dictate that a sorority is forbidden from initiating men. Social sororities are EXEMPT FROM Title IX rules.

Title IX says, in essence: "No person in the United States shall, on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any education program or activity receiving federal financial assistance."

If a chapter of a sorority wanted to accept a transgender woman, they would be subject to the rules of the sorority, not Title IX rules.

To the original poster: I feel you. Keep fighting. The battle will not be won on GreekChat, but it will, indeed, be won.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Sen's Revenge

That is not at all what Title IX addresses, AGDee. Title IX does not dictate that a sorority is forbidden from initiating men. Social sororities are EXEMPT FROM Title IX rules.

Title IX says, in essence: "No person in the United States shall, on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any education program or activity receiving federal financial assistance."

If a chapter of a sorority wanted to accept a transgender woman, they would be subject to the rules of the sorority, not Title IX rules.

Right, but there is an argument that if some men are initiated, then a sorority could lose its Title IX exemption. The argument would be that by initiating some men, they could not decline to initiate other men simply because they're men.

[AlwaysSAI]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Title IX is a law, passed by the US legislature and signed by the President. Unless we want all our organizations to go fully co-ed, we are unable to initiate someone who is biologically male. We didn't make the law except that we did fight to keep our single gender status. It is unfortunate, but until someone was fully transitioned, we could not initiate them.

So, here's a question (posed to everyone, not just AGDee). What about an initiated sister (born female) who transitions to male post initiation?

I ask because I was looking over some SAI policies the other day and came across our transgender policy (didn't even really know we had one). It would appear that at the collegiate level, we will only initiate women who are legally and medically female. However, if at some time after initiation, the member elects to transition and identify legally and medically as male, the Fraternity requires that her membership category be changed to the appropriate Distinguished Member category. The member is required to turn in her collegiate badge, membership card, & certificate. Following the appropriate Distinguished Member ritual, the member would wear the Distinguished Member badge and remain in that category of membership.