Taliban or Tea Party?

[MaryPoppins]

Originally Posted by agzg

The problem is that it seems like it's only those on the far left or far right that are motivated to vote in primaries.

Oh my stars, YES, even Yesser!

Originally Posted by agzg

. . . Obama's right of center sometimes [but] it doesn't play into the Socialist Muslim Immigrant narrative.

Preach!

[Shellfish]

33girl (and other Pennsylvanians), ever wonder what John Heinz would be doing now if not for that terrible accident?

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Shellfish

33girl (and other Pennsylvanians), ever wonder what John Heinz would be doing now if not for that terrible accident?

YES. Every. Freaking. Minute. You must be channelling my mom. If he hadn't died, I probably wouldn't have taken the step I felt I had to take earlier this year, which is becoming NO Party. Because the Republican Party would probably still be what it was founded to be.

[Gingerdeltaz]

First I will identify myself as the lone conservative Republican commenting on this thread...so let the feeding frenzy begin.

While I may or may not agree with all of the tenets of the Tea Party, I am far less concerned about a group that assembles by obtaining the proper permits, behaving in an orderly fashion and maintaining proper care of the facilities that they use than those on the far left that "occupy" public areas in such a manner that sexual assaults are not uncommon, nor is spitting on police officers or becoming involved in violent behavior and various other misdemeanors and felonies.

I would rather see people stand up for their beliefs by making them known in an articulate and intelligent manner than to dress in bright pink, furry costumes as vaginas, looking utterly ridiculous and demanding the arrest of Condeleezza Rice for war crimes.

I would rather hear people discuss the issues, regardless of their stance, than ridicule a public servant for his weight (Gov. Christy) or refer to an intelligent, successful, black woman as a "dirty, worthless whore" or a "House Nigger" simply because she has the audacity to disagree with their views. (Mia Love)

In my humble opinion, there could be a far more constructive discourse and greater possibility of successful solutions, if BOTH sides would concentrate on the issues and finding a common ground rather than allowing our disagreements to deteriorate into name calling and ridicule.

And I must confess that I do not think that the main stream media, which, unfortunately, many people depend upon rather than doing their own research, does not help.

If a conservative made the remarks that left wing liberal, Samuel L. Jackson made about being upset that the hurricane was missing Tampa and the possibility of "wiping out" those in attendance there would be a media uproar. If a conservative attacked the children of President Obama the way that far left liberals attack the children of Sarah Palin, the women's groups in this country would be up in arms, but it's okay, and humorous, to feed on the children of a conservative.

However, when Republicans have someone make a completely idiotic and totally uneducated remark like that of Todd Akin (Yes, I admit it)...it's headline news for days. Yet I don't hear those same media outlets being outraged at the numerous remarks tossed about by the left wing.

While there are extremists on either side of the issue that can be scary...I must confess that I find the behaviors of those on the far left to be considerably more disconcerting than those of the Tea Party.

I will step off of my "soap box" now and end my rant with the hope that we can disagree in a civil manner. Thank you.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Gingerdeltaz

First I will identify myself as the lone conservative Republican commenting on this thread...so let the feeding frenzy begin.

While I may or may not agree with all of the tenets of the Tea Party, I am far less concerned about a group that assembles by obtaining the proper permits, behaving in an orderly fashion and maintaining proper care of the facilities that they use than those on the far left that "occupy" public areas in such a manner that sexual assaults are not uncommon, nor is spitting on police officers or becoming involved in violent behavior and various other misdemeanors and felonies.

That's such an applesranges comparison. You should know better.

I would rather see people stand up for their beliefs by making them known in an articulate and intelligent manner than to dress in bright pink, furry costumes as vaginas, looking utterly ridiculous and demanding the arrest of Condeleezza Rice for war crimes.

riiiiiiight....

I would rather hear people discuss the issues, regardless of their stance, than ridicule a public servant for his weight (Gov. Christy) or refer to an intelligent, successful, black woman as a "dirty, worthless whore" or a "House Nigger" simply because she has the audacity to disagree with their views. (Mia Love)

How do you know this was done by anyone on the left? Do we know exactly who made that Wikipedia edit? Has no one on the right ever called the President a racially pejorative term?

In my humble opinion, there could be a far more constructive discourse and greater possibility of successful solutions, if BOTH sides would concentrate on the issues and finding a common ground rather than allowing our disagreements to deteriorate into name calling and ridicule.

And the Tea Party is one of the reasons we are where we are. This is a group which couldn't even agree to raise the debt ceiling. Ridiculous.

[AOII Angel]

Even her post drips with extreme disdain for opposing opinions.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Gingerdeltaz

First I will identify myself as the lone conservative Republican commenting on this thread...so let the feeding frenzy begin.
. . .
I will step off of my "soap box" now and end my rant with the hope that we can disagree in a civil manner. Thank you.

I won't participate in the feeding frenzy -- as a moderate Democrat, I agree with almost all you said. I do, though, agree with others that the comparisons you make are apple and oranges, and I do tend to think that the 'left wing liberal" in "left wing liberal Samuel L. Jackson" risks moving away from the civil discourse you rightly call for. It seems to me that labels like "left wing liberal" and "right wing conservative" have pretty much ceased to have any meaning beyond the pejorative "extremist."

I would also say that I have seem some Tea Party rallies that made some Occupy protests I have seen look like garden parties -- the level of vitriol and, well I don't know how else to say it but ignorance about our government, was disconcerting to say the least. I'm certainly not saying all most Tea Party folks are like that, nor am I saying all Occupy protests are garden parties. I'm agreeing with your assessment that there are extremists and loonies at both ends of the political spectrum. I don't think it's helpful to have a contest on whose extremists are the looniest or scariest.

I do also think there is a tendancy among all of us to think that the "other side" gets more of a pass from the media. Sometimes it may be true, but not always. There's Todd Akin, there's Anthony Weiner. As for the Palin kids, I have a hard time thinking a comparison to the Obama kids is apt. I don't think the Obama girls have being doing reality TV. Yes. as you say comments about Bristol Palin began earlier (though she was 18/almost 18 at the time), and as I recall, there was lots of condemnation from all quarters about those comments.

As for Samuel L. Jackson's tweet, accuracy matters. He didn't say anything about "wiping out" those in attendance at the GOP convention. He tweeted "Unfair S---t: GOP spared by Issac ! NOLA prolly F-----d Again. Not understanding God's plan!" (Later, he tweeted "Daayum! Poked a Hornets nest, hunh? Apologies to God, Tampa, da GOP& Isaac(sp)! Who played the Race card?!") Was he being funny or offensive (or both)? Certainly up for debate, and there's a lot of it out there. But he didn't speak of the possibility of "wiping out" those in attendance. Criticize what he said by all means, but if civil discourse is what we're after, let's not attack what he didn't say or put what he didn't say in quotation marks.

Meanwhile, I heartily recommend (again) Patriotic Grace: What It Is and Why We Need It Now by Peggy Noonan.

[pbear19]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I don't think it's helpful to have a contest on whose extremists are the looniest or scariest.

This. Gingerdeltaz, this is the problem I have with your post. It sounds like you are trying to say that the Tea Party extremism is ok because there are people on the left who are worse. Do you really want to start a competition where we all trot out examples of idiots on either end of the spectrum? How about the guys who got kicked out of the GOP convention for throwing things and making racist comments to an African American cameraman? Threats on the lives of House Democrats after votes on health care reform?

I'm doing exactly what I agreed with MC is silly to do, but only to illustrate the point. I don't think anyone here is going to say that extremists on either side are ideal. The problem is that many (most?) Tea Party members can be numbered in the "extremist" category, and it's starting to make it look like the entire Republican party belongs in the extremist category, which I do not believe is reality. I would think that more moderate Republicans would be concerned about the image that the Tea Party is giving to the rest of the right.

(I will also agree that comparing a professional political pundit like Limbaugh, someone whose family has long been associated with politics and who is known synonymously with the Republican party, with an actor like Samuel L. Jackson, who is known for being an actor, is laughable.)

[Gingerdeltaz]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I won't participate in the feeding frenzy -- as a moderate Democrat, I agree with almost all you said. I do, though, agree with others that the comparisons you make are apple and oranges, and I do tend to think that the 'left wing liberal" in "left wing liberal Samuel L. Jackson" risks moving away from the civil discourse you rightly call for. It seems to me that labels like "left wing liberal" and "right wing conservative" have pretty much ceased to have any meaning beyond the pejorative "extremist."


Meanwhile, I heartily recommend (again) Patriotic Grace: What It Is and Why We Need It Now by Peggy Noonan.

Your comment about "left wing liberal" and "left wing" really made me stop and think. I must admit that I have used those terms so casually and carelessly, that I did not give enough thought to the fact that they are labels and can certainly be inflammatory.

That was definitely a "teachable moment" for me. You are correct. I have an aversion to labels, yet I was using them myself without having thought them through. It's time to remove those labels from my discussions. Thank you.

I looked at the Peggy Noonan book on Amazon and was impressed by what I saw. I'm getting ready to download it now.

I appreciate that you did not join the feeding frenzy. It's certainly not enjoyable, but I did know that I was setting myself up for it when I chose to share the only differing opinion. I don't take it personally at all and respect that the others submitting posts are simply expressing their views as well.

[Shellfish]

As for the children of politicians, we could go back twenty years ago to when Chelsea Clinton was only 12 or 13 and the subject of nasty jokes by Rush Limbaugh and John McCain.

[Gingerdeltaz]

Originally Posted by Shellfish

As for the children of politicians, we could go back twenty years ago to when Chelsea Clinton was only 12 or 13 and the subject of nasty jokes by Rush Limbaugh and John McCain.

Those jokes were completely out of line and were both deplorable and unacceptable...as are those regarding the children of any politician.

[Shellfish]

Originally Posted by Gingerdeltaz

Those jokes were completely out of line and were both deplorable and unacceptable...as are those regarding the children of any politician.

I agree and also consider spouses off-limits most of the time.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by Shellfish

I agree and also consider spouses off-limits most of the time.

Spouses are off limits unless they involve themselves actively with the campaign, ie. Ann Romney after her GOP Convention speech and frequent campaigning. You can't be in it and out of it.

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by Shellfish

As for the children of politicians, we could go back twenty years ago to when Chelsea Clinton was only 12 or 13 and the subject of nasty jokes by Rush Limbaugh and John McCain.

Both sides have done it. No one should be proud of it.

Bristol Palin has now become a public figure in her own right, and frankly, I think she deserves it.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Gingerdeltaz

Your comment about "left wing liberal" and "left wing" really made me stop and think. I must admit that I have used those terms so casually and carelessly, that I did not give enough thought to the fact that they are labels and can certainly be inflammatory.

That was definitely a "teachable moment" for me. You are correct. I have an aversion to labels, yet I was using them myself without having thought them through. It's time to remove those labels from my discussions. Thank you.

No problem. We all have a tendancy to do it, because it becomes part of "the way people speak." We've been condititioned for it.

I looked at the Peggy Noonan book on Amazon and was impressed by what I saw. I'm getting ready to download it now.

Hope you like it. It's been some years since I read it -- I should probably read it again as a "vaccination" for the next two+ months.