Interested in a sorority (no sorority at my campus)

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by AnotherKD

But if any of the NPC sororities said anything about catering to the white woman, it would be absolutely ridiculous.

Ridiculous in what way?

[AnotherKD]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

Ridiculous in what way?

Well, mainly, that it's completely false. I don't see how any NPC sorority furthers any causes of (specifically) white women. Rather, simply *women*.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by AnotherKD

Well, mainly, that it's completely false. I don't see how any NPC sorority furthers any causes of (specifically) white women. Rather, simply *women*.

I completely disagree.

This has been discussed on GC over the years so I won't rehash that.

[AnotherKD]

I apologize- I don't mean to offend or to try to bring up something that has been discussed before. I guess I just thought that while I know that there are certain issues that affect women of some ethnicities, but I can't think of a single issue that only affects white women. And so I'll just leave it at that, as I really don't want to start any sort of argument.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by AnotherKD

Well, mainly, that it's completely false. I don't see how any NPC sorority furthers any causes of (specifically) white women. Rather, simply *women*.

If NPC organizations represented the needs and desires of all women, there would be no need for any other type of sorority. NPCs offer an experience that is valued by their members, who are--and have been throughout history--predominantly white. Some non-white women also appreciate what NPCs offer, so there are non-white members. However, when you get a group of predominantly non-white women together in a sorority, the organization looks different in terms of focus, opportunities, etc.

Proposing that whiteness has influenced the formation of NPC sororities and that NPC organizations are not universally and equally appealing to all sorority women shouldn't have to be ridiculous. And, it in no way diminishes the importance of NPC organizations to the progress of Greek organizations over the last century (plus).

Originally Posted by AnotherKD

I guess I just thought that while I know that there are certain issues that affect women of some ethnicities, but I can't think of a single issue that only affects white women.

Exclusion from certain issues can also be a factor in determining the direction, purpose and activities of a sorority.

[HannahXO]

However, if an NPC sorority were to advertise itself as serving the needs of white women, it would be labeled as blatantly racist. Not to dredge up a whole different argument, but there are many reasons the NPC cannot and does not label itself as such.

My take: NPC sororities offer a "traditional" sorority experience, one that began with affluent white women but is now open to all women who are looking for the specific type of sorority experience that the NPC can offer. While that may appeal predominantly to white women today, it is by no means strictly limited to white members, and NPC chapters vary in their ethnic, economic, and geographic diversity, depending on the location and demographics of the school the chapter is located.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by AnotherKD

I apologize- I don't mean to offend or to try to bring up something that has been discussed before. I guess I just thought that while I know that there are certain issues that affect women of some ethnicities, but I can't think of a single issue that only affects white women. And so I'll just leave it at that, as I really don't want to start any sort of argument.

You definitely aren't being offensive. These discussions are par for the course as far as I'm concerned.

Whether people like to admit it in "mixed company," there are issues that are considered as primarily (there's no need to say "only" as though life is so formulaic) affecting white women. Women's suffrage, women's labor rights, and women's liberation were once considered among those issues. When groups of predominantly white women (look at the photos if you don't know that) marched and spoke out for these rights, they were doing so based on their experiences and their perspectives with little consideration to what racial and ethnic minority women (and poor women) were experiencing. Some have claimed they were doing so for "all women" but that wasn't the case. I agree with people like Angela Davis and bell hooks in that regard.

The same applies to what happened with predominantly white GLOs (and nonGLOs). Organizations don't become predominantly (insert group) by accident and with no consideration to the concerns and perspectives of the majority membership. You especially don't persist in being predominantly for 50-100+ years without the concerns and perspectives of the majority being a focal point--whether blatant and based on founding purpose or just by "coincidence" and outcome.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Organizations don't become predominantly (insert group) by accident and with no consideration to the concerns and perspectives of the majority membership. You especially don't persist in being predominantly for 50-100+ years without the concerns and perspectives of the majority being a focal point--whether blatant and based on founding purpose or just by "coincidence" and outcome.

Indeed.

[Senusret I]

Traditional as in oldest and most prevalent.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by HannahXO

However, if an NPC sorority were to advertise itself as serving the needs of white women, it would be labeled as blatantly racist. Not to dredge up a whole different argument, but there are many reasons the NPC cannot and does not label itself as such.

Easy solution: Then don't advertise yourself as that.

Not wanting to formally acknowledge that isn't the same thing as not being predominantly white and not understanding that our organizations are not removed from our histories and membership demographics.

Originally Posted by HannahXO

My take: NPC sororities offer a "traditional" sorority experience, one that began with affluent white women but is now open to all women who are looking for the specific type of sorority experience that the NPC can offer. While that may appeal predominantly to white women today, it is by no means strictly limited to white members, and NPC chapters vary in their ethnic, economic, and geographic diversity, depending on the location and demographics of the school the chapter is located.

None of us are restricted to "insert group." Just like my prolific and highly acclaimed Sisterhood (and other NPHCs) has so much more going on than "predominantly African American."

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

Proposing that whiteness has influenced the formation of NPC sororities and that NPC organizations are not universally and equally appealing to all sorority women shouldn't have to be ridiculous. And, it in no way diminishes the importance of NPC organizations to the progress of Greek organizations over the last century (plus).

Indeed.

There is no stigma or insult in this discourse. NPC sororities still kickass.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

Traditional as in oldest and most prevalent.

Which makes sense, but from another perspective, "traditional" is problematic. As you know, the perceived lack of Greek realness of organizations that are not "traditional" continues to feed into the segregation of GLOs.

[Senusret I]

Yup, didn't sat it wasn't still problematic.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

Yup, didn't sat it wasn't still problematic.

Yeah, yeah. I know you acknowledged the potential inappropriateness of the term "traditional." lol

[HannahXO]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Easy solution: Then don't advertise yourself as that.

Right, that's my point. And If I were explaining what being a member of an NPC sorority was like, I would not say I was a member of a "white" sorority. I am not denying that NPCs were founded by white women, but for me personally, that has not been an integral part of my NPC experience.

None of us are restricted to "insert group." Just like my prolific and highly acclaimed Sisterhood (and other NPHCs) has so much more going on than "predominantly African American."

Of course not! All of our orgs have so much more to offer than an association with an ethnic/religious/academic/whatever group. While our founding principles are important to all of us, we shouldn't ever be limited to one aspect of our ritual/history. What I meant is that a black woman, for instance, is more than welcome to join an NPC group (officially, anyway, I realize that on some campuses that might still taboo) if that is the sort of sisterhood and sorority experience she is looking for. If an NPHC group better suits what she is looking for, then she should by all means look into NPHC intake. I guess I mean that PNMs/interests should not be limited to the greek council that predominantly shares their ethnicity, but rather should look for the type of sisterhood they want to be part of. Does that make sense? Of course, I can't speak for any org/chapter other than my own, but from what I understand and have seen in my limited experience, there are non-black members of NPHC groups, and they sought those groups out because that was the greek experience they wanted.

I am definitely not trying to say anything inflammatory/offensive, I am only trying to explain my experience and understand where other greeks are coming from! Please correct me if anything I am posting is out of line or incorrect.