Halloween hypocrites

[Ideal08]

I haven't done hardly a thing all day! Minimal amount of work. I'm not focussed, and it really needs to be Friday. Like you, I'm in weekend mode already.

I agree with everything that you said. I mean, we all have to unlearn something at some point in our lives. It sucks, because at first, you feel like you are flighty or second guessing yourself, or selling yourself out. But like you said, many of our beliefs were laid by a foundation given to us by other people. I'm still trying to unlearn some bad habits that I got from my parents. Some things just don't work, y'know? So I feel you. It's always best to be open minded. And this coming from an opinionated person like me?! I guess I'm growing. I even edited my post up there, because after I read it, I thought to myself, who do you think you are to say something like they haven't done "proper research?" That was just foul, I admit it, and I edited it out. We are definitely not in college anymore, LOL!

Next time I come to ATL, I'm bringing my honey, we can all hang out!

[Kimmie1913]

I think that sometimes there is a tension between what we know and what we believe. A Chris Rock said in the movie Dogma, a belief is a lot harder to change thatn an idea. New information helps an idea to grow while it is a challenge to a belief. As human beings, we are naturally arrogant creatures, nomatter how much we fight it. We iwill hold on to a false belief to the bitter end swearing we are right. We will quiclly deem ourselves as knowing everything at all of 18, 20, 22 years old only to realize that you could live to be 113 and only know a fraction of the world's truths.

I appreciate your post, Ideal08 because I think it shouwed that there is soetimes not only a religious reason for something but a historical, cultural and geographic one as well. As old as the BIble is and as fallable as man is, there is an undeniable interaction between all of these things. Sometimes you have to be able to see beyond to really try and learn for ourself. IN addition, I find sometimes with things like Hlloween, people who wish to distort thins furhter will take advantage and put their own spin. (Not the oriinal thread psoter- I mena those seeking to make eveything about evil ignoring all of the history and making everyting purely about evil or devil worship)

I think this has been a pretty thought provoking discussion after all.

[ChaosDST]

My family doesn't celebrate Holloween. I've only been trick-or-treating a couple of times when I was little. This isn't necessarily for "religious" purposes, but I just think the "Holi"day is stupid. Now, I watch "horror" movies like the Exorcist or Poltergeist...I don't watch unrealistic horror movies (like Scream...movies like these aren't scary anyway). Meaning, I only watch horror movies that are about supernatural things and include spirits and so forth. I do this because I believe in the existence of these entities...I'm not celebrating their existence (which is what SOME may say Holloween does). However, in the horror movies I watch, good (God) conquers evil. Given the history of Holloween, it doesn't sound like something I want my kids to participate in. I will BUY them candy and they can even dress up like their favorite superhero (not something like a witch or a monster) at SCHOOL. But, as far as their being all gun-ho about Holloween and running around saying "happy Holloween," I don't think so.

In my opinion, that's not the least bit hypocritical.

[ChaosDST]

Originally posted by HopefulProspective
Last night, my children, nephews, cousins and sister had a party for the kids that we called a "HOLY GHOST" party for the kids.

My church does that as well. There are all sorts of alternatives to Holloween. Many people only celebrate Holloween for candy...but, we should all attempt to know more about the "Holi"days our society acknowledges.

[AKA2D '91]

Halloween Hypocrites...adding more to the list.

LOL.

What's next? Thanksgiving, Christmas, Mardi Gras?

[MIDWESTDIVA]

Actually Christmas and Easter both originate in pagan beliefs as well.

There is a reason why the Bible doesn't mention that the people celebrate Jesus' birth, or death and resurrection. There is a reason why Santa, elves, evergreen trees, rabbits and colored eggs are associated with these days. There is a reason why most Christians worship on Sunday instead of the true sabbath, Saturday. Most people don't bother to question anything. They just do what has always been done without giving it any thought.

[ChaosDST]

Originally posted by MIDWESTDIVA
Actually Christmas and Easter both originate in pagan beliefs as well.

There is a reason why the Bible doesn't mention that the people celebrate Jesus' birth, or death and resurrection. There is a reason why Santa, elves, evergreen trees, rabbits and colored eggs are associated with these days. There is a reason why most Christians worship on Sunday instead of the true sabbath, Saturday. Most people don't bother to question anything. They just do what has always been done without giving it any thought.

I am not familiar with the pagan beliefs associated with Christmas and Easter...are you speaking of the Holidays themselves and how they are celebrated today? If so, I don't celebrate Christmas and Easter as most do...with Santa, easter bunny, Christmas tree, etc....in my opinion, that's commercialism.

[SoTrue1920]

From http://altreligion.about.com. I apologize in advance for the length:.

Origins of Christmas Symbols
It's true: most of our secular Christmas traditions have Pagan roots...

The Christmas tree... lights in every window.... a wreath on the door.... these and other symbols of the Christmas season are so strongly tied to the holiday that we recognize them at any time during the year. But many of these symbols and traditions originated from a much earlier time, some as long ago as 5,000 years in the past. These traditions are still alive because they typify the reason for celebration, both in the Christmas tradition and the earlier rites: rebirth and everlasting life.

The Christmas Tree and Evergreens
The christmas tree is perhaps the most potent of the many Christmas symbols. Modern Christmas trees were introduced to the court of Queen Victoria by her husband, Prince Albert, as a custom from his native Germany. The tradition decorating with evergreen trees and boughs, however, originates from the ancient pagan cultures. Many cultures saw the evergreen, one of few plants to remain green even in winter, as a symbol of life even during the season of death. To decorate with the trees and branches of the evergreen was a way of celebrating this eternal life.

Holly and Ivy
Although holly is the only remaining tradition of this once famous duo, the origins of both plants' use during the holiday season is ancient. Romans were quite fond of holly during their Solstice celebration, known as the Saturnalia. Gifts of holly were exchanged during this time, as holly was believed to ward off lightning and evil spirits. Holly was also seen as a symbol of the feminine aspect, the red berries signifying the blood of the female. Ivy was seen to represent the masculine, and the ancient custom of decorating the doorway with the two plants entertwined was a symbolic union of the two halves of divinity.

Christmas Lights and Candles
Christmas falls very close to the Winter Solstice, the time when sunlight and the day are at their shortest. Ancient peoples often associated this with a 'dying' of the sun, and the festival of Solstice as a celebration for the rebirth as the days following the Solstice became progressively longer again. Candles were an integral part of this celebration, as symbols of the sun's light and the new solar year . Electric lights became quite popular in the early 20th century as a substitute for candles, for obvious safety benefits. (Imagine the fires started by candles placed lovingly on a cut tree.)

Presents
Presents have been a common theme of Solstice and Yule celebrations for thousands of years. The Saturnalia in Rome was celebrated as the beginning of the New Year, and the revelers gave presents to symbolize the good luck, prosperity, and happiness that they wished for the recipient during the coming year. Christian tradition ties the giving of gifts to the Magi which visited the Christ child shortly after his birth, bringing gifts to the future Savior.

Mistletoe
Mistletoe, and it's tradition of affection, have a long and varied history. Celtic peoples believed that mistletoe was a strong charm against lightning, thunder, and other evils. The Druids would harvest the plant five days after the new moon following the Winter Solstice from sacred oak trees. Norse peoples also saw the plant as sacred. Warriors who met under the plant would not fight, but maintained a truce until the next day. Other european cultures viewed mistletoe as an aphrodisiac, explaining the custom of 'kissing under the mistletoe'.

Santa Claus
Last but not least, Santa Claus is perhaps the most recognizable of the many symbols of Christmas. Our version of Santa is an amalgamation of several characters from around the world, including St. Nick from the Dutch, Father Christmas from the English, and Kris Kringle from Germany. Almost all of these figures had pagan roots. Norse and Germanic peoples have for centuries told stories of the Yule Elf, who brings presents on the Solstice to those who leave offerings of porridge. Odin, the Norse god, is also often identified with the character of Santa. One of his titles was Jolnir, "Lord of the Yule", and the resemblance to the white-bearded Santa is quite striking.

[SoTrue1920]

For the sake of brevity, I won't post the entire articles here. If you're interested in some information about some Easter traditions and their Pagan roots, see the following links:

The Call of Spring: Rites for the Equinox:
http://altreligion.about.com/library...y/aa031199.htm

Easter/Ostara: The Pagan Origins of a Christian Holiday:
http://paganwiccan.about.com/library.../aa031001a.htm

[Ideal08]

Originally posted by ChaosDST



I am not familiar with the pagan beliefs associated with Christmas and Easter...are you speaking of the Holidays themselves and how they are celebrated today? If so, I don't celebrate Christmas and Easter as most do...with Santa, easter bunny, Christmas tree, etc....in my opinion, that's commercialism.

When I was in high school, a Nation of Islam Muslim gave me a pamphlet about Easter being a pagan holiday. I was so scared, it just seemed blasphemous to me at the time, I read it, but I didn't retain any of the information. I do remember that, though. Plus, I wasn't trying to hear him, lol, I was born on Easter Sunday.

[DELTAQTE]

CODEBLU WHY ARE YOU YELLING? MY GOODNESS!


I feel as long as I teach my kids what's right and wrong from the get go, Halloween, nor any other holiday will be a problem. It's the same thing with that Harry Potter mess and how folks see that as evil. Kids only have a short time to be kids, I don't want to take away any fun filled memories from my child(when I have one)

That is just my opinion of course!


QTE

[lovelyivy84]

Originally posted by DELTAQTE
CODEBLU WHY ARE YOU YELLING? MY GOODNESS!


I feel as long as I teach my kids what's right and wrong from the get go, Halloween, nor any other holiday will be a problem. It's the same thing with that Harry Potter mess and how folks see that as evil. Kids only have a short time to be kids, I don't want to take away any fun filled memories from my child(when I have one)

That is just my opinion of course!


QTE

The Harry Potter controversy was so funny to me- I mean, the Onion prints a made-up story mocking people who think the story is about evil, and the next thing I know it is posted all around the internet with people, none of whom actually read the books using it as a catalyst to protest.

Doh!

ANyway, I just wanted to thank you ladies for the great info that many of you have posted on this thread. I really love Halloween. I am one of those who was brought up thinking it was a day to celebrate ancestors and those who have gone before. I never got what was so evil about lil kids going and getting candy! I had sooo much fun as a child doing it, and it's still a favorite holiday for me, just to see all of the little kids out having such a good time- as long as they're careful of course.