Mutual Selection in Formal Recruitment: Not So Mutual? For PNMs and Parents.

[FleurGirl]

Originally Posted by 33girl

The thing is...I'd hate to encourage girls to think "those snobby bitches didn't like me so forget them!" but on the other hand, to be TOO positive could make a rushee think "I just have to try extra hard, and they will bid me next semester/year." It's a hard line to walk, and I don't know how people do it.

That's where it's helpful to think in terms of "fit". It's a lot like trying on shoes. They can be the cutest, most amazing shoes you've ever seen in your life but if it hurts like hell to stand up in them and they're too sizes too big, it doesn't matter how wonderful they are. Some people won't fit into certain chapters, and that's fine. But are you going to cut off your big toe to wedge your foot into those special shoes? No. And a PNM shouldn't want to be a part of a chapter that doesn't fit her right. Encouraging PNMs to find a chapter that they can see themselves living with and growing with usually works a lot better than trying to squeeze into something all wrong just because it's supposedly "better".

[KSUViolet06]

^^^I think "fit" is kind of hard to determine when you're dealing with a chapter that has like 75+ women.

That's why I take issue sometimes with PNMs saying "Well I just didn't feel like I fit there."

Um, that chapter has 150 women. How does one "not fit" with 150 people?

Or "This chapter is all _______." The more people there are in a group, the less likely it is that they're all ___________. Ex: You can't really say that XYZ is "all athletes" when it has 130 women.

Even on the chapter's end, the larger the chapter is, the less likely it is that you were cut because you don't "fit." Especially if you're cut like, the first round.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

^^^I think "fit" is kind of hard to determine when you're dealing with a chapter that has like 75+ women.

That's why I take issue sometimes with PNMs saying "Well I just didn't feel like I fit there."

Um, that chapter has 150 women. How does one "not fit" with 150 people?

Or "This chapter is all _______." The more people there are in a group, the less likely it is that they're all ___________. Ex: You can't really say that XYZ is "all athletes" when it has 130 women.

Even on the chapter's end, the larger the chapter is, the less likely it is that you were cut because you don't "fit." Especially if you're cut like, the first round.

Yup. You just didn't make an impression on them they way other women did.

[BraveMaroon]

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

That's why I take issue sometimes with PNMs saying "Well I just didn't feel like I fit there."

Um, that chapter has 150 women. How does one "not fit" with 150 people?

Or "This chapter is all _______." The more people there are in a group, the less likely it is that they're all ___________. Ex: You can't really say that XYZ is "all athletes" when it has 130 women.

A million times this! I honestly believe that if you had put all the sororities on my campus in a hat and pulled one at random, I could have joined and been completely fine.

What I loved about my sorority experience is that we had every kind of sister in the house, so if you wanted to party, or study, or worship, or watch movies - there was always someone there who was up for that.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by BraveMaroon

A million times this! I honestly believe that if you had put all the sororities on my campus in a hat and pulled one at random, I could have joined and been completely fine.

Obligatory: What if I end up in Slytherin?

[BraveMaroon]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Obligatory: What if I end up in Slytherin?

Perhaps you should consult your Rho Chi.

Or, you know - drop out and start your own sorority.

[carnation]

Y'all know the Pottermore game site? You would not believe how many people there get sorted into Slytherin and ask if they can be re-sorted. Therefore, the site has an information page that says that no one will be re-sorted, that the Hat's decision is final. As you can guess, many people re-register on the site under a different name and provide different answers to the questions.

It would be kind of a shock to do that and be put into Slytherin again.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by BraveMaroon

A million times this! I honestly believe that if you had put all the sororities on my campus in a hat and pulled one at random, I could have joined and been completely fine.

What I loved about my sorority experience is that we had every kind of sister in the house, so if you wanted to party, or study, or worship, or watch movies - there was always someone there who was up for that.

Exactly. I can say the same about my own chapter and we had maybe 60ish.

I find that the only time the "I don't fit" thing is valid, is when you're dealing with chapters of like 30 women. I might buy it if you were rushing at a school like one of the chapters I work with, where there are 3 chapters and they're all 30 or fewer members. There is a definite possibility that the chapters have a very distinct identity because there are so few people.

Other than that, no.

[kaeb]

At USC, my impression of FR is that unless you're one of a few select "hot ticket" PNMs (in which case all the power is in your hands), the balance of power lies overwhelmingly with the sororities. Few women have a full schedule, much less one with all the houses they wanted, for every round of recruitment.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by kaeb

At USC, my impression of FR is that unless you're one of a few select "hot ticket" PNMs (in which case all the power is in your hands), the balance of power lies overwhelmingly with the sororities. Few women have a full schedule, much less one with all the houses they wanted, for every round of recruitment.

I think your perception is skewed since I highly doubt you've seen every PNMs invite list. This stuff functions like a bell curve. The chapters and PNMs both fall on that curve in relation to recruiting power. The chapters rarely get every PNM they want for every party, either. It's recruitment. You pick up and move on with what you have.

[ForeverRoses]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

I think your perception is skewed since I highly doubt you've seen every PNMs invite list. This stuff functions like a bell curve. The chapters and PNMs both fall on that curve in relation to recruiting power. The chapters rarely get every PNM they want for every party, either. It's recruitment. You pick up and move on with what you have.

This. a million times this.

And with a large recruitment, I would love to tell PNMs not to take the cuts personally (which I know is really hard - if not impossible - to do). But honestly, sometimes it is just a numbers game- we HAVE to get from 1600 women down to 50.

[kaeb]

true, but among most of my friends to whom I've spoken in other houses, it seems like they would get maybe 5/6 houses for house tours, 3/4 for slideshow, and two/two for pref—and usually at least one of their ranked houses (i.e. the ones they would want to drop if they were invited back to all their top choice, unranked houses) for house tours, and possibly for slideshow and/or pref. Obviously there's variation from PNM to PNM, no one has the same experience, and I've only talked to some of my friends, but that's been my impression for the most part.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by kaeb

true, but among most of my friends to whom I've spoken in other houses, it seems like they would get maybe 5/6 houses for house tours, 3/4 for slideshow, and two/two for pref—and usually at least one of their ranked houses (i.e. the ones they would want to drop if they were invited back to all their top choice, unranked houses) for house tours, and possibly for slideshow and/or pref. Obviously there's variation from PNM to PNM, no one has the same experience, and I've only talked to some of my friends, but that's been my impression for the most part.

That's anecdotal. Realize that SOMEONE is getting into the "good" chapters.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

I think your perception is skewed since I highly doubt you've seen every PNMs invite list. This stuff functions like a bell curve. The chapters and PNMs both fall on that curve in relation to recruiting power. The chapters rarely get every PNM they want for every party, either. It's recruitment. You pick up and move on with what you have.

YES. The bell curve.

The issue? The average PNM perceives that she is in that top percentile end of the curve, when she's really very much in the bell.

If could tell any PNM any one thing (without them being offended) it would be that you are far less desirable than you think are. Sad but true.

This is not to say that no one is going to want you. But again, expectations v. reality.

[kaeb]

no, this is even among my friends in the "top" houses. I can think of only two or three girls tops out of everyone I know who rushed who got a full schedule of the houses they wanted every day.

I'm not speaking out of bitterness at my own experience with FR. I now realize I was at the bottom of the bell curve (though I, self-inflating as PNMs are wont to do, would have put myself in the middle, but the results indicate otherwise), and I'm very happy with where I am now—just ask literally any of my sisters. I'm just stating my observations of our formal recruitment. As an outsider (for now).

I agree with KSUViolet, every girl whose self-confidence is strong enough to get her into and through formal recruitment at USC is going to have a pretty high opinion of herself, and think she has more power than she actually does in the selection process (except for in the case of the few "hot ticket" PNMs).

To illustrate the general point I'm trying to make, here's an example.
For convo days, PNM visits houses Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Delta, Epsilon, Zeta, Eta, Theta, and Iota. A-D are "top" houses, and interchangeable, depending on the PNM's personality and the girls she talks to at the house. Epsilon, Zeta, and Eta are "middle" houses (again, interchangeable, like with A-D), and Theta and Iota are also more or less interchangeable with each other. She loves Alpha-Zeta, and says those are the houses she wants to go back to for house tours, and she'd prefer to drop Eta, Theta, and Iota. The next day, she receives her schedule: Beta, Delta, Epsilon, Theta, and Iota. Five out a possible six. She's been dropped by four houses, three of which she wanted to keep (so she's been dropped by half the houses she wanted to go back to). Again, she tries to drop Theta and Iota. She gets asked back to Delta, Epsilon, and Iota (three out of a possible four), eventually pledging Delta or Epsilon, after getting invited to pref with could be any two of the above three.

That seems like a pretty normal recruitment at SC to me (nothing like my own, fwiw, but like what my friends experienced), and one that is in the houses' favor over the PNMs'. But maybe I'll reevaluate after I participate in formal on the sister side.

I'm sure everyone else will disagree with me and prove me wrong because I don't know as much as they do, but these are just my observations, with my opinion tacked on.