Schools where you absolutely positively need recs

[33girl]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

I thought that more orgs had this rule than didn't. Ultimately, though, any alum can write a rec for any woman. Most chapters have alums on hand during recruitment. Ergo...

(sorry, double-post)

Honestly, it's probably about 50/50...and I never saw an alum of any of our groups (except for the group that had the first chapter sister on the roll, who was a professor, as an advisor) anywhere near rush.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Honestly, it's probably about 50/50...and I never saw an alum of any of our groups (except for the group that had the first chapter sister on the roll, who was a professor, as an advisor) anywhere near rush.

Your chapter advisor wasn't involved with rush?

[33girl]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Your chapter advisor wasn't involved with rush?

Good God, no. We had to have a faculty member as our advisor - regardless of whether they were Greek or not. She was nice but clueless. But as a nonmember, she obviously had zero say in membership selection (as it should be). The most she may have done was pick up the bid list, and that was hit or miss depending on her schedule - miss more than hit. This was before the days of alumnae advisory boards (or should I say before the days of the concept of an alumnae advisory board, whether or not it actually occurs).

[wildcass]

I'm at an SEC school and we've never discussed recs. Makes me wonder which chapters do and which chapters don't? Definitely not 100% necessary though or I wouldn't have gotten a bid.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by wildcass

I'm at an SEC school and we've never discussed recs. Makes me wonder which chapters do and which chapters don't? Definitely not 100% necessary though or I wouldn't have gotten a bid.

Where do you go to school? There are a couple like maybe UK where they're very much encouraged, but you may have a chance to get a bid without them. Definitely not so for all of them though. For example, I'd NEVER tell a PNM at say, Ole Miss that they weren't needed.

[DubaiSis]

I have wondered, and this is just speculation not any sort of background knowledge, if some chapters who have in the past considered them mandatory won't be diminishing their importance. If EVERYONE has them, then they really don't have any value except in the case where it is a GLOWING recommendation full of information the chapter wouldn't otherwise know. At these particular schools, it's been discussed ad nauseum about how the chapter has a good idea of who they want before rush even starts, that if every girl in the chapter has only 1 girl they want and are prepared to fight for, that's 3 X quota without a single girl walking through the door. Doesn't that make the hassle of processing recs kind of time consuming and superflouous?

[Old_Row]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

I have wondered, and this is just speculation not any sort of background knowledge, if some chapters who have in the past considered them mandatory won't be diminishing their importance. If EVERYONE has them, then they really don't have any value except in the case where it is a GLOWING recommendation full of information the chapter wouldn't otherwise know. At these particular schools, it's been discussed ad nauseum about how the chapter has a good idea of who they want before rush even starts, that if every girl in the chapter has only 1 girl they want and are prepared to fight for, that's 3 X quota without a single girl walking through the door. Doesn't that make the hassle of processing recs kind of time consuming and superflouous?

Really the benefit to the chapter is having them early enough to get an idea of who the PNM is, pair her with the right active during first round and make a quick judgement about each PNM when you have so little time to meet them and so many to cut first round. In my experience it's not like you're literally sitting around and saying "no rec! no second round for you!" but if a PNM doesn't have have one then she isn't going to get much attention at most houses. If someone gets a no rec, or has one written by someone very important, or if there's something funny or unusual about it like her photo or the fact that she had 28 recs come in, then that might be discussed.

Also it isn't completely unusual for a PNM who thinks she doesn't have a rec to actually have one. Alumnae will automatically write them for hometown girls they know and like without the girl asking or knowing. She may think she got a bid without a rec but it really was there.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Old_Row

Really the benefit to the chapter is having them early enough to get an idea of who the PNM is, pair her with the right active during first round and make a quick judgement about each PNM when you have so little time to meet them and so many to cut first round. In my experience it's not like you're literally sitting around and saying "no rec! no second round for you!" but if a PNM doesn't have have one then she isn't going to get much attention at most houses. If someone gets a no rec, or has one written by someone very important, or if there's something funny or unusual about it like her photo or the fact that she had 28 recs come in, then that might be discussed.

Also it isn't completely unusual for a PNM who thinks she doesn't have a rec to actually have one. Alumnae will automatically write them for hometown girls they know and like without the girl asking or knowing. She may think she got a bid without a rec but it really was there.

Totally agree with the bold part. Just because you didn't secure your own rec, doesn't mean you didn't have one.

Just generally on the topic of what chapter members know about recs:

My understanding of what I was supposed to know about recruitment and membership selection is tainted by my not having always paid attention when I should have at chapter and by some other unusual circumstances involved in being a spring pledge who didn't initially make grades, in addition to it having been more than 20 years ago (gulp). I know what I do now about MS in my own organization from talking to current advisors when I was trying to figure out how to write the most helpful recommendations for the chapters.

I sometimes wonder what the average chapter member at a big recruitment knows about the invite list these days, especially in the era of release figures.

One other thing: I'm afraid that hopeful PNMs and their moms take away the impression here that having a rec at a competitive recruitment does more than it can. The majority of PNM are going to have positive recs at competitive recruitment, just as they have amazing resumes and grades. A positive rec isn't probably going to set you apart that much. It just saves you from being in the pool who doesn't even have that.

[carnation]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

One other thing: I'm afraid that hopeful PNMs and their moms take away the impression here that having a rec at a competitive recruitment does more than it can. The majority of PNM are going to have positive recs at competitive recruitment, just as they have amazing resumes and grades. A positive rec isn't probably going to set you apart that much. It just saves you from being in the pool who doesn't even have that.

Yes! Yes!

Originally Posted by Old_Row

"no rec! no second round for you!"

Oh nooooo, you have started something that's going to last in my family for YEARS!!!!

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

One other thing: I'm afraid that hopeful PNMs and their moms take away the impression here that having a rec at a competitive recruitment does more than it can. The majority of PNM are going to have positive recs at competitive recruitment, just as they have amazing resumes and grades. A positive rec isn't probably going to set you apart that much. It just saves you from being in the pool who doesn't even have that.

It's like applying at a Fortune 500 company.

Every applicant will have an MBA. That's standard.

It's not going to really set you apart as this amazing candidate.

It just keeps your resume in the game and out of the "NO!" pile.

[SoCalGirl]

It falls into the same issue as rec vs no rec, right? If 900 girls have recs and 700 of those have > or = 2, you better have at least 2.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by SoCalGirl

It falls into the same issue as rec vs no rec, right? If 900 girls have recs and 700 of those have > or = 2, you better have at least 2.

No, it's not that clear cut. It depends how well you know the rec writers and what they have to say. A second rec written by a random alumna you met through the local AA doesn't really mean all that much.

[UGAgirl93]

I will be going through FR in a few weeks at an SEC school (I'm sure you can tell which one). I am a legacy to one sorority there and have secured three letters of recommendation for that particular sorority (as well as recommendations for others, including other multiples). I know that you girls cannot predict the future and cannot give out information on membership selection, but without getting into the secretive stuff I was wondering if my legacy status in combination with multiple good recs would even get me noticed at that sorority. I know that at a school with a very competitive recruitment like mine, being a legacy doesn't mean a whole lot and having a rec is standard, so I'm just curious about how much it'll help. I know it can't hurt!

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by UGAgirl93

I will be going through FR in a few weeks at an SEC school (I'm sure you can tell which one). I am a legacy to one sorority there and have secured three letters of recommendation for that particular sorority (as well as recommendations for others, including other multiples). I know that you girls cannot predict the future and cannot give out information on membership selection, but without getting into the secretive stuff I was wondering if my legacy status in combination with multiple good recs would even get me noticed at that sorority. I know that at a school with a very competitive recruitment like mine, being a legacy doesn't mean a whole lot and having a rec is standard, so I'm just curious about how much it'll help. I know it can't hurt!

Typically, it would mean you'll get at least a courtesy invitation to the first invitational round, but if the number of legacies going through is too high (and it often is for certain groups at UGA), it may not even mean that.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Typically, it would mean you'll get at least a courtesy invitation to the first invitational round, but if the number of legacies going through is too high (and it often is for certain groups at UGA), it may not even mean that.

Wowza. Are you speculating about this maybe happening some day or have release figures gotten so tight at some chapters at UGA that we know of legacies that the chapters didn't even carry to second round?

Sometimes I think I basically understand the implications of policies, and then new stuff hits me each year.

How tight are the numbers with RFM? Let's say 1200 go through at UGA and Group A has a 100% return rate. About how many women to they get to ask to second round?