Your thoughts on AI: discussion goes here.

[ReachTheLimit]

I don't want to post anything more than the fact that I have begun the process and the first contact has already been made and a first meeting has already been set up.

I will say, that I initiated the contact with this particular GLO, but when I sent National a letter, I also sent them all of the positions I had in college, what I was doing with my career, why I wanted to AI, and more importantly, WHAT I planned to do for them if I was admitted as a member.

I also said why I selected them, because there was a very particular reason, why they were selected.

As far as an AI forum, it's kind of in the same catagory with me for people who are anti-gay: If you don't like gays, don't hang around with gays.

If you don't like the AI forum, you don't have to "support" it on the forum.

Just my .02

[ms_gwyn]

I don't like getting into the argument b/c I don't like getting ganged up on, plain and simple.

My views on AI are very clearly documented on GC and I really don't care if I am considered one of those PNAM that "shopped" if you look at a lot of threads started in 2003, it would seem that they "shopped" as well, whatever, this will be my first and last post on this subject in this thread.

I like the forum, I would like for it to stay, its the pettiness that gets me and some of the hypocrites, I get a kick out of as well.

Just because I don't post my opinions doesn't mean that I don't have them, but most of the recent threads have turned into trainwreaks.

I really have nothing more to add....

gwyn

[Drolefille]

I feel like the sane people asking for moderation and not 100% one way or the other are being ignored in the hard core fight going on.

I don't think it's all or nothing (and I include immediate lockage in the nothing category). But I wrote a lovely post on that which was sadly ignored due to other rantings. I hope it at least made sense. I don't advocate shopping etc. but as long as there are threads on GC about AI, there will be discussion of AI and people who come here because of AI. Unless you strip all of that out of the old threads, it's not going to change much.

I don't feel like it should be a forbidden topic. And I think we should be allowed to discourage or encourage people as appropriate. Even if the subforum were to be deleted, I think discussion should occur in the Alumni Involvement forum as before the subforum's creation.

[greekalum]

Wellllllllll.... if some AIs want to post threads in the Alumni Involvement forum about things like, "What is your interaction with your alumnae group like as an AI"? I think that would be appropriate, but what I think would be more appropriate would be for them to just post in the regular threads discussing alum issues since they are, once initiated, just like anyone else.

People who are SEEKING AI are not alums of anything. I don't think they fit in the Alumni Involvement forum.

There is no discreet, tactful way to run a thread in which you are shopping for an organization to join as an alum. So I don't think we need a place for it. ReachTheLimit's post about what she is doing was about as appropriate as can be, but I don't know that what she posted needs *discussion*. If she does become an AI, she can post about her experience in that organization's subforum, where she would be welcomed.

[Drolefille]

Theoretically most things on here don't "need" discussion. Someone coming to GC may be looking for support among people who "get" Greek-ness (whereas her family/friends may not) or they may have been on GC already and want everyone to know.

Tell me you've never posted something in nervous anticipation about it... it's a message board not a deep meaningful discussion board.

People seeking AI should be able to post what they wish without getting shut down. They aren't posting membership information and they aren't posting ritual. They may be indiscreet, but they are not in violation of the TOS. I also think that people should be able to encourage and discourage them as they wish without either side getting into a huge fight on EVERY thread. Perhaps this thread could then stay open to take the fights to.

I don't know. I don't think the subforum is the problem. I think the polarization of the GC membership is.

[UGAalum94]

I'll answer any questions that I can. I'm waiting to find out what you want to know. If you want a general overview, go to the Alpha Gamma Delta section and look at the Quarterly link.

My plan was to quit reading this thread, so I didn't expect to know what your questions were, so I wanted you to alert me by PM.

What do you want to know?

Originally Posted by valkyrie

This has happened at least twice. Why are you entitled to know who?

I think it's kind of lame that I asked that alphagamoochagoo or whatever her name is several questions and then she decided to demand that any questions to her be taken to PM. I guess she can't answer them.

[Tom Earp]

Originally Posted by kdonline

For the record, I'd like the AI forum to stay.

...on the condition that these people are told BY THE MODS or in PM to contact the sorority directly. Then the thread is closed. End of Story.

But I know that some oh-so-helpful GCers will turn any seemingly innocent question into a knock-down. This should not happen.

So, quick moderation (meaning, delete any posts in reply to the original poster and then a thread lock) will get the message across this Alumnae Initiation is not discussed on greekchat.

A thread would have 2-3 msgs, max. One from the original poster, then the Mod one saying "go private" and then the original poster saying "kthx - see you in a PM!" Then LOCKED.

There are 2 experienced mods to this forum, and both are online quite often. Why can't this be done?

That way, we all can be happy.

Yes there are as you said, two current Mods who are very good.

AI will not go hide ina corner because some want to wave the fairy wand and and make it go away.

Some are for and some are against! Go figure?

It is happening and that is a fact, period.

It may not be common , but who knows later.

If I were some of the fine Ladies who have AIed and are called Shoppers or hungry to live the good old days, I would consider this a slap in the face!

Some of them have worked long, and hard to become Members. They have also been very important members of those Sororitys and have worked extemely hard. Oh, give them another slap in the face for doing this.

Do any of you know except what they posted and the reasons that they could not for what ever reason?

NO. You went through undergrad rush.

I will gaurentee you one thing, they went through a heck of alot more than any of you ever thought about!

Do not give Me any respect, but do not disrespect them as many of you are doing!

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by valkyrie

You're only speaking about AI information related to your organization and not others, right? Let's say that I do not want AI information related to my organization posted on GC. How would you answer the following questions:

Are our opinions enough? What if another AGD who posts here disagrees with you and thinks no AGD AI information should be posted on GC?

Should members of our respective organizations vote on the AI-GC issue? Who is qualified to render an opinion -- all members? AIs? Officers? Who makes that determination? If sorority XYZ decides it does not want any discussion of its AI process discussed on GC, who monitors that? The moderators of this forum, even if they're not members of XYZ? How is that appropriate?

Are these the questions you meant? If so, I thought I had answered them. I think that the moderators of the GLOs forums could, by following GLO policy, decide what stays or goes. I think I've always been clear that group policies should be honored and that group members best know what the policies are. BUT if no group policy exists, it's just a matter of personal preference, and for me, I'd always err on the side of allowing people to post what they want to.

If it's not a matter of GLO policy, then isn't a question of personal preference and opinion? Aren't opinions allowed to vary?

As much as some of us might like to stop people from embarassing themselves or their groups, unless there's a specific policy against what they are saying, I don't think you can.

[adpiucf]

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

Yes there are as you said, two current Mods who are very good.

AI will not go hide ina corner because some want to wave the fairy wand and and make it go away.

Some are for and some are against! Go figure?

It is happening and that is a fact, period.

It may not be common , but who knows later.

If I were some of the fine Ladies who have AIed and are called Shoppers or hungry to live the good old days, I would consider this a slap in the face!

Some of them have worked long, and hard to become Members. They have also been very important members of those Sororitys and have worked extemely hard. Oh, give them another slap in the face for doing this.

Do any of you know except what they posted and the reasons that they could not for what ever reason?

NO. You went through undergrad rush.

I will gaurentee you one thing, they went through a heck of alot more than any of you ever thought about!

Do not give Me any respect, but do not disrespect them as many of you are doing!

No one is against AI, we are against an AI Forum. No one has disrespected any member who is an AI because of her initiation as an alumna. I am not quite sure why you insist otherwise.

Yes, we went through undergraduate recruitment. You know, the FUTURE of our organizations is undergraduate recruitment, don't you?

To assert that those who have successfully AI'd went through more than those who went through undergraduate recruitment undermines the purpose of AI and covers those who pursued collegiate membership with an unfair blanket statement. I am sure there are plenty of alumnae members who went through formal recruitment or COR more than once, or experienced uncomfortable situations in their life that were more extenuating than waiting to hear back from a SORORITY to see if they'd been granted membership.

For the record, many of us worked long and hard for our membership (founding a colony, building a house, establishing a new program, serving on an exec., working two jobs in addition to school to pay dues and enjoy membership are just some examples).

AI isn't recruitment, Tom. It's an honor for those with a connection to a sorority and those women don't need to jump through hoops because they've been invited through the proper channels as a way to honor them for their service. AI doesn't exist to fulfill a need of regrets past or to make up for not sucessfully initiating in undergrad.

Tom, I simply don't understand what makes a grown man, a fraternity alumni, so passionate about the goings-on of a women's association. I'm sorry you weren't able to manage this forum when it was under your moderation. I think PT and carnation have been doing a very good job since they took it over, but the point remains that several members just don't want an AI forum and wish for our AI sisters to acclimate to their sororities by conducting their posts and stories within their sorority forums.

ETA: I in no way construe the above to be a violation of the TOS or a personal attack against Tom Earp. My stating that he was not able to moderate this forum previously is a matter of fact, and not opinion, or moderation of the forum would not have been turned over to another set of moderators. I hope it is not seen as a TOS violation. It was not intended as such.

[greekalum]

Originally Posted by adpiucf

several members just don't want an AI forum and wish for our AI sisters to acclimate to their sororities by conducting their posts and stories within their sorority forums.

Several=the vast majority of those who have expressed an opinion.

And I think the rest of your sentence there bears repeating- those of us whose organizations have members who have joined via AI want them to join us as full fledged sisters in the real world and on GC! They do not need a separate forum because they are not separate or second-class members.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

BUT if no group policy exists, it's just a matter of personal preference, and for me, I'd always err on the side of allowing people to post what they want to.

So if you're not sure if something in your GLO is Ritual, you'd rather err on the side of "well, I don't know if this is ritual, so I'll just tell my friend who's an XYZ anyway"?

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

So if you're not sure if something in your GLO is Ritual, you'd rather err on the side of "well, I don't know if this is ritual, so I'll just tell my friend who's an XYZ anyway"?

No! When something is ritual, it's ritual; it's not a matter of opinion. If you aren't sure, you shouldn't tell.

But in cases when it's not ritual, and there's no GLO policy about discussing the issue, then it don't think that some members of the group should limit other members of the group's discussion of the issue.

(In your example though, are you suggesting that two initiated members of the same group can't discuss ritual or things that might be ritual in person? I'm not sure exactly what you mean.)

[Tom Earp]

I have seen it posted many times that AIing is part of Ritual. Since when?

It is new recruitment process and has nothing to do with Ritual which is part of indoctranation in Initiation.

While it may not be what the undergraduates go thrhough, it is still a feeling process by Alums who are considering someone and that is all.




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adpiucf:


Tom, I simply don't understand what makes a grown man, a fraternity alumni, so passionate about the goings-on of a women's association. I'm sorry you weren't able to manage this forum when it was under your moderation. I think PT and carnation have been doing a very good job since they took it over, but the point remains that several members just don't want an AI forum and wish for our AI sisters to acclimate to their sororities by conducting their posts and stories within their sorority forums.

ETA: I in no way construe the above to be a violation of the TOS or a personal attack against Tom Earp. My stating that he was not able to moderate this forum previously is a matter of fact, and not opinion, or moderation of the forum would not have been turned over to another set of moderators. I hope it is not seen as a TOS violation. It was not intended as such.


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You may not understand why I post what I do but, it is my decission to isnt it.
It is not just about the she of the specie but the he also.

It is also about an open web site for Greeks. So, lets burn the books and then what?

The previous AI post was a much bigger proble
m than just understanding and I think John also realized this.


Now I am not sure what rock you have been hidding under, but the new Mods have also gotten flack about AI.

They are working very hard to keep it under control, but some seem to not want to allow them to do their Over Paid Jobs.

Can I relate, yes as I have told them many times and I feel for them.

If you and all of the rest want to talk about My Moderation feel free, but did I get much help? NO!

[chitownxo]

[QUOTE=Tom Earp;1334815]I have seen it posted many times that AIing is part of Ritual. Since when?
It is new recruitment process and has nothing to do with Ritual which is part of indoctranation in Initiation.

Tom, recruitment has ALWAYS been a part of ritual. In my organization, we do not discuss how we select our members. It is part of our shared ritual. Simply put, the recruitment party itself may not be considered ritual, the recruitment process (i.e. membership selection) certainly is. I will not tell non Chi Omegas how we select our undergraduate sisters; why would I tell someone how we select AIs?

[greekalum]

Apparently it's a "feeling process," chitownxo.

Thanks a lot for letting that one out of the bag, Tom. The real reason most NPC members don't want AI procedures posted here is because we choose AIs by groping them like melons.