Tom Cruise & Katie Holmes

[Lady Pi Phi]

Originally posted by FSUZeta
has anyone else commented on katie holmes escort on the european tour who is a scientology member? reminds me of old shows where someone falls prey to a cult and then the victim is always under the watchful eye of cult members. creepy!!

Yep! I mentioned that earlier in this thread. Tom has hired a full time female minder for Katie.

Definitely creepy.

I still want to see War of the Worlds, but that's because I am a Spielberg fan. I could care less that Tom Cruise is in it.

I'd love to boycott all things starring Scietology members, but that means I can't watch any of my shows anymore like "That '70s show" and "Fat Actress".

[starryeyed]

Originally posted by ariesrising
Tom Cruise is a total joke. An arrogant, pompous ass, and I hope his career tanks and L. Ron Hubbard runs off with all his money.

I LOVE IT!

[moe.ron]

L. Ron Hubbard is with the aliens now.

[33girl]

Originally posted by Lady Pi Phi
I'd love to boycott all things starring Scietology members, but that means I can't watch any of my shows anymore like "That '70s show" and "Fat Actress".

Who in That 70's Show is a Scientologist?

Oh and the LM Presley thing is so not true. I stole Nicolas Cage from her.

[midwesterngirl]

Originally posted by 33girl
Who in That 70's Show is a Scientologist?

Oh and the LM Presley thing is so not true. I stole Nicolas Cage from her.

Its Danny Masterson (Hyde).

[sigmadiva]

I think on the Today show tomorrow they are going to show Matt Lauer and Tom going at each other over the use of medication to treat psychological disorders. I've seen a clip of it and Tom looks tired and strung out.

[midwesterngirl]

Originally posted by sigmadiva
I think on the Today show tomorrow they are going to show Matt Lauer and Tom going at each other over the use of medication to treat psychological disorders. I've seen a clip of it and Tom looks tired and strung out.

I read a transcript and I could not believe it. To see that ignorant little moronic high school dropout pontificating to Matt about the use of anti depressants drugs just turned my stomach. If there were someone in need of said drugs it is certainly Tom.

[AOIIBrandi]

Originally posted by AOII_LB93

Scientology is odd. My mom used to work with them back when she was in the computer biz and sold them tons of computer equipment. She said they were very secretive and there were places in their compound type thing that you needed high security clearance to get in and access.

Funny, My husband is in the shipping business and when we lived in Tampa he had to send a driver out to the Scientology Center in Clearwater. He said that when the driver came back he told my husband that he would NEVER do another delivery there again (very creepy, but don't have all the details).

[Lady Pi Phi]

The rumour in the paper this morning is that they are planning to start a family.

[MysticCat]

Originally posted by sugar and spice
Not to mention that almost every religion, if not every religion, has been created or co-opted for the purposes of some greedy (or lustful, or power-hungry, et cetera) leader on some level or another. Joseph Smith?* Come on now. No religion is pure.

I certainly think there many things wrong with Scientology, a motivated-by-money factor being one of them -- but as Rob implied, if we're going to define Scientology as a "cult" than you have to put the LDS church in the "cult" category as well, along with a number of smaller sects of Christianity (and come to think of it, larger ones as well).

Certainly argeed that all religions can produce their loons and their exploiters.

Much depends on how one is using the word cult. Originally, it simply meant a religious practice, like the cult of Apollo. Today (according to Wikipedia, and I think it is probably on point here): In religion and sociology, a cult is a group of people (often a new religious movement) devoted to beliefs and goals which may be contradictory to those held by the majority of society. Its marginal status may come about either due to its novel belief system or due to idiosyncratic practices that cause the surrounding culture to regard it as far outside the mainstream.

Some use a more restrictive definition, however. Again, per Wikipedia: In English-speaking countries since about the 1960s, especially in North America, the term cult has taken on a pejorative and sometimes offensive connotation. This largely originated with highly publicized cults which purportedly exploited their members psychologically and financially, or which allegedly utilized group-based persuasion and conversion techniques. These techniques may include "brainwashing," "thought reform," "love bombing," and "mind control" . . . . Due to the usually pejorative connotation of the word "cult", new religious movements (NRMs) and other purported cults often find the word highly offensive. Some purported cults have been known to insist that other similar groups are cults but that they themselves are not. On the other hand, some skeptics have questioned the distinction between a cult and a mainstream religion. They say that the only difference between a cult and a religion is that the latter is older and has more followers and, therefore, seems less controversial because society has become used to it.

By this second definition (involving emotional, intellectual or financial expoitation of members), I don't think the LDS Church can properly be called a cult. Scientology can.

In any event, "cult" is a loaded word that must be used carefully.

[Rudey]

Didn't Christianity start as a cult?

-Rudey

Originally posted by MysticCat81
Certainly argeed that all religions can produce their loons and their exploiters.

Much depends on how one is using the word cult. Originally, it simply meant a religious practice, like the cult of Apollo. Today (according to Wikipedia, and I think it is probably on point here): In religion and sociology, a cult is a group of people (often a new religious movement) devoted to beliefs and goals which may be contradictory to those held by the majority of society. Its marginal status may come about either due to its novel belief system or due to idiosyncratic practices that cause the surrounding culture to regard it as far outside the mainstream.

Some use a more restrictive definition, however. Again, per Wikipedia: In English-speaking countries since about the 1960s, especially in North America, the term cult has taken on a pejorative and sometimes offensive connotation. This largely originated with highly publicized cults which purportedly exploited their members psychologically and financially, or which allegedly utilized group-based persuasion and conversion techniques. These techniques may include "brainwashing," "thought reform," "love bombing," and "mind control" . . . . Due to the usually pejorative connotation of the word "cult", new religious movements (NRMs) and other purported cults often find the word highly offensive. Some purported cults have been known to insist that other similar groups are cults but that they themselves are not. On the other hand, some skeptics have questioned the distinction between a cult and a mainstream religion. They say that the only difference between a cult and a religion is that the latter is older and has more followers and, therefore, seems less controversial because society has become used to it.

By this second definition (involving emotional, intellectual or financial expoitation of members), I don't think the LDS Church can properly be called a cult. Scientology can.

In any event, "cult" is a loaded word that must be used carefully.

[MysticCat]

Originally posted by Rudey
Didn't Christianity start as a cult?

Using the "classical" definition, Christianity certainly was a cult -- the cult of Christ (just as Judaism was the cult of YHWH). But classically speaking, cult and religion are basically synonymous.

Using the sociological definition I provided above, Christianity certainly could be called a cult in its first century -- "a group of people (often a new religious movement) devoted to beliefs and goals which may be contradictory to those held by the majority of society. Its marginal status may come about either due to its novel belief system or due to idiosyncratic practices that cause the surrounding culture to regard it as far outside the mainstream." Using this definition, Rome would have considered both Christianity and Judaism as cults.

I know of no evidence that would make the use of the third definition (the narrow, perjorative definition sometimes used in North America that implies brainwashing and emotional or financial exploitation) appropriate with regard to early Christianity.

Again, "cult" has become a loaded word. It needs to be used carefully, and probably with some explanation of the meaning intended.

[Rudey]

Originally posted by MysticCat81
Using the "classical" definition, Christianity certainly was a cult -- the cult of Christ (just as Judaism was the cult of YHWH). But classically speaking, cult and religion are basically synonymous.

Using the sociological definition I provided above, Christianity certainly could be called a cult in its first century -- "a group of people (often a new religious movement) devoted to beliefs and goals which may be contradictory to those held by the majority of society. Its marginal status may come about either due to its novel belief system or due to idiosyncratic practices that cause the surrounding culture to regard it as far outside the mainstream." Using this definition, Rome would have considered both Christianity and Judaism as cults.

I know of no evidence that would make the use of the third definition (the narrow, perjorative definition sometimes used in North America that implies brainwashing and emotional or financial exploitation) appropriate with regard to early Christianity.

Again, "cult" has become a loaded word. It needs to be used carefully, and probably with some explanation of the meaning intended.

What time period is early Christianity?

I mean listen, if the majority of people were scientologists and scientology existed before other religions, there wouldn't even be a discussion of people saying they were a cult.

And religion defies logic and reasoning often. It is about faith.

I don't understand the Christians that go around healing people by touch and profiting strongly just as I don't understand how Scientologists believe there is an alien attached to every human guiding him. Y'all can believe whatever you want but religion is about faith and all too often, the exploitation of the masses and the opiate of the mind.

-Rudey

[33girl]

Originally posted by Rudey
I don't understand the Christians that go around healing people by touch and profiting strongly

I don't consider those people Christians, I consider them charlatans (Benny Hinn et al).

[Rudey]

Originally posted by 33girl
I don't consider those people Christians, I consider them charlatans (Benny Hinn et al).

Christian evangelists have one of the most booming "entertainment" industries. Everything from their own television programming to movies and more. This isn't a small sliver of the community.

That's not saying that anyone is a charlatan. It's saying that the money is there and boy, oh boy, is business booming.

-Rudey