What to tell overconfident PNMs

[AnchorAlumna]

Originally Posted by BraveMaroon

I warned him that it wasn't that simple, and he explained that his mother was an XYZ, that he has a cousin in the XYZ National HQ, and that his daughter's BFF from HS has a sister who is an XYZ at this school. He said, "She has it locked down."

Thing is, it IS possible. They key would be the BFF's sister currently in the chapter...the cousin at HQ couldn't hurt.
There's always a handful every year who don't bother with recs and still get bids to their top choices.
Doesn't happen nearly as often as it used to, but it does still happen.

[ChioLu]

I've had someone say something similiar to me. My response was, "Think about how devasted your daughter will be if your perfect scenario DOESN'T happen. If you were interviewing at 6 different companies and knew someone at every single company, would you NOT get a referral from every single person?"

If an overconfident PNM says this, I respond with "If you have a test in a very difficult class, would you NOT study??? Because at "fill in the blank SEC school", there are 1200 women going thru Recruitment who all think they are going to have the perfect recruitment. Like a tough test, if you don't prepare, you're going to FLUNK. Do you really want to flunk Recruitment when you probably only have ONE SHOT??? Do you want to go through 4 years of college without being Greek? If you have done all you can to have a great resume for college, do the same for Recruitment if you want to be Greek."
(And then I get off my soapbox.)

[ConfettiCupcake]

My cousin is a year younger than me and she is going to Alabama in the fall and is dead set on being in a sorority but is totally clueless and won't listen to anything I have to say because she says I have never been through recruitment on the sister side just as a pnm. I tried to remind her that SHE has not even been through as a pnm so I still think I have a little bit of awesome advice, but she just won't listen. This is going to be a disaster. She already has "favorites" and knows that she'll "find the perfect sorority". When I try to tell her about something called mutual selection she won't listen and thinks her middle of the pack grades will be fine.

This will be a slow-motion train wreck.

[Sciencewoman]

Is she getting recs at least?

[AnchorAlumna]

Originally Posted by ConfettiCupcake

My cousin is a year younger than me and she is going to Alabama in the fall and is dead set on being in a sorority but is totally clueless and won't listen to anything I have to say because she says I have never been through recruitment on the sister side just as a pnm. I tried to remind her that SHE has not even been through as a pnm so I still think I have a little bit of awesome advice, but she just won't listen. This is going to be a disaster. She already has "favorites" and knows that she'll "find the perfect sorority". When I try to tell her about something called mutual selection she won't listen and thinks her middle of the pack grades will be fine.

This will be a slow-motion train wreck.

Did she go to preview weekend?
That's puzzling that she won't listen to you. I've found that PNMs listen a lot more closely to current college students than us silly ancient alumnae who know nothing of modern ways.

[ConfettiCupcake]

She did attend the preview weekend and I guess it went well. We don't do that at my school and I'm sort of glad because that is where she came up with her favorites. I didn't really have any preconceived notions about favorites when I went through recruitment and it seemed like it was easier that way (even though I would never call that week easy!!!)

My mom has talked to my aunt about the importance of recs and will probably end up helping my cousin make sure she has them. Mom also sent my aunt a copy of my resume so my cousin can use it as a template. I have sent her a link to this site to get more advice but she is one confident girl and I doubt she'll do much listening!

Now I see what you all go through trying to get people to listen for their own sake!!!

[pinksequins]

CC, as you alluded (trainwreck), there is a lot with your cousin over which you have no control. You kindly offered both your resume and your insights. All through life there will be relatives, friends and co-workers who will not heed advice and must learn the hard way. This may be one of them unfortunately. For your hip pocket, a good turn of phrase instead of "I told you so" is "I am not surprised".

Good luck to all the mentors!

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by pinksequins

CC, as you alluded (trainwreck), there is a lot with your cousin over which you have no control. You kindly offered both your resume and your insights. All through life there will be relatives, friends and co-workers who will not heed advice and must learn the hard way. This may be one of them unfortunately. For your hip pocket, a good turn of phrase instead of "I told you so" is "I am not surprised".

Good luck to all the mentors!

I totally agree. This won't be the last time you know better but someone won't listen. My family actually calls me for medical advice for my ailing grandmother then doesn't take any of it. I'm the only physician in the family. It's frustrating, but they live in Louisiana and I live in CA. There isn't much I can do. Hope for the best.

[AZTheta]

Originally Posted by pinksequins

For your hip pocket, a good turn of phrase instead of "I told you so" is "I am not surprised".

Thanks for this - I get a lot of pleasure out of saying "I told you so" inside my head, and I suspect it shows on my face. I shall practice "I am not surprised" with the appropriate intonation and facial expression.

[pinksequins]

I may have to be using it myself next week. : )

I have those thought clouds and the facial expressions too! But with practice, I have gotten a lot of mileage out of that little phrase (though inside I really want to say "SRSLY??!!").

: )

[OldOleMiss]

Groan- didn't know where else to share and this thread seemed appropriate enough-and need to vent--- a friend of mine contacted me about a month ago-- daughter will be a freshman at Alabama. She asked if I would write a rec. and give them some "recruitment advice"- this girl is not only OOS but northern OOS (NJ) AND has ZERO greek family connections-- of course I said I would be happy to help and told her what daughter needed to get me (and other writers) for the rec.

Friend JUST called me and after thanking me profusely for the offer to help told me that after preview weekend Daughter has been invited to SEVERAL teas- so she thinks they are ---direct quote "good to go on the whole rush thing"-- end quote.... OMG- can I just slap her?? I tried my best to explain to her that recs are still going to be needed, etc.. etc... but friend didn't want to hear any of it. I can only HOPE she comes to her senses soon or she is going to have one very upset daughter on her hands.... I talked until I was blue- and finally hung up with a "good luck, let me know if she changes her mind"-- UGH! some people just need to have sense slapped into them......

[Lovethesand]

Originally Posted by OldOleMiss

Groan- didn't know where else to share and this thread seemed appropriate enough-and need to vent--- a friend of mine contacted me about a month ago-- daughter will be a freshman at Alabama. She asked if I would write a rec. and give them some "recruitment advice"- this girl is not only OOS but northern OOS (NJ) AND has ZERO greek family connections-- of course I said I would be happy to help and told her what daughter needed to get me (and other writers) for the rec.

Friend JUST called me and after thanking me profusely for the offer to help told me that after preview weekend Daughter has been invited to SEVERAL teas- so she thinks they are ---direct quote "good to go on the whole rush thing"-- end quote.... OMG- can I just slap her?? I tried my best to explain to her that recs are still going to be needed, etc.. etc... but friend didn't want to hear any of it. I can only HOPE she comes to her senses soon or she is going to have one very upset daughter on her hands.... I talked until I was blue- and finally hung up with a "good luck, let me know if she changes her mind"-- UGH! some people just need to have sense slapped into them......

As an OOS with no Greek family connections I can relate to your friend to some extent. You don't know the ins and outs and recruitment brochures and the schools can make it seem like you sign up, show up, and at the end you'll have a house. Add in the mix of getting invited to teas and you can think you're good to go. I probably would have thought Debbie was good to go too........... until I came across this site.

If you have a friend like yourself or stumble upon this site then you slowly start to learn what you thought you knew about the process greatly differs from reality. In addition, a Greek friend in a WA school may have a completely different perspective than a Greek friend in AL.

When my Debbie went through recruitment I tried to share with my husband the before, during, and after of recruitment. He just didn't get it. He especially didn't understand recs when everybody has to get them what then made them unique or special. I couldn't explain it either but told him she had to have them.

An outsider to the process can easily be led to believe by talking to a school's Panhellenic office that it's not that big a deal when you know that it's exactly the opposite. Sometimes it's easier to take the "official" word as gospel instead of a friend or someone in the know. Maybe after teas your friend will come back to you for more info once her daughter hears the other girls talk. Tea/pre-tent talk can open a lot of eyes in a good or bad way.

[OldOleMiss]

AWESOME perspective Lovethesand-- THANKS!!! I guess I have never thought of it from the point of view of an OOS / non-greek / non SEC parent / PNM. Being from the south and then going through SEC recruitment my perspective is definitely more skewed. You are right- they really don't have any idea. I have tried to steer them to this site, but it was clear from my recent conversation that they have not checked it out. I really do hope that the teas will open daughters eyes a little bit, I also casually mentioned it to another friend of ours who, while did not attend a competitive recruitment school, was in a sorority and knows the importance of recs... she is going to see if she can also slip into the conversation in the coming days how daughter is going to need much much more than just some cute outfits and a couple of tea invites. Like I said in my rant I really do pray that they come to their senses...

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by OldOleMiss

Groan- didn't know where else to share and this thread seemed appropriate enough-and need to vent--- a friend of mine contacted me about a month ago-- daughter will be a freshman at Alabama. She asked if I would write a rec. and give them some "recruitment advice"- this girl is not only OOS but northern OOS (NJ) AND has ZERO greek family connections-- of course I said I would be happy to help and told her what daughter needed to get me (and other writers) for the rec.

Friend JUST called me and after thanking me profusely for the offer to help told me that after preview weekend Daughter has been invited to SEVERAL teas- so she thinks they are ---direct quote "good to go on the whole rush thing"-- end quote.... OMG- can I just slap her?? I tried my best to explain to her that recs are still going to be needed, etc.. etc... but friend didn't want to hear any of it. I can only HOPE she comes to her senses soon or she is going to have one very upset daughter on her hands.... I talked until I was blue- and finally hung up with a "good luck, let me know if she changes her mind"-- UGH! some people just need to have sense slapped into them......

I just don't understand...

Even if you (general you) think that you have recruitment figured out and a bid in the bag, why not get recs as a fail-safe?

The company I work for now is where my mom works. Her boss was essentially the person who hired me. I had met him a few times prior to my interview, and we always had great conversations. He told me a year prior when I was still living in northwestern PA (the company's home office is in Jersey) that should I ever decide to move, he would have a job waiting for me.

Guess what I did when I was told I had an interview..... I sent in my resume, brought one with me to the interview, wore a full suit (even though I was told business casual), gave them 2 letters of recommendation, 3 references, and followed it up with a thank you letter.

Nothing in life is guaranteed.

[AOIILisa]

Originally Posted by OldOleMiss

AWESOME perspective Lovethesand-- THANKS!!! I guess I have never thought of it from the point of view of an OOS / non-greek / non SEC parent / PNM. Being from the south and then going through SEC recruitment my perspective is definitely more skewed. You are right- they really don't have any idea. I have tried to steer them to this site, but it was clear from my recent conversation that they have not checked it out. I really do hope that the teas will open daughters eyes a little bit, I also casually mentioned it to another friend of ours who, while did not attend a competitive recruitment school, was in a sorority and knows the importance of recs... she is going to see if she can also slip into the conversation in the coming days how daughter is going to need much much more than just some cute outfits and a couple of tea invites. Like I said in my rant I really do pray that they come to their senses...

Yes, or even from the POV of northern greeks who aren't on this site. Before I came here, I wouldn't have known how different SEC rush is from anywhere else and would have probably been just as nonchalant about getting recs as your friend.

As a reference: my alumnae chapter was just reviewing its goals for the year and one of them was to write at least one MIF (our term for a rec). We wrote.. exactly one, for someone who was going to a big SEC school. (There was a collective sigh around the room over what the poor kid is going to experience going through recruitment there!). Penn State and all the other PA schools just don't use recs, for the most part. Yet I am sure there are other AOII alum chapters that write hundreds!