Did anybody watch the 3-day Nightline special about Innercity Education?

[Ice Cold Kreator]

I was wondering if anybody watched "Master Teacher"...and what they thought about standardized testing for fourth graders (or elementary age kids) who grow up in disadvantaged areas, and can't meet the standards of today?

How do we help them? How do we build self-esteem in them? Especially, in young men who are already more likely to end up in jail?

06,

The Ice Cold Kreator

[Sexy Mocha]

No, I did not see this program but I must respond anyway.

I do not believe standardized testing, at least the way it is currently applied, is an effective tool in evaluating any child's level of learning/comprehending nor does it determine the quality of education that a child is being given.

The quality/quantity of the curriculum, prior to the actual testing, is reduced significantly because the majority of the time is spent DRILLING children on practice exam materials. Most of the school year is spent learning how to bubble in answers and how to become accustomed to multiple choice, computer scored formats. These "drills" take time from real teaching and learning.

As a future English teacher/present writing tutor who works with students on developing ideas, finding their own voice as writers, and organizing papers in ways that are appropriate to both...I find conflict with the essay part of the standardized tests. The format restricts the students to writing in a prescriptive way that is only good for producing predictable, rote writing...and not writing as it relates to thinking, language and development, and enriching one's vocabulary and ideas. The latter, which is the proper way of writing, is replaced by writing to format.

As for helping our children and building their self-esteem, this begins in the home. It is up to us, as parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, etc., to teach OUR children that they are special and that they must learn to love and respect themselves.

We must teach them important lessons about race and how despite racism, African Americans...HIS/HER PEOPLE...have acheived unprecendented levels of success and acclaim.

At the risk of sounding like a commercial, the most important thing we, as adults, can do is stay involved in our children's lives. It truly takes a village to raise a child.

I apologize for the length of this post, but you have touched on two subjects that are of extreme importance to me...children and education.

[This message has been edited by Sexy Mocha (edited August 24, 2000).]

[Eclipse]

I.C.K.,
I saw one night of the show (I think it was the second night) and was crying tears of frustration at the end! Some of those kids were trying really hard and others had just given up and replaced studying, etc. with a hard shell, anger, fighting, etc..

How do we build their self esteem.....whew that is a hard one. I think the first place you start is with parenting classes. I wish we could make parenting classes mandatory for EVERYONE ('cause it ain't just poor black and brown folks that can't parent!) On the show that I watched one of the little girl's bio dad came to the school and humilated her in front of the entire class and told her he was going to spank her in the cafeteria during lunch if she continued to do what ever she was doing. Now I'm all for a good spanking from time to time, but if you kid is acting out in anger, talking about killing other children, then you need to get to the root cause of the problem and a spanking is not going to do it! Also, what was up with the kids that were outside playing at 9 o'clock at night?!?

We (young, black professionals) need to spend more time mentoring and volunteering with this students. My husband is a Junior Achievement volunteer. I went with him to his site on one of my off days and it was amazing how the kids responded to him and the program. Kids need to see others that look like them in postions of authority up close and personal. They also need to know that someone cares about them and is going to challenge them to do and be their very best.

The standardized testing issue is going to become an even bigger deal soon, especially with the upcoming presidential elections. Several states are inacting a merit based pay program for teachers. On the surface, I think that is a good idea, however so many factors contribute to whether or not teachers will be successful. What kind of support is she getting from the parents? Do they have adequate supplies? Did the children eat breakfast that morning? did they stay up all night watching TV or listening to the neighbors fight? The controversy here is GA is will teachers get more $$ because they are doing a better job at teaching or because the students come to school with a wealth of knowledge already? What do you do with a good, dedicated teacher like to one on the show who, despite her best efforts, still have the majority of her class 'fail' these test? Do you fire her or is she encouraged to leave the inner city and go to a surburban school where her job will be easier?

There are no easy answers, but we certainly need to be asking the questions!

[This message has been edited by Eclipse (edited August 25, 2000).]

[Ice Cold Kreator]

I agree with you Sexy Mocha and Eclipse.

I think our black children's self confidence is being assaulted and mis named testing!

I felt like I was watching children die inside...these are the same children who will be more likely to commit crimes than go to college!

I think we need some serious educators as administrators who will allow for a lot more diverse education and testing methods...as well...can our children get more education...and less criticism...make inner city classrooms smaller than required...teach above the standards...and offer cultural centers of knowledge for kids who deal with a lot more!

Give them more than average...and I think we will see better results....

Also, I think our College GREEKs need to mentor--home work helps sessions on a national level...along with those Graduate Greeks who can do mentoring on the weekends...


I think we can change things...but we need to be involved!

06,
Ice Cold Kreator


Ice Ice Baby

[darling1]

I did not see the special on Nightline but like Mocha I would like to repond. I am a product of specialized testing and I remember how competitive the classroom became when test time rolled around. It was all about getting that 12.7 grade level in reading and math. As a 8, 9 or 10 year old that is alot. Preparation was extremely intense I remember many teachers looking down on that student(s) who wasn't performing as well. They essentially were ignored by the teachers, the feeling being that they were never going to get it.

I also remember the one year that I didn't get a 12.7(this was 6th grade) I got so sick becaise it seemed that everyone else around me did better that year. I think I cried for a long time. What people fail to understand is that we are products of our environment. There are students who are not exposed to anything different than their 4 walls. They aren't encouraged to excel but to just get by. Conditions in the inner cities have gotten progressively worse. More often than not, school age children are worried more about getting home without gettng shot than taking a test. They are also influenced by what they see on TV and on the corners. If they are constantly inundated with the Puffies of this world flossing and talking about benjamins and baguettes, their focus will inevitably shift.

With all of that who has time to worry about analogies and y=mx+b.

I also think that the educational system has failed us. Teachers aren't getting paid their worth so they aren't going to really put effort into helping their students learn. I think that many people that go into teaching do it as a stepping stone because it will help pay for loans or they just couldn't find something in their fields. I don't hear about people my age(28) wanting to go into teaching because they want to REALLY MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

Kreator, you asked how we can make a difference, I think you start slowly. Mentoring is always a good way to help. Be consistent. Don't just do it selfishly. Sometimes your mentoring can occur during your daily travels. If you see a younger person not doing what he/she is supposed to be doing, call him on it. I have done it on many occasions. I was firm but at the same time I didn't talk to that person in a derogatory manner. Passivity is what has gotten us into this predicament. We are responsible for each other.

I honestly don't know how to deal with standardized testing. It's the results of those scores that determines what schools get enough funding for the next year. It all about the GREEN. It seems that more schools are requiring it. If we can change how the teachers prepare these kids we may win part of the battle.

[7BA94]

I can't comment on the program because I did not see it, but standardized testing does have a place in public schools at least in some subjects. Math and history are subjects that instantly jump to mind. In these subjects, either you know the material or you don't. Either the material has been taught so that the student understands it or it has not. 2+2 is the same in Iowa as it is in Washington D.C. Parents and teachers do need to be held accountable and we should expect our children to perfom above average as ICK said earlier.
I also agree with the young lady who questioned the essay portion on a standardized exam. If the essay is being graded for basic sentence structure, spelling and if the thesis is backed up by facts, then I can see where an essay would be useful. If on the other hand, the essay is being graded on some subjective criteria it should not be used at all.
I also do not think we should allow students to get away with the excuse that they stayed up all night and watched TV. People in general and young people in particular will almost always rise to someone expectations. Basically, if you expect your students or children to excel; they will. This fact has been proven in many studies. A good one is where they told a teacher of gifted talented students that the class was full of underachievers; you can guess what happened that class's test scores fell. In contrast, they told another teacher the class of historically low performers was the gifted talented class what happened they excelled.
In both cases, the students performed to the teachers expectations both positively and negatively.
Now, all this to say that yes standardized testing does have a place because we as parents and a community have a right to know how our school system stacks up against other school systems. If our school does not do well, we need to be finding out why immediately as in yesterday, because if we do not the only people being hurt are our children.

[This message has been edited by 7BA94 (edited August 28, 2000).]

[The Original Ape]

Originally posted by Ice Cold Kreator:
I was wondering if anybody watched "Master Teacher"...and what they thought about standardized testing for fourth graders (or elementary age kids) who grow up in disadvantaged areas, and can't meet the standards of today?

How do we help them? How do we build self-esteem in them? Especially, in young men who are already more likely to end up in jail?

06,

The Ice Cold Kreator

I had the misfortune of not seeing it. I was at work. If you have time, e-mail me a little bit 'bout it Bruh.

Like a close friend of mine told me once: self esteem is born at home; incubated in the relationships between the father and the child, and the mother and the child. It is reinforced first by the child's siblings, then by the child's peers.

All of us aren't fortunate enough to have the combined efforts of both parents; therefore we may initially receive self esteem-but it is not reinforced. Its roots dont take hold.
I think one way to build self esteem in young men-children is through accomplishment and positive reinforcement by the RIGHT PEOPLE. Only the child in question knows who they are.

[Ice Cold Kreator]

Original...go to www.abc.com...look for a Nightline link and that should get you through...

Holla back and I will email you about it!

Ice Cold Kreator