Declining enrollment at CSU campuses

[PKT4LIFE]

Originally Posted by navane

Well, let's be clear here - Sonoma State University has far more White students to start with.


SONOMA STATE STUDENT DEMOGRAPHICS:






CAL STATE DOMINGUEZ HILLS STUDENT DEMOGRAPHICS:






CAL STATE LONG BEACH STUDENT DEMOGRAPHICS:

One more. Those not familiar with San Jose State:

Asian

36.1%

Hispanic

28.2%

White

14.1%

Non-resident Alien

9.7%

Two or More Races

4.7%

Unknown

3.4%

Black

3.3%

Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander

0.4%

American Indian or Alaskan Native

.01%

[Cookiez17]

I do wonder if the rise in non white students will lead to more students joining cultural based organizations rather than the traditional NPC/IFC organizations.

[Zach]

Originally Posted by Cookiez17

I do wonder if the rise in non white students will lead to more students joining cultural based organizations rather than the traditional NPC/IFC organizations.

I doubt it. I think students will gravitate to which organizations tie in more with their backgrounds. Plus, within the next 20 years or so, I don’t think any ethnic group will be the majority in this country. Two thirds of the world’s countries are already composed of a majority of people of color. Eventually, this country will be like the rest of the world, based on the way things are playing out. Because of that, I think students will base their glo choices on their upbringing or backgrounds.

[Joobee]

I can speak to this right now as we’re living it in our house. My eldest graduated from SDSU in ‘17 and my middle from Chico State in ‘19 (she was Greek my eldest was not.) My youngest is an incoming junior for next fall and currently deciding which CSU to transfer to. She currently has four offers but waiting on her 1st choice, SDSU. She decided while still in high school that she didn’t want to graduate with the student loan depr he older sisters have, so was happy to enroll in our local CC. The other major factor: the first two years at CCs in CA are free. This wasn’t the case when my older two were her age. So my youngest will (hopefully) graduate with a lot less debt. Another factor I think with the lower enrollments, besides the cost, is that it’s much more difficult to get into many of the CSUs now. SDSU had a 4.1 gpa average for incoming freshman this fall. My eldest got in with a 3.7. She probably wouldn’t get in now with that, especially since they’re no longer taking standardized testing into account. She did well on her SATs which basically got her in. Though GPA doesn’t seem to be such a factor as many of my youngest’s friends had well over 4.0s and opted for CC first as well. Many of them will be transferring to UC schools too. I also think Covid played into it too, obviously. This all said, though I’d love my youngest go through recruitment as a junior, which I did and loved my sorority time, she says she has no interest. That ship has sailed. She just wants to focus on school and work and internships. I imagine a lot of kids her age are feeling the same way. Maybe she’ll change her mind after she gets on campus somewhere. It’s something the the CSUs and the Greek organizations in general might want to take into account for their recruiting strategies. The changing demographics of the campuses. Maybe gear more to older students.

[*winter*]

Some of state system schools in PA had a merger. Here is an article that explains it better than I can:

https://www.highereddive.com/news/pe...into-2/603330/


The tuition hikes are pricing out the people these institutions were designed to sever, which is kind of underhanded when you think about it. They were created to give people the opportunity to earn a college education and to, hopefully, achieve upward mobility. They have faced funding cuts from the state, which don’t really leave them much of a choice in raising their tuition…but it’s still sad to see such a strong system struggling.

Anecdotal experience, I know, but my nephew was accepted at several state schools and not offered any meaningful scholarship money (despite really stellar grades and accomplishments). He applied (at the suggestion of a certain wise aunt, might I point out) to some private schools with great scholarship programs…and got almost a full ride to a wonderful private university. Kids aren’t being incentivized to go to state schools if the cost of attendance far outweighs private schools if scholarship opportunities are factored in. He also had smaller class sizes and way more opportunities for internships and meaningful college work because he stayed in the city.

At the school I attended, the Greek system is doing well (comparatively, for a school its size in the northeast). They went through a period of downturn maybe 15 years ago, but the system is as strong as it was when I was in school. However, it’s not one of the schools involved in the merger and doesn’t seem to have the same drop in attendance. My personal belief is this school made some strategic decisions to focus on programs that weren’t offered elsewhere, thus still bringing in the numbers despite a generational drop in college enrollment.

[chi-o_cat]

Originally Posted by *winter*

Anecdotal experience, I know, but my nephew was accepted at several state schools and not offered any meaningful scholarship money (despite really stellar grades and accomplishments). He applied (at the suggestion of a certain wise aunt, might I point out) to some private schools with great scholarship programs…and got almost a full ride to a wonderful private university. Kids aren’t being incentivized to go to state schools if the cost of attendance far outweighs private schools if scholarship opportunities are factored in. He also had smaller class sizes and way more opportunities for internships and meaningful college work because he stayed in the city.

I can anecdotally back up your anecdote! My cousin has 4 kids- 2 college grads, one in college (all non-Greek, ha ha) and one college-bound, and she said her middle two had the same experience with being offered a better financial deal from the private university they attended/are attending than the public ones they applied to.

[33girl]

My cousin (from a Penn State obsessed family, as you will find in this neck of the woods) turned down Penn State to go to Westminster (PA), as Westminster gave her practically a free ride and Penn State didn't give her squat.

Re the PA state schools, it hasn't only been the ridiculous building sprees resulting in ridiculous tuition increases, it's also been a diluting of the schools' individuality and unique offerings. It used to be that certain schools were the only ones to offer certain things or be known as good for them. Clarion - library science, Lock Haven - phys ed, IUP - criminology, etc etc. I always thought this was a state enforced thing, but apparently it was just a gentleman's agreement, and gentlemen don't exist anymore. I went to a Clarion alumni thing where they were crowing about the new criminology major, and was just like, why are we doing this? Meanwhile, our communications program, one of the best on the eastern seaboard, had been decimated beyond recognition.

And now Joshie apparently wants to merge all the state schools and community colleges together. 🤬🤬 I give up.

[33girl]

My cousin (from a Penn State obsessed family, as you will find in this neck of the woods) turned down Penn State to go to Westminster (PA), as Westminster gave her practically a free ride and Penn State didn't give her squat.

Re the PA state schools, it hasn't only been the ridiculous building sprees resulting in ridiculous tuition increases, it's also been a diluting of the schools' individuality and unique offerings. It used to be that certain schools were the only ones to offer certain things or be known as good for them. Clarion - library science, Lock Haven - phys ed, IUP - criminology, etc etc. I always thought this was a state enforced thing, but apparently it was just a gentleman's agreement, and gentlemen don't exist anymore. I went to a Clarion alumni thing where they were crowing about the new criminology major, and was just like, why are we doing this? Meanwhile, our communications program, one of the best on the eastern seaboard, had been decimated beyond recognition.

And now Joshie apparently wants to merge all the state schools and community colleges together. 🤬🤬 I give up.

[*winter*]

Haha 33 I didn’t want to offend you there since we have a small rivalry lol.

But IMO, Slippery Rock took advantage of their strong programs and expanded them, as opposed to trying to add every conceivable major when there’s like five other colleges in a twenty mile radius. They drew out the community health bachelors program (I was in that and it was top notch twenty years ago) and added on a MPH. Most people are going to go on to get their MPH anyway in that field, so why not do all 6 years at the same school with the same (great) faculty?

They also really did amazing things with physical therapy. Even 25 years ago (damn it, I’m old) they were ahead of the game by offering a DPT. It drew in people from across the country then and still does- and out of state tuition dollars outrank in state. They also kind of teamed up athletic training as the undergrad program- which draws in plenty of people on its own and was a great program- and then people try to compete for a slot in the PT program.

They’ve even added a physicians assistant program, which is great!

I’m not saying they haven’t overdone it with the new amenities and fancy buildings…(or maybe I’m just mad that they ripped down my old haunts) but they also expanded programming simultaneously.

It was incredibly dumb and short sighted how a certain governor days past thought he was flexing by cutting school and university budgets. Everyone will save money! Meanwhile, the school districts passed it on in property taxes, and the universities struggled with enrollment. Great idea there

Maybe I’m just in a really positive mood about education since yesterday I found out my student loan balance is officially $0.00 after trying to get PSLF for several years. Go college!!!!!

[Cheerio]

What is the current NPC wisdom regarding NPC chapters colonizing at Community Colleges? I recall a few NPC groups voting "yes" on statements that would allow consideration of colonies @CC's should the full NPC allow same.

[shadokat]

If you're going to a big flagship school, you're gonna be just fine. Kids don't want to go to smaller schools anymore. And that's the projected demographic cliff. It's why NPC has implemented new total setting methods for schools with dropping open house pools. It's why schools are no longer waiting to expand - if the struggling chapter can't catch up, they're going to move ahead without them. Schools like Westminster (or in my neck of the woods, Albright) are offering students full rides just to get them to come there. Many students turn down full rides at those small schools for the big university experience.

As the PA state system, it's FUBAR at this point. PASSHE has lost all integrity because they admit anyone with a pulse, outside of West Chester. Most state schools have 90% acceptance rates. Guess what happens then? You lose any "prestige" you may have had 20 or 30 years ago. In 2010, there were over 84,000 applicants to PASSHE schools, and 61% were accepted. In 2022, there were 59,000 applicants to PASSHE schools and 90% were accepted.

The Allegheny Institute has a great article about PASSHE and comparisons to other PA schools - it ain't pretty.

[33girl]

Not to mention, they've become suitcase campuses in the extreme- most kids have to travel back home to work. The students don't have any time to get involved in extracurriculars and so they have little to zero loyalty or affection for the school - it's just a place to check off "degree."

I blame this all on the building sprees. I know some of the buildings needed replaced and updated but "if you build it they will come" only works in a movie.