University fo Okahoma-Sigma Alpha Epsilon-Racial Chant

[Nanners52674]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

He has to clean up his image in time for the job search! Unless he has a job in the bag, that is.

He probably does, his father owns a successful company.

I'm most bothered that he won't answer questions about how he learned the chant, it's origins or any other info about how this happened. If you're truly sorry and want to spend the rest of your life working for equality, tell people where this originated from so that it can be fixed. The bigger the picture we have the better we can combat this behavior.

[thetalady]

It also pisses me off that not a single other person was named as being on the bus. The school has even agreed that even if other students are identified in the future, they will not face expulsion.

None of them learned anything other than it only counts if you get caught on video. Shame on all who were there and continue to keep their mouths shut.

[Kevin]

Considering the threats of physical violence against SAE and other GLO members just by association, I think it's pretty fair to keep their identities out of this.

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Considering the threats of physical violence against SAE and other GLO members just by association, I think it's pretty fair to keep their identities out of this.

Yes, by all means, let's protect the men who sang about lynching.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by amIblue?

Yes, by all means, let's protect the men who sang about lynching.

+1

[Nanners52674]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Considering the threats of physical violence against SAE and other GLO members just by association, I think it's pretty fair to keep their identities out of this.

Why? Why do they deserve privacy?

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Nanners52674

Why? Why do they deserve privacy?

Why don't they? The reaction of the local community to this news was violence. People were unsafe just because of their Greek affiliation. It's a matter of student safety.

[Nanners52674]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Why don't they? The reaction of the local community to this news was violence. People were unsafe just because of their Greek affiliation. It's a matter of student safety.

Because they're racists and they don't deserve special treatment. They're just as guilty as the 2 named men. If you and to be a racist go ahead. But don't expect that to be something you can cry privacy for. Be a man EDIT: ADULT, so I'm being gender inclusive. and own your actions, don't hide like a racist coward.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Nanners52674

If you and to be a racist go ahead.

Not sure what you mean there.

But don't expect that to be something you can cry privacy for. Be a man and own your actions, don't hide like a racist coward.

Be a man? I don't think it's fair to call these guys racists. You don't know any of them. Was this a racially insensitive chant? Hell yes. Are they racially insensitive? THat's probably fair. Are they racists? Not necessarily. And really.. "be a man" is a pretty gender-biased thing to say.

And two things--first, not only do I think these students have a moral right to not be outed by the university, placing their safety in jeopardy, I think a good argument can be made that the records of this investigation could arguably be confidential pursuant to the Federal Educational Record Privacy Act (FERPA).

A fraternity brother and I went up against OU's staff attorneys on a FERPA issue (they thought parking tickets were covered by FERPA) and won, but they literally made a federal case out of it before it settled. I don't think I'd have to be speculating wildly to think that OU's general counsel would consider the student details pertaining to this incident to be confidential. (link to show I'm not just blowing smoke)

http://foioklahoma.org/2014/05/14/fe...records-ferpa/

And before you suggest it, if the school is the entity which publicly outed the chant leaders, there may be a right of action under FERPA (I am now speculating wildly because I have never researched private rights of action under the statute).

All that said, OU takes student privacy and FERPA compliance very seriously in my direct personal experience. Considering they took the position that FERPA applied to parking tickets, I imagine they are trying to walk a FERPA tightrope here and that they consider these students' identities confidential.

[ComradesTrue]

OU President indicates 25 SAE members will face discipline for their part in the video.

In addition:

After over 160 interviews, Boren said the university concluded that the chant is "widely known and informally shared" among Sigma Alpha Epsilon nationally. The chant originated from a national leadership cruise sponsored by the national fraternity four years ago, he said.

From there, Boren said, the chant became localized and became "part of the institutionalized culture of the chapter" at OU, as it was taught to the chapter's pledges

full story

[AZTheta]

The only "problem" I have with Boren's remarks re: the origin of the chant comes from MU2Driver's post earlier in this thread. He stated that he learned the chant in the 1980s. It is not unreasonable to think that it's been around longer than that. Regardless, that it was taught at a national leadership conference really says all I need to know.

[Nanners52674]

Okay Kevin, does grownup work better than man? They should stand up and act like the adults they are, take responsibility for their actions. Just because their face wasn't on camera doesn't give them a free pass.

[BlueOwl]

My son, who is a current member of SAE at a large public university on the west coast told me that two weeks ago, when one of the members of his chapter finished taking a final exam for winter quarter, he walked his scantron sheet up to the front of the room and handed it to the professor. The young man was wearing his SAE sweatshirt at the time and the professor commented to the young man "Oh, you are one of them".

Also, my son said that his chapter's Facebook page has received a lot of negative comments and threats.

[exlurker]

The OU student paper has this editorial, which I think says some things that needed to be said.

http://www.oudaily.com/opinion/edito...5bb7d73f5.html

And this (below) is the related post, which includes the comments by the SAE president that are referenced in the editorial.

http://www.oudaily.com/news/sae-nati...69b15f7e1.html

The SAE president's comments were in Facebook; they have reportedly been deleted. How many times have GCers warned about posting on Facebook? (Somewhere between several and a gazillion times, IIRC.)

[AZTheta]

"A racist organization doesn’t elect a Jewish immigrant from South Africa as its national President. " So wrote Brad Cohen.

Excuse me, sir, ever hear of tokenism? And, FYI: you're Caucasian, aka WHITE. Yes, you're Jewish, but you're WHITE/Caucasian. That's your RACE. Judaism is a religion, not a race. Maybe you meant to write "bigoted" or "prejudiced" or "discriminatory"? I dunno.

This is just getting worse and worse. Cohen didn't help by posting on FB, not at all. The editorial made some valid points, I agree.