Indiana University 2014 Recruitment

[als463]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

Maybe I'm misinterpreting what you're trying to say here, and I don't want to derail this thread, but why would you not hire someone because they transferred from IU?

No, you're fine. I clearly didn't say it right. Excuse me for that. No, I'm saying that if a girl chose to transfer from IU to a lesser prestigious school just to go Greek and that was her reason, I wouldn't hire her. To me, I am more concerned about the prestige of their degree/ rigor of the school's program. If there were other reasons she transferred--that's okay. If IU has, say for example, the top #1 program in the nation for ______ and a woman transferred to Bumblescum U to a bottom program or a program less prestigious, I wouldn't hire her. Obviously, IU is a great school with so many great attributes. If her sole reason for leaving was the Greek situation and she went to a "lesser" school then nope! She needs to look elsewhere for employment. Now, if it was Purdue the person transferred to, which is another great school, then fine. If you choose lesser because recruitment knocked the wind out of you, I'm not so sure I want you working for me. I hope that one makes sense. Some people may say it's insensitive but, I really don't care.

[suzy88]

Some were wondering why they just didn't hold recruitment events on Martin Luther King, Jr. Day. I think that some would perceive that as a bad day to hold recruitment events or a bid day. It is supposed to be a day of service and a day of reflection about the work he did.

[Titchou]

OK, folks, let's not get this one shut down. Everyone play nice. Let's be Panhellenic.

[pinkmama]

Some girls are appear to look the part and on papar are the total package but then they get to rush and are quiet or can't get into good conversations that intrigue chapter members. It happens quite a lot. Some women just don't have that gift to talk random conversations. I didn't enjoy talking to pnms who just asked the basic questions of philanthropy, major, sisterhood events etc. one thing I alwaYs asked every pnm what to tell me th most embarrassing thing that has ever happened to you or a family member.

Some of these girls who who bidless just didn't "girl flirt" well. They may get invites back for further look at them or just how the numbers played out.

And the cold dorm- best sleep I ever had for three years!!! We only had beds in cold dorm and warm dorm. Windows open all year dark quiet. Lots of blankets. My sisters and I still talk about that when we meet as a huge group at IU every three years.

[pinkmama]

Ignore my spelling error. Ugh doing it on phone sitting in car line

[blueiumom]

I have a new question related to IU's recruitment this year, and I thought maybe a change of focus might be in order. I feel like panhel's decision to deal with the weather issues by eliminating one round of rush parties - thus going 21 to 12 to 3 - really added to the brutality of IU's already emotionally-charged recruitment process. Since the second weekend of rush was already taking place on a 3-day weekend due to the MLK holiday, I thought it was the perfect opportunity simply to use that Monday to adjust the schedule and still have the normal round of parties. Instead, the girls had their first invitational /12 party on Saturday, preference round/3 party on Sunday, and nothing on Monday. Bids were delivered (or not) on Tuesday. Does anyone know why panhel didn't or couldn't take advantage of that Monday? Just curious.

[Sciencewoman]

Originally Posted by blueiumom

I have a new question related to IU's recruitment this year, and I thought maybe a change of focus might be in order. I feel like panhel's decision to deal with the weather issues by eliminating one round of rush parties - thus going 21 to 12 to 3 - really added to the brutality of IU's already emotionally-charged recruitment process. Since the second weekend of rush was already taking place on a 3-day weekend due to the MLK holiday, I thought it was the perfect opportunity simply to use that Monday to adjust the schedule and still have the normal round of parties. Instead, the girls had their first invitational /12 party on Saturday, preference round/3 party on Sunday, and nothing on Monday. Bids were delivered (or not) on Tuesday. Does anyone know why panhel didn't or couldn't take advantage of that Monday? Just curious.

Please see post #119.

Having 4 rounds wouldn't have changed the final number of women getting bids. It might have shaken up who got bids a bit, but I don't think the number of rounds would have changed the final outcome of many women going bidless.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by Sciencewoman

Please see post #119.

Having 4 rounds wouldn't have changed the final number of women getting bids. It might have shaken up who got bids a bit, but I don't think the number of rounds would have changed the final outcome of many women going bidless.

I don't think she's suggesting there would be a drastic change. It's just that things are already tense and heart-breaking in this environment, so why make it worse? I think the PNMs feel a little more "ripped off" this year because they had even less time to meet with the chapters. It makes the selection process seem even more random and arbitrary.

[blueiumom]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

I don't think she's suggesting there would be a drastic change. It's just that things are already tense and heart-breaking in this environment, so why make it worse? I think the PNMs feel a little more "ripped off" this year because they had even less time to meet with the chapters. It makes the selection process seem even more random and arbitrary.

Exactly. With fewer rounds, there is less opportunity for both sides to really fine tune their lists and hone in on the girls they want. When you go from 12 houses to 3, it seems like the matches are going to be made further down everyone's lists. Many of the 1000+ girls who now happily have bids are at houses that probably weren't anywhere near the top 3 on their lists for preference round - and that meant even they were likely bawling on Sunday morning. (The majority of the girls were.) I know that would still happen with 4 rounds; it'd just be to a lesser degree. In any event, that's really beside the point of my question . . . I'd love to hear from IU's panhel as to why they didn't just reschedule the rounds into Monday. There probably is a perfectly good reason; I'd just like to know! Until then, it is one more place for me to direct my angst!

[IndianaSigKap]

Originally Posted by KDCat

Not everybody has $15,000 - $20,000 extra dollars to spend every year to go to an out-of-state school or a private school. IU is a deal for in-state students. They shouldn't be forced to choose between tuition dollars and Greek Life.

Not when this problem is an artificially created problem that can be easily corrected.

Thank you KDCat. This is a point that often gets overlooked. Some girls just don't have the money to go to an out of state school. IU and Purdue are both excellent schools they just focus on two very different career paths.

For those who do, in addition to tuition, out of state girls often incur travel costs, moving costs and shipping costs depending on how far away she is from home. I know a lovely young lady from New Jersey who attends IU and if she did not have other family from Indiana she would not be with family on Thanksgiving or Easter. It's too much money to buy plane tickets for more than two holidays. She can get two suitcases full of clothes here but she had to ship the rest out.

The problem could be corrected fairly easily. Adopt campus total. Set it at the average chapter size, like every other school in the country (and some in Canada ). This change would not be devastatingly drastic to any chapter and it would level the playing field. Those chapters who have to COR might realize how many great women there are out there.

Originally Posted by WhiteRose1912

They're cutting girls they invited to pref. They DO want these girls, they just don't want to lose the reputation of exclusivity. It's not a Tufts situation.

Yes, RFM was supposed to cut down on this but if a girl is on each chapter's third list she might not get placed. However, IU could do a better job of adding QAs, only a few chapters take them currently.

Originally Posted by BlueCarnation

Agreed. It's interesting...the administration here is trying to force some changes to recruitment that we don't think we're going to want. Maybe we can convince them to go down and work with IU instead?

I think it would be amazing if the national organizations got involved in an educational way. Show the IU collegians how recruitment is done at other schools of similar size: Pac 12, SEC, Big 12. Show the chapters how much more money they could have coming in with just 20 more members. How much more they could do with their philanthropies with just 20 more members. Maybe education is the key to change.

Originally Posted by TriDeltaSallie

This is what it boils down to for me.

No chapter should be required to take girls they don't want. I don't think anyone here is advocating that.

But it is flat out wrong and rude to allow women to complete the entire process and even have a FULL schedule for pref and end up with NOTHING. It's WRONG. It's rude. It's completely contrary to the most basic of human kindness such as the Golden Rule which I'm sure is stated in some form or another in the values we all espouse to hold.

If chapters don't want those women, then drop them beforehand. I have no problem with that. If a woman is released completely before preference, it is sad and unfortunate, but it is part of the selection process. But there is NO WAY women should play by the rules and do everything asked of them and then get nothing after attending pref and listing all the groups on their cards.

The chapters do want these women, it's just that they wanted 42 more. I know it's hard to wrap around, but sometimes girls put themselves in this position when ranking. They like AAA better than BBB because it is "top tier" so they ranked it higher. They were on AAA's third bid list, but might have been on BBB's first list for whatever reason. Girls often rank with the tent talk in their ears rather than the logic in their minds. Not always, but it happens.

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

I don't think she's suggesting there would be a drastic change. It's just that things are already tense and heart-breaking in this environment, so why make it worse? I think the PNMs feel a little more "ripped off" this year because they had even less time to meet with the chapters. It makes the selection process seem even more random and arbitrary.

ASTalumna06, I do think some of this is true. I did talk with a wonderful young lady who mentioned that she wished she had an extra round to meet more sorority women. Maybe she would have met someone she click better with and that person might have pulled for her. I am sure it has crossed their minds some.

[Sigmapsimom]

Originally Posted by blueiumom

I have a new question related to IU's recruitment this year, and I thought maybe a change of focus might be in order. I feel like panhel's decision to deal with the weather issues by eliminating one round of rush parties - thus going 21 to 12 to 3 - really added to the brutality of IU's already emotionally-charged recruitment process. Since the second weekend of rush was already taking place on a 3-day weekend due to the MLK holiday, I thought it was the perfect opportunity simply to use that Monday to adjust the schedule and still have the normal round of parties. Instead, the girls had their first invitational /12 party on Saturday, preference round/3 party on Sunday, and nothing on Monday. Bids were delivered (or not) on Tuesday. Does anyone know why panhel didn't or couldn't take advantage of that Monday? Just curious.

I agree with Sciencewoman that it would not have made a difference in the number of women who got bids. However, a 21-14-8-3 schedule provides for less dramatic cuts than 21-12-3 and it could have given PNMs assurance that they were at least considered, even if they were later cut between 14-8 or 8-3.

After the usual first round of cuts 21-14, girls get their first idea of where they stand, but still had up to 2 more rounds to meet and impress. They also had an entire week between 14 and 8 party to mourn, and then readjust their focus.

This year the girls went to 21, felt great an entire week not knowing where they stood and many were devastated the next Saturday. The cuts between 21-12 were far more dramatic than they would have been between 21-14. The 21-14 cut, which is normally done that first weekend, is the first time the girls really know where they stand and what chapters they should shoot for. So having it done that first weekend gave them a whole week to rethink things and get excited all over again about new possibilities. Until then, yes too many girls think they are getting into chapters they probably won't, but because there were still 2 more parties they have a chance to reevaluate things. They could go back to 14 and possibly 8 and try to dazzle chapters that they are now looking at in a new light, but that chance was taken from them and they're upset about that. Some chapters they might have had a second chance at, they did not because of the party cut.

It would have changed the outcome for some individual girls, but not the recruitment numbers. Bed quota is still the elephant in the room. However, Cutting an entire round of parties was a mistake regardless, because it gave the impression (and there is some truth to it) that decisions were made even more hastily and arbitrarily than usual.

[blueiumom]

Originally Posted by Sigmapsimom

I agree with Sciencewoman that it would not have made a difference in the number of women who got bids. However, a 21-14-8-3 schedule provides for less dramatic cuts than 21-12-3 and it could have given PNMs assurance that they were at least considered, even if they were later cut between 14-8 or 8-3.

After the usual first round of cuts 21-14, girls get their first idea of where they stand, but still had up to 2 more rounds to meet and impress. They also had an entire week between 14 and 8 party to mourn, and then readjust their focus.

This year the girls went to 21, felt great an entire week not knowing where they stood and many were devastated the next Saturday. The cuts between 21-12 were far more dramatic than they would have been between 21-14. The 21-14 cut, which is normally done that first weekend, is the first time the girls really know where they stand and what chapters they should shoot for. So having it done that first weekend gave them a whole week to rethink things and get excited all over again about new possibilities. Until then, yes too many girls think they are getting into chapters they probably won't, but because there were still 2 more parties they have a chance to reevaluate things. They could go back to 14 and possibly 8 and try to dazzle chapters that they are now looking at in a new light, but that chance was taken from them and they're upset about that. Some chapters they might have had a second chance at, they did not because of the party cut.

It would have changed the outcome for some individual girls, but not the recruitment numbers. Bed quota is still the elephant in the room. However, Cutting an entire round of parties was a mistake regardless, because it gave the impression (and there is some truth to it) that decisions were made even more hastily and arbitrarily than usual.

Exactly. It made an already stressful, often painful process even more brutal than it had been in the past. As if panhel was insensitive to it all . . .

[Indiana mom]

My daughter was one of the casualties of rush. She showed up early to participate in rush under the most undesirable weather conditions, visiting house after house in freezing weather . She had three preference invites for the last round but ended up bid less. She was crushed and curled up in a ball crying while her friends were posting pics and tweeting about what sorority they were in and how happy they were.
She also had two legacies .
She found out today that a girl who did not go thru recruitment was offered , and accepted, a snap bid from one of the sororities. She had no excuse for not going thru rush , she just didn't want to Rush at the time . This is so unfair to all the girls who put in hours after hours during a very long recruitment. Not to mention the fee they all paid for Rush. Is this process of taking a girl who didn't Rush even allowed?
As a mom, I am horrified at how the bed quota is allowed to exist at IU. Wonderful young women are being crushed . This unfair system is brutal on our children.
I sent my daughter to IU for growth and gain. Never once did I imagine it would
Rip my daughters self confidence right out from under her. Come on IU - make this right! After all, this is happening on your University.

[Xidelt]

Quit being so dramatic and playing the blame game.

[als463]

Originally Posted by Xidelt

Quit being so dramatic and playing the blame game.

Who are you talking to? Was that directed at me? You really need to get over yourself. I'm not being dramatic. Women who are crying that the system is unfair and that MY SISTERS (and the sisters of every other organization on that campus) are HORRIBLE women. You need to quit being so dramatic and playing the blame game. Now, please go elsewhere with your need to always have something to say to me. It's cute but, really annoying.