Iowa Recruitment

[Titchou]

One of the places that is talked about as being most competitive is Alabama. And every year during recruitment women come here complaining about the deep cuts and all the women released from recruitment. But in the final analysis, Bama usually places about 89-91% of the women who register for recruitment. That's a stellar stat when looking at 2000 PNMs...and the vast majority of the 200 or so who are released are the grade risks and along a handful of QRs and those you drop out because they don't like the invites they got.

[Low D Flat]

No easy answers here

The sororities should see what the college sees: the HS TRANSCRIPT (not just GPA) and test scores. The GPA is meaningless on its own when you're trying to compare young women who were in AP classes at New Trier and those who were one of 6 graduates at Teenytown Nebraska-Border Agricultural High.

[GolfersLady]

Originally Posted by Low D Flat

The sororities should see what the college sees: the HS TRANSCRIPT (not just GPA) and test scores. The GPA is meaningless on its own when you're trying to compare young women who were in AP classes at New Trier and those who were one of 6 graduates at Teenytown Nebraska-Border Agricultural High.

I understand it is frustrating but as a chapter advisor and professional in college admissions, there just has to be an equalizer. A formula to be able to look through thousands of transcripts and test scores through the same scope. At Iowa, it's their recalculated GPA.

Chapters don't have the capacity to individually review each PNM's transcripts and test scores. Nor should that private student information be available for any and all to see (http://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/f...rpa/index.html).

[ISUKappa]

Originally Posted by GolfersLady

I understand it is frustrating but as a chapter advisor and professional in college admissions, there just has to be an equalizer. A formula to be able to look through thousands of transcripts and test scores through the same scope. At Iowa, it's their recalculated GPA.

Chapters don't have the capacity to individually review each PNM's transcripts and test scores. Nor should that private student information be available for any and all to see (http://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/f...rpa/index.html).

IIRC, the chapters were given a binder full of transcripts for each PNM a decade ago-at least for one or two recruitments I assisted with. It was an enormous amount of information to go through, and too much personal information (I'm pretty sure SSN and other information was blacked out, but still...) was made available. It was overwhelming, and in the grand scheme of things where I advised, didn't make much of a difference. I'm glad it's just GPAs now, even if they aren't always a true indication of academic ability.

[scrapcat]

Originally Posted by Low D Flat

The sororities should see what the college sees: the HS TRANSCRIPT (not just GPA) and test scores. The GPA is meaningless on its own when you're trying to compare young women who were in AP classes at New Trier and those who were one of 6 graduates at Teenytown Nebraska-Border Agricultural High.

My hubby's family is from teenytiny town... My nephew showed such great promise he was #2 in his class... So impressive...out of a class of 18. He didn't get into u of Wisconsin, his parents couldn't believe it! Several years ago the local LIons club was unable to give out their academic scholarship to a graduate...the top student only had a 3.0. Gpa, the scholarship requires a 3.5,

[pearlalum]

Any thoughts on what quota will be?

[Titchou]

Many schools vet the PNMs GPA and pass that information on to the chapters. And it's the GPA the college accepts for admissions purposes. So it puts everyone on equal footing with admissions and recruitment. I know it's hard to differentiate between high schools but there has to be an equalizer, as GolfersLady said.

[Low D Flat]

Nor should that private student information be available for any and all to see

Of course not -- no more or less than the GPA. The PNMs voluntarily share that info with Panhellenic when they want to rush. Any student has the right to waive FERPA. We're not talking about putting their ACTs on their name tags.

The U of Iowa gives admissions decisions within two business days based on a transcript and ACT. It's a single page of data. You'd only need to glance at them to locate the PNMs whose GPAs understate their academic potential. Is it that different from looking at a rec?

I know it's time-consuming work. I just think there's a perverse incentive to PNMs to coast in HS if they know the GPA is all that matters. No college freshman should feel (accurately, in this case) that she's hurt herself by doing harder work in HS. If there has to be a single equalizer, using the ACT would come closer to being fair; it's actually the same test given in every high school.

[pearlalum]

Originally Posted by Low D Flat

Of course not -- no more or less than the GPA. The PNMs voluntarily share that info with Panhellenic when they want to rush. Any student has the right to waive FERPA. We're not talking about putting their ACTs on their name tags.

The U of Iowa gives admissions decisions within two business days based on a transcript and ACT. It's a single page of data. You'd only need to glance at them to locate the PNMs whose GPAs understate their academic potential. Is it that different from looking at a rec?

I know it's time-consuming work. I just think there's a perverse incentive to PNMs to coast in HS if they know the GPA is all that matters. No college freshman should feel (accurately, in this case) that she's hurt herself by doing harder work in HS. If there has to be a single equalizer, using the ACT would come closer to being fair; it's actually the same test given in every high school.

Working at a high school, I can tell you that I see many high ACT-scoring students who are lazy and aren't successful, and others that aren't great standardized test takers but are some of our most successful students and leaders. So, I don't think an ACT score would be a great equalizer.

[colordogs]

Interesting points made here. The state of Texas has an automatic admit policy for UT if you are in the top ten percent of your graduating class. And each year hundreds of students fail out. The education, true collegiate preparation, and the 4.0 gpa at many, many schools can't hold a candle to that of many high schools both public and private. As my son said after going away to college "I used to think some kids were really pretty dumb in my high school. Now I've figured it out, they were never dumb at all. In fact they were quite intelligent, just not comparitively"

I would tell you Titchou and GolferLady that for admissions Iowa may use a number as an equalizer for the straight out 48 hour admit but there is a mechanism in place for looking at a student in a more wholistic manner to include rigour of curriculum. While it may calculate out GPA wise the same, an A in PE or similar coursework is just not the same as an A in AP US History or AP Government.

I don't have an answer for how to make those grade cuts for sorority purposes...deferred recruitment would solve some of those issues. We chose to have each letter of recommendation be accompanied by an official HS transcript and to address the fact that while her official Iowa GPA sits less than .05 away from the standard 3.0 the reasons why she is not a "grade risk". From where I sit now, it appears as if that was pretty futile. Believe me, I am not saying she was a good fit for all chapters but I am certain that grades were a big issue.

[Titchou]

At least in Alabama, the core curriculum GPA is the one universities go by and so the ones the chapters get. Things like PE are not included.

[DubaiSis]

The sad but truth is there is ZERO way to look at a girl's info prior to rush and have any better than a crap shoot guess if she's going to be a quality student and member. I had good grades, lots of activities, good ACT (not great, should have retaken them after the hot day at UNI), etc. If my sorority membership had been determined by first semester college grades I wouldn't have had a chance. I REALLY wasn't prepared for how stuff gets done in college. We've all known girls who had meh grades and did great in college, and of course the reverse. And we know lousy test-takers and great test takers, and that those things aren't representative of their overall intelligence or ability to learn or succeed in college. The best you can hope for is a reasonable representation and time to actually meet the girl and determine for yourself. And then it's still a crap shoot.

[GolfersLady]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

The best you can hope for is a reasonable representation and time to actually meet the girl and determine for yourself. And then it's still a crap shoot.

Truth!

[pearlalum]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

The sad but truth is there is ZERO way to look at a girl's info prior to rush and have any better than a crap shoot guess if she's going to be a quality student and member. I had good grades, lots of activities, good ACT (not great, should have retaken them after the hot day at UNI), etc. If my sorority membership had been determined by first semester college grades I wouldn't have had a chance. I REALLY wasn't prepared for how stuff gets done in college. We've all known girls who had meh grades and did great in college, and of course the reverse. And we know lousy test-takers and great test takers, and that those things aren't representative of their overall intelligence or ability to learn or succeed in college. The best you can hope for is a reasonable representation and time to actually meet the girl and determine for yourself. And then it's still a crap shoot.

Absolutely agree with this. If Panhellenic has a minimum GPA to rush, then shouldn't that just be the equalizer? But, of course, as in life, nothing is truly "equal." If you have a recruitment group with 20 girls, then maybe 10 have recs to a chapter, and 2 "know" somebody in that chapter, etc., so that puts the rest of those girls on "unequal" ground. It's never really "equal." Actives need to go with their gut in most circumstances.

[GolfersLady]

Since I've lost hope on any good Iowa recruitment stories this year, I just wanted to wish the chapters successful practicing tonight and a great start to round three for everyone tomorrow!