The Murder of Trayvon Martin

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by SOM

KSig RC: not at all too sure what to make of your posting. Not that it really matters to me.
All I was indicating was that several posters or postings perked up my interest in John McNeil's case enough to do a fast, quick, down and dirty search on it. And that was enough to place it on my list of things to follow-up on when I have some time to do so.

What you posted was an abominably sourced and insanely biased "rundown" - something that was borderline intellectually dishonest. The New Republic is a fairly well-regarded magazine, while the site you posted is a bizarre tea party-oriented opinion site. I figured you thought you'd posted something from a real news source - my bad.

I was surprised to see you bump this thread today with something that literally calls the question ("Did he break the law?") instead of the most important leak in the case to date (the photo of the bloody back of Zimmerman's head).

[SOM]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

What you posted was an abominably sourced and insanely biased "rundown" - something that was borderline intellectually dishonest. The New Republic is a fairly well-regarded magazine, while the site you posted is a bizarre tea party-oriented opinion site. I figured you thought you'd posted something from a real news source - my bad.

I was surprised to see you bump this thread today with something that literally calls the question ("Did he break the law?") instead of the most important leak in the case to date (the photo of the bloody back of Zimmerman's head).

Simple: No one, no story, no article, no pundit has been able to move me from Zimmerman becoming the only pure aggressor once he made his own mind up to leave his truck. To me, everything else that happened, that occurred is the result of that one conscious decision of Zimmerman's. Or what that wonderful phase from may an old cop show "Fruit of the poisonous vine" Which in turn would make Martin the only one standing his ground IF he was, it fact and truth, doing any sort of attacking. Or simply defending himself against someone attacking him with a visible gun. We could ague this but lets all see what the circus brings to town next ;>%

[SOM]

Two rather interesting, well written and long articles on the back-stories and back-histories of the NRA and Gun Control:
Trayvon Martin and America's Gun Laws:
Battleground America One nation, under the gun
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2...urrentPage=all

The Secret History of Guns
The Ku Klux Klan, Ronald Reagan, and, for most of its history, the NRA all worked to control guns. The Founding Fathers? They required gun ownership-and regulated it. And no group has more fiercely advocated the right to bear loaded weapons in public than the Black Panthers-the true pioneers of the modern pro-gun movement. In the battle over gun rights in America, both sides have distorted history and the law, and there's no resolution in sight.
http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/...-of-guns/8608/

[SOM]

The Real Injustice at the Heart of the Trayvon Martin Case-Did George Zimmerman Break the Law?
http://www.thenation.com/article/167...on-martin-case

[SOM]

Here is another case involving, perhaps, the other side of the coin:
Tonight on AC360: Stand your ground law under scrutiny in domestic violence case
Editor's note: Don't miss Gary Tuchman's interview with Marissa Alexander at 8 and 10 p.m. ET tonight on AC360°.
Marissa Alexander, a 31-year-old mother of three, pleaded for her freedom as an inmate in the Duval County Jail in Jacksonville, Florida.
"This is my life I'm fighting for," she said while wiping away tears. She added, "If you do everything to get on the right side of the law, and it is a law that does not apply to you, where do you go from there?"
Alexander is referring to Florida's so-called 'stand your ground' law, a law that has come under scrutiny since the killing of Trayvon Martin. Unlike the Martin case, which involved one stranger killing another, Alexander's case involved her gun and her abusive husband.
http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2012/04/2...n=1&hpt=ac_bn1

http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/24/justic...law/index.html

LIONEL PODCAST: Have You Heard the One About Marissa Alexander?
Explain the difference(s). Marissa Alexander faces a minimum mandatory 20 years in the hoosegow over firing a round into the ceiling of her home. Oh, I forgot to mention, her husband and two stepsons were present and claim she trained the weapon on them first. They also claim she was the aggressor. And did I mention she had a carry permit for her gun?
Is it about race? The local NAACP chapter President is in her corner and vehemently suggests that Stand Your Ground (SYG) should be implemented to acquit her. Big Ange Corey, that’s right, that Big Ange, opposes any such leniency, dismissal of charges or new trial, The jury has spoken.
So what gives? Welcome to the world of big time law, kids. A million cases, a million decisions. One law.
So what do I do now? Thank Zeus you’re not Marissa Alexander and enjoy the podcast.
http://www.podjockey.com/lionelmedia...ssa-alexander/

Marissa Alexander: A Reverse Trayvon Martin?
http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor...ter_socialflow

[SOM]

Seems as if there are more cases that have gotten "over-looked" until now:
Black Man’s Killing in Georgia Eludes Spotlight
LYONS, Ga. — Norman Neesmith was sleeping in his home on a rural farm road here in onion country when a noise woke him up.
He grabbed the .22-caliber pistol he kept next to his bed and went to investigate. He found two young brothers who had been secretly invited to party with an 18-year-old relative he had raised like a daughter and her younger friend. The young people were paired up in separate bedrooms. There was marijuana and sex.
Over the course of the next confusing minutes on a January morning in 2011, there would be a struggle. The young men would make a terrified run for the door. Mr. Neesmith, who is 62 and white, fired four shots. One of them hit Justin Patterson, who was 22 and black.
The bullet pierced his side, and he died in Mr. Neesmith’s yard. His younger brother, Sha’von, then 18, ran through the onion fields in the dark, frantically trying to call his mother.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/26/us...eorgia.html?hp

[PiKA2001]

Originally Posted by SOM

Seems as if there are more cases that have gotten "over-looked" until now:
Black Man’s Killing in Georgia Eludes Spotlight
LYONS, Ga. — Norman Neesmith was sleeping in his home on a rural farm road here in onion country when a noise woke him up.
He grabbed the .22-caliber pistol he kept next to his bed and went to investigate. He found two young brothers who had been secretly invited to party with an 18-year-old relative he had raised like a daughter and her younger friend. The young people were paired up in separate bedrooms. There was marijuana and sex.
Over the course of the next confusing minutes on a January morning in 2011, there would be a struggle. The young men would make a terrified run for the door. Mr. Neesmith, who is 62 and white, fired four shots. One of them hit Justin Patterson, who was 22 and black.
The bullet pierced his side, and he died in Mr. Neesmith’s yard. His younger brother, Sha’von, then 18, ran through the onion fields in the dark, frantically trying to call his mother.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/26/us...eorgia.html?hp

"Over-looked" how? We can't have a media circus around every shooting in this country, there just isn't enough hours in the day to allow it.

[SOM]

Originally Posted by PiKA2001

"Over-looked" how? We can't have a media circus around every shooting in this country, there just isn't enough hours in the day to allow it.

While I do understand, and can ague you point, this is just part of the whole article:
Over the past several weeks, the men’s parents, Deede and Julius Patterson, watched news of Trayvon Martin’s death in Florida and focused on the similarities. In both cases, an unarmed young black man died at the hands of someone of a different race.
And they began to wonder why no one was marching for their son, why people like the Rev. Al Sharpton had not booked a ticket to Toombs County. The local chapter of the N.A.A.C.P. has not even gotten involved, although Mr. Patterson’s father approached them.
“We are looking into the case,” said Michael Dennard, the president of the chapter, after a reporter called more than a year after the crime. He would not say more.
Why some cases with perceived racial implications catch the national consciousness and others do not is as much about the combined power of social and traditional media as it is about happenstance, said Ta-Nehisi Coates, a senior editor at The Atlantic who writes about racial issues.
Several events coalesced to push the Martin case forward: an apparently incomplete police investigation, no immediate arrest and Florida’s expansive self-defense law.
“These stories happen all the time,” Mr. Coates said. “It’s heartbreaking and tragic, but there’s not much news coverage unless the circumstances are truly, truly unusual.”
“Stories like the south Georgia killing don’t have the same particulars,” he said. “One of the great tragedies is that people get shot under questionable circumstances in this country all the time.”
Although the facts surrounding the case in Florida and the case in Georgia are quite different, both involve a claim of legally sanctioned self-defense, a dead young black man and, for the Pattersons and the Martins, deep concern that race played a role in the deaths of their sons.
“I definitely believe racism is why he was shot,” said Mrs. Patterson, who recently left her job as director of operations at a uniform company and moved to another small Georgia town. “And for him to get nothing but a slap on the wrist? There is something wrong here.”
That race played a significant part is not hard to imagine here in a county that was named after Robert Toombs, a general and one of the organizers of the Confederate government. A black woman has never been named Miss Vidalia Onion in the annual festival that begins Thursday. And until last year in neighboring Montgomery County, there were two proms — one for whites and one for blacks.
Still, like so many other crimes where race might be a factor, this one is not so clear-cut. Mr. Neesmith says he felt threatened. He says he aches for the parents but believes none of this would have happened if the young men had not been in his house when they should not have been.

[PeppyGPhiB]

Originally Posted by SOM

Still, like so many other crimes where race might be a factor, this one is not so clear-cut. Mr. Neesmith says he felt threatened. He says he aches for the parents but believes none of this would have happened if the young men had not been in his house when they should not have been.

Weren't the young men invited to be there - invited by the girls residing in the house? You can't shoot people just because you don't know them, especially if it appears possible that they were there as guests of other residents of the house. This is a lesson to the girls that their actions could have bad consequences for the homeowner.

[PiKA2001]

Originally Posted by SOM

Why some cases with perceived racial implications catch the national consciousness and others do not is as much about the combined power of social and traditional media as it is about happenstance, said Ta-Nehisi Coates, a senior editor at The Atlantic who writes about racial issues.
Several events coalesced to push the Martin case forward: an apparently incomplete police investigation, no immediate arrest and Florida’s expansive self-defense law.
“These stories happen all the time,” Mr. Coates said. “It’s heartbreaking and tragic, but there’s not much news coverage unless the circumstances are truly, truly unusual.”
“Stories like the south Georgia killing don’t have the same particulars,” he said. “One of the great tragedies is that people get shot under questionable circumstances in this country all the time.”

Oh wow look, that same article you posted just went over why this isn't getting the same media circus that the Martin/Zimmerman case is. Cool.

[DaemonSeid]

There is the case of Werdensheim brothers here in MD

[SOM]

Well it seems, for the moment at least, that someone lied while under oath. Or at the very least withheld information and deceived the court and court officers. And keep in mind that both of his parents had jobs/careers in the court systems. His father was a Judge and had to know just what was going on here....Hummm.
Attorney: Zimmerman Had $200K From Web Donations
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/a...5#.T5qsNbMvkUU

George Zimmerman Remains Free - For Now (DETAILS)

George Zimmerman will remain free - for now. Circuit Judge Kenneth Lester Jr. said he's not going to make a decision about bond until he has all the facts regarding the PayPal accounts and donation lists that have been given to Zimmerman.
Read more: http://globalgrind.com/news/george-z...#ixzz1tFrRgIbD

Trayvon Martin Case: George Zimmerman's lawyer says he didn't know about $200,000 in donations before bond hearing
Mark O'Mara told the judge Friday that Zimmerman's family hadn't informed him about the money before his client was granted $150,000 bond.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_1...%3BcontentBody

How George Zimmerman’s Prosecutors Missed $200,000
Florida prosecutors said on Friday they were surprised to learn that George Zimmerman had raised more than $200,000 for his own defense in the killing of unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin.
But a week ago, those same prosecutors had a chance to grill Zimmerman and his family about the fund and mostly took a pass.
The revelation about just how much money Zimmerman collected came on Thursday night when his attorney told CNN that his client managed to raise the cash in just a few weeks by using a crudely built website and a PayPal account.
The six-figure surprise was a major departure from what the Zimmerman family claimed during sworn testimony at a hearing last week.
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmem...in.php?ref=fpa

[SOM]

George Zimmerman’s crude Myspace page from 2005 uncovered-While it includes photos of an ethnically diverse group of friends, the murder defendant’s 2005 web presence includes disparaging remarks about Mexicans.
Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/0...#storylink=cpy

Now We Know It's Real! Zimmerman's Attorney Confirms MySpace Page (DETAILS)

Read more: http://globalgrind.com/news/george-z...#ixzz1tj2hecoA
Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/0...#storylink=cpy

[Kevin]

Well now it's too much of a circus for me to care anymore. His 2005 Myspace page? That warrants multiple stories, some by actual newspapers?

I'll be interested in the post mortem of his trial. His 7 year old Myspace page, however, is not something I care too much about.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Well now it's too much of a circus for me to care anymore.

Agreed.