Why Study Algebra?

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by agzg

Also, game designers use math A LOT, and A LOT of algebra - so if he likes video games, that might be a way to relate. People who write computer programs use all sorts of math, including algebra.

Very true. He loves video games, so his teacher tried this one. The answer he got was "I don't care how they come up with them. I just like to play them." Oy.

(Meanwhile, mom and I have added our own style of motivation. No video games at all on school days -- the "old" rule was no more than one hour of "screen time" on school days -- unless and until we, his teacher and his tutor see improvement. He doesn't have to start making As all of a sudden, but we have to see that he's trying his best.)

Originally Posted by agzg

Something as simple as figuring out what you need to tip (total times .2 equals x) is a good example of algebra. . . . .Also, baking! How do you double or halve a recipe?

Originally Posted by ree-Xi

From figuring out tips (divide by ten then add half to get to 15%), . . . . to adjusting recipes for fewer or more servings than the original calls for, to estimating project timelines, to figuring out how far it is from point A to point B, or reading a "to scale" map, I absolutely use math on a regular basis.

Right, but these are all basic math -- for the most part standard addition, subtraction, multiplication and division. He has that stuff down. He gets how he'll use that kind of math throughout his life. He doesn't get how he'll use algebra -- e.g., linear equations, to use what they're working on now -- in everyday life.


There's some good food for thought here. Thanks, everyone and keep them coming.

[agzg]

I'm thinking of a million ways I use it now.

Figuring out the percentage of my income I spend on health insurance is a big one (since it's open enrollment right now).

These are all very "adult" answers that might be lost on him, though. I'd stick to baking.

[KSig RC]

MC, you may not use by-rote algebra every day, but I'm certain you use the same sort of logic every day - it's very much related to the "lawyer brain" (solving for unknowns/inconsistencies).

Essentially, any time you're solving for an unknown, you're using algebraic thinking - and that's a skill he will want to have, even if it's just wondering how much he can spend on two different items while still making budget for the month, or how to determine his 401(k) match sweet spot.

These aren't sexy reasons, but they do show that the reason why algebra is hard (it requires you to attack a problem in reverse, essentially) is the same as its benefit: an angle to attack problems that you didn't have before.

[preciousjeni]

I use algebra on a regular basis, especially to figure out complex percentages. I have trouble visualizing where the numbers go in the equation, so I'll write an equation fully out and then do the calculations in my head.

People use basic algebra all the time without thinking about it. Once you have the concepts in mind, you forget that it's "algebra" and you just think of it as working out an equation.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by AlwaysSAI

I currently teach Algebra I in the same state you live, MC, and in a county not very far away. Let me know if you decide you want an algebra tutor. (;

This is very true and in the state you live, it is a result of standardized testing. There are "more creative" things that can be done with Algebra but because Algebra I is and always will be an EOC class, teachers are less likely to do more fun things. Their goal is to teach it exactly how it will look on the EOC so that the students can pass it. (As an special ed teacher teaching Algebra, my approach is a bit different, but gets the same result.)

This is certainly part of the problem, but I came along long before teaching for the test, and it was a problem then as well. Teaching for the test exacerbates the problem, I think.

And thanks for the tutoring offer. We actually have a really great tutor and who is making some good progress. She's a friend whose family he's known all his life, and she has a son a year older than ours with similar spectrum challenges, so she has a really good sense of how to approach things with him. She is seeing promise.

Originally Posted by psusue

The other point I have is that he has no idea yet what will truly interest him-- many of the topics that he may go on to love haven't yet been covered.

Exactly! We keep reminding him of this, along with the basic "you need this to get into college to study what you want to study." Your whole post was very helpful and encouraging. Thanks!

Originally Posted by southbymidwest

MysticCat, I think your son has to look at this at a macro versus micro level also. School is about learning about all sorts of stuff, even that which you don't have an affinity for, or like. I'd bet big money that the vast majority of us took classes in something that we despised, and thought that they were "stupid" to take.

He definitely does need to look at it this way, and we hit on this every time we talk about algebra. The challenge is that when you're talking about a 14-year-old with Asperger's, getting him to that macro-perspective is a lot easier said than done.


Thanks everyone for the suggestions. There's so much that I don't think that I can respond to everything everyone has said, but I really appreciate it all!


ETA:

Originally Posted by psusue

For example, I HATED math with the burning passion of a thousand fiery suns . . . .

I meant to give psusue major props for this reference.

[southbymidwest]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

He definitely does need to look at it this way, and we hit on this every time we talk about algebra. The challenge is that when you're talking about a 14-year-old with Asperger's, getting him to that macro-perspective is a lot easier said than done.

MC, you are so clever, I am sure that you have tried every which way to get him to understand the importance of algebra on mathematical and non-mathematical levels. But I do find this to be a very interesting and educational discussion, and I am glad that you brought it up.

[mayasophia]

Algebra is needed for construction, such as if you are building a table or laying tile on a new floor. Algebra is needed in all types of projects that require building, that is if you want to do it right.

Algebra is also important if you ever want to get good with money and understanding dividends and interest rates and if you are making a decent return on an investment.

Algebra is also important for programming as well as just basic counting, say if you need to do fractions and split a certain amount of money between multiple people at different rates.

Hope that helps

[agzg]

Converting the standard system of measurement to the metric system?

Linear equations are the lead-in to geometry - but you have to understand how to solve it before you can move on to harder geometry concepts - which plays into figuring out square footage of houses, how much paint you'll need to paint all the walls in a room, how many tiles you need to tile a kitchen... just cook up some home improvement projects! I'd love to say "we need to re-floor the kitchen because our kid is studying linear equations."

[knight_shadow]

http://www.thefutureschannel.com/algebra_real_world.php

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=...w=1229&bih=823

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=...w=1229&bih=823

[agzg]

He'll use a lot of linear equations in the future if he studies economics (some four year colleges require everyone to take at least one econ course). Understanding them now will help him.

[BraveMaroon]

Honestly he may never use the linear equations and so forth, but unfortunately, that's not the point.


The point of most of the classes you take is the process you use to learn the material and not the material itself.


Much like at least half the meetings I attend aren't directly relevant to my job, but because I am asked to be there, I go.

It's a life skill.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by agzg

He'll use a lot of linear equations in the future if he studies economics (which everyone has to on some level if they go to a four year college).

Really? I never studied economics in any form at all, and I don't get the sense that I'm unusual in that.

BTW, I had to take one math course in college. I picked the easiest one I could find.

Originally Posted by agzg

Linear equations are the lead-in to geometry - but you have to understand how to solve it before you can move on to harder geometry concepts - which plays into figuring out square footage of houses, how much paint you'll need to paint all the walls in a room, how many tiles you need to tile a kitchen... just cook up some home improvement projects! I'd love to say "we need to re-floor the kitchen because our kid is studying linear equations."

Okay, I'll be honest here. I do all of these things all of the time, and I don't see any connection at all with linear equations (y=mx+b or the other forms). All I need to figure out square footage is a tape measure; I don't need to know the slope of the line or how it graphs on a plane.

Am I missing something? Are my pathetic understandings of algebra showing?

Originally Posted by BraveMaroon

Honestly he may never use the linear equations and so forth, but unfortunately, that's not the point.

The point of most of the classes you take is the process you use to learn the material and not the material itself.

Much like at least half the meetings I attend aren't directly relevant to my job, but because I am asked to be there, I go.

It's a life skill.

Yeah, I think that's the bottom-line answer. Unfortunately, for an Aspergian, that frequently isn't a good enough answer. It's a common Asperger's trait -- the need to understand and buy into the value of something before expending any energy on it.

Thanks for the links, k_s.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Really? I never studied economics in any form at all, and I don't get the sense that I'm unusual in that.

BTW, I had to take one math course in college. I picked the easiest one I could find.

Okay, I'll be honest here. I do all of these things all of the time, and I don't see any connection at all with linear equations (y=mx+b or the other forms). All I need to figure out square footage is a tape measure; I don't need to know the slope of the line or how it graphs on a plane.

Am I missing something? Are my pathetic understandings of algebra showing?

Econ's becoming more and more common. I had to take three for my major in undegrad, but every major had to take at least two. I had to take the additional International Economics. I also had to take three in grad school, and surprisingly enough, it was the same three I had to take in undergrad but at a higher level (Micro, Macro, International). My major in undergrad was Foreign Language (International Government) and my major in grad school was "Badass."

Since linear equations are a lead-in for geometry, that's where you're using it to get floor space. Plus, if he goes into construction, contractors use it all the time, especially for designing entrances to buildings, etc.

It sounds kindof random, but figuring out slope goes into things like handicap ramps, etc. - which you can point out to him every time he comes across one. If the slope is all jacked up, it's not of much use to a person in a wheelchair. Even stairs are designed using slope.

The graph on the plane is just to conceptualize the concept in a context where it's not immediately apparent. And for things like statistical analysis, economic understanding, etc. where it's ideas instead of physical space.

Also, I know respiratory therapists use things like linear equations to figure out how much of one treatment a person should get, and I believe there's an equivalent for radiologists. Which seems random but I've become intimately familiar with both a Rad Tech associate's degree and a Respiratory Care associates degree and they use/do a shit ton of graphing.

You also need it for graphic design careers.

[BraveMaroon]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Yeah, I think that's the bottom-line answer. Unfortunately, for an Aspergian, that frequently isn't a good enough answer. It's a common Asperger's trait -- the need to understand and buy into the value of something before expending any energy on it.

Ok, yeah - I get that completely, and that's not just an Asperger's trait. Most of us dig in our heels on things we don't want to expend effort on.

[knight_shadow]

At my alma mater, Econ was reserved for business students.