Kaplan University

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by HannahXO

Many students at "real" universities find plenty of opportunities to go to class in their pajamas anyway Personally I couldn't do this but it happens!

But even then, they still have to put on shoes and leave the dorm. It seems like these "universities" market themselves towards lazy people. I'm not saying that people who go to online schools are lazy, but many lazy people are attracted to it.

[DrPhil]

"I'm not saying that people who go to all-you-can-eat buffets are unhealthy, but many unhealthy people are attracted to all-you-can-eat buffets."

I'm not going so far as to label these people lazy in a general sense. I despise Kaplan University, University of Phoenix, and the lesser known online schools (lesser known usually means even more questionable accreditation and something you should stay the hell away from). The people who choose to give their money to these schools for bachelors, graduate (I know of fools who thought they got real PhDs from online schools that no one ever heard of), and associates degrees tend to be people who have limited understanding of academia and their current or potential field(s) of expertise. Many of these people are very busy with work and/or family and struggle to find time for even these online classes.

However, there are students in these programs who ARE lazy and that is one reason why they wouldn't survive at a "real" college or university. They most often aren't saving money by going to Kaplan University and University of Phoenix. They consider themselves to be saving time and finding a place that suits them.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

But even then, they still have to put on shoes and leave the dorm. It seems like these "universities" market themselves towards lazy people. I'm not saying that people who go to online schools are lazy, but many lazy people are attracted to it.

I think the pajama ad is actually for a service that finds you a school, not an actual school. They talk about how they'll find you the program that takes the least amount of time and is the cheapest.

[Munchkin03]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...editorsPicks_1

Undergraduate new-student enrollment fell 25.6% at DeVry's namesake university in the quarter ended June 30. Kaplan reported a 47% decline in new-student enrollment for the June quarter.

It looks like we'll be seeing a correction in this snake-oil market.

[KSUViolet06]

Maybe folks are realizing that getting a BA in your PJs is not the way to go?

/snob.

[DrPhil]

Amen!

It's about darn time!

[agzg]

Perhaps that and the fact that education, particularly for-profit education, works in a counter-cyclical market. As economic outlook brightens (and for some it is), fewer people enroll in school, because the costs of going to school (explicit and implicit) outweigh the benefits of putting off working for 3 to 4 years. Enrollments were at their highest in 2008, 2009, 2010 because of the hopelessness of the job market (which is still pretty icky).

Combined with the harsh press, of course, could mean a drop in enrollments. Those companies that have ground-based technical and vocational sides (Everest, etc) are faring a little better but their enrollments drop almost exclusively because of the changes in the job market, since they're not affected as much by national press and more by local (so, problems at an Everest campus in Illinois do not necessarily affect enrollments at an Everest campus in Phoenix).

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by agzg

Perhaps that and the fact that education, particularly for-profit education, works in a counter-cyclical market. As economic outlook brightens (and for some it is), fewer people enroll in school, because the costs of going to school (explicit and implicit) outweigh the benefits of putting off working for 3 to 4 years. Enrollments were at their highest in 2008, 2009, 2010 because of the hopelessness of the job market (which is still pretty icky).

Combined with the harsh press, of course, could mean a drop in enrollments. Those companies that have ground-based technical and vocational sides (Everest, etc) are faring a little better but their enrollments drop almost exclusively because of the changes in the job market, since they're not affected as much by national press and more by local (so, problems at an Everest campus in Illinois do not necessarily affect enrollments at an Everest campus in Phoenix).

Maybe it's all of those factors. I'm just hoping for a correction in the educational market in general. I saw the beginnings of it when I left school, but the Masters is becoming severely devalued in some fields. Maybe now schools--online and bricks-and-mortar--will be more selective in the programs they choose to have, and the students they choose to enroll.

Law schools are experiencing it too--a lot of universities will add law schools because the money and prestige a law school will bring, and they can't prepare their students for a competitive market. Granted, you can't get your JD online, but the same forces drove that boom in law school enrollment.

[als463]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

Maybe it's all of those factors. I'm just hoping for a correction in the educational market in general. I saw the beginnings of it when I left school, but the Masters is becoming severely devalued in some fields. Maybe now schools--online and bricks-and-mortar--will be more selective in the programs they choose to have, and the students they choose to enroll.

Law schools are experiencing it too--a lot of universities will add law schools because the money and prestige a law school will bring, and they can't prepare their students for a competitive market. Granted, you can't get your JD online, but the same forces drove that boom in law school enrollment.

Not true. I'm pretty certain that it is Kaplan that now offers an online JD. It is only accepted in the state of California, though.

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by als463

Not true. I'm pretty certain that it is Kaplan that now offers an online JD. It is only accepted in the state of California, though.

Who'd want to get a JD online? The fact that it's only accepted in CA speaks volumes...

[Kevin]

As far as the JD program, there are actually quite a few schools that offer online LLMs, but that actually makes some sort of sense in a lot of cases, and in a lot of cases, very reputable schools are offering the program, e.g., the University of Alabama.

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by Kevin

As far as the JD program, there are actually quite a few schools that offer online LLMs, but that actually makes some sort of sense in a lot of cases, and in a lot of cases, very reputable schools are offering the program, e.g., the University of Alabama.

The LLM doesn't bother me so much--don't you have to be a practicing attorney to do that? A bunch of my friends have gotten their LLM in Taxation, especially during the recession when it paid to be competitive.

It's just...doesn't the JD require some level of group interaction? You can't really get that in a chatroom. Is this going to be the next Cooley? (Totally O/T: I live behind a courthouse, and there are always 10-12 cars parked that have Cooley tags. I guess they're getting employed somewhere.)

[KSigkid]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

Who'd want to get a JD online? The fact that it's only accepted in CA speaks volumes...

The funny thing about that is CA (supposedly) has one of the hardest bar exams (along with NY). I haven't taken either so I only know by reputation.

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

The LLM doesn't bother me so much--don't you have to be a practicing attorney to do that? A bunch of my friends have gotten their LLM in Taxation, especially during the recession when it paid to be competitive.

It's just...doesn't the JD require some level of group interaction? You can't really get that in a chatroom. Is this going to be the next Cooley? (Totally O/T: I live behind a courthouse, and there are always 10-12 cars parked that have Cooley tags. I guess they're getting employed somewhere.)

I think there are ways to get an LLM without being an attorney. Linda Greenhouse received one from Yale, I believe, although she may have had special accomodations because she was the Supreme Court correspondent for the Times.

One main benefit that you'll get in a "traditional" law school is the alumni connection. If you're smart, you're going to choose a law school where you can use the degree to help you get a job in your chosen area of law/area of the country. My law school wasn't the highest rank, but it has a good reputation in my region and there are a ton of alumni in the region who do the hiring for their law firm/legal department.

An online law school isn't going to help with that goal. That doesn't even get into the interaction/learning benefits that you get from the brick and mortar law schools.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

The LLM doesn't bother me so much--don't you have to be a practicing attorney to do that? A bunch of my friends have gotten their LLM in Taxation, especially during the recession when it paid to be competitive.

A lot of LLM programs are for non-U.S. attorneys. It's to educate them in one year (instead of 3) on the peculiarities of the U.S. legal system. Others cover specific subject matter, e.g., native american law, international law, taxation.

I'm not sure what the entrance requirements are. I don't see why you'd absolutely have to have a J.D., but if you want to practice law, most states, maybe all states require a J.D. or equivalent degree from an ABA accredited law school.

It's just...doesn't the JD require some level of group interaction? You can't really get that in a chatroom. Is this going to be the next Cooley? (Totally O/T: I live behind a courthouse, and there are always 10-12 cars parked that have Cooley tags. I guess they're getting employed somewhere.)

Yeah, I can't really see the online route working. The proper law school experience requires the law student to be humiliated repeatedly by faculty members in front of his or her peers, or at least to have the possibility looming.

[DrPhil]

I saw Shannon Doherty on an LMN movie today and quickly turned the channel.

Hours later, as I was watching a re-run of Love & Hip Hop, Shannon Doherty's new Education Connection commercial aired. What a damn shame. I guess their other annoying dancing/singing commercials weren't working too well.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-501465_1...84-501465.html