Fraternity Rush at Kansas

[gtdxeric]

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

You watch out for your house and keep brothers out of trouble by having a pledge driving program, nationals says it's hazing.

I'm going to play devil's advocate here. If it's really about keeping brothers out of trouble, why not have a program where both brothers and pledges take a turn driving people around? This would ensure that you could keep the program going year round, not just in fall when you have lots of pledges.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by gtdxeric

I'm going to play devil's advocate here. If it's really about keeping brothers out of trouble, why not have a program where both brothers and pledges take a turn driving people around? This would ensure that you could keep the program going year round, not just in fall when you have lots of pledges.

I know a woman who used to be an advisor to her sorority had told the girls if they ever needed a ride to call her, and the national told her SHE wasn't even allowed to do so. The reasoning that was if a member - pledge, alum, or collegian - drove someone home, it put the liability burden on the sorority for anything that might happen.

I'm sure lots of chapters do have programs like this - because they care about their brothers'/sisters' safety - but sadly, they have to do it under the table.

[EE-BO]

Originally Posted by Kedzman

I am disappointed in your thinking because it's too easy and common. Most Greeks join for a lot of the wrong reasons - they just wanna party. They miss the point that all of our national organizations were founded 100+ years ago for virtuous and nobel reasons. Somewhere along the way, the culture changed, values changed and so did fraternities.

National organizations offer their top awards to high-achieving chapters that live out their founding principles. This takes a lot of hard work, dedication, delayed gratification, discipline, accountability & more. The fact that you don't value such awards or the organizations who earn them is an indictment on your character.

Throwing big parties and breaking the rules isn't unique or difficult. Rather, it is common and easy. Thus, you are members of common, lethargic organizations. You are like dinosaurs marching toward extinction and you don't even realize it. You laugh at hard work and embrace folly.

I will try to be polite here.

I strongly disagree with your first paragraph. We are talking about SOCIAL fraternities here. While it is absolutely true that founding fathers of fraternities put forth noble ideals to strengthen the bonds of brotherhood and create an organization greater than any individual member- the concept was always socially driven. And if you read up on your history you will find that partying and pranks etc. were a HUGE part of fraternity existence in the early days. Fraternities have been mistrusted and misunderstood from day 1 by a segment of the population and by many universities.

Big parties are just a reflection of what most people do when they are young- no matter what kind of organizations or friendships they have. When my parents and grandparents would have dinner parties or other events with fellow Army buddies- they retold great stories about the parties and the fun times. They did not sit around reading from the Officer's Code.

When I go to alumni parties, we talk about all the crazy stuff we did in school- we don't sit down and reread our pledge manuals.

Partying together is where the brotherhood comes from. It does not have to involve alcohol or drugs, though it often does. But again that is no different than any other group of people on this planet.

What is forcing some change right now are legal realities which affect other organizations besides fraternities. GLOs are not the only groups that routinely get sued when someone cannot control their own behavior and is seeking a scapegoat.

Now we do have to deal with that, but it does not mean that in dealing with it we are rejecting 100+ years of history and saying "that was all bad and this new way is all good." That is just salesmanship and spin- usually uttered by professional fundraisers seeking to raise tax free money for national fraternities. It has its place in the current financial environment for most fraternities, but it is not the 100% reality.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Kedzman

Most Greeks join for a lot of the wrong reasons - they just wanna party. They miss the point that all of our national organizations were founded 100+ years ago for virtuous and nobel reasons. Somewhere along the way, the culture changed, values changed and so did fraternities.

Brother, I hear what you're saying, but I don't agree 100%.

Back a few years ago, when I was just starting off in my own colony's existence, a long time alumnus who also happens to be very influential within our organization introduced me to the 'iron triangle,' or 3 B's of recruiting -- that being babes, bucks, and booze (not necessarily in that order). These things are key to how many very successful organizations operate today.

Later on, I attended our College of Chapters in 2001 (the first return to Lexington). There, HQ introduced the Values Based Recruitment program. I think that's what you're alluding to. VBR is great in that it involves somewhat of a paradigm shift in recruiting. No more do they want us to go after the guys who are going through Rush only to have a good time -- we want the guys who are after what we're after -- Brotherhood, Support and Friendship. We talk up things like our core values, the reason we were founded, etc.

I still think that the key to success lies somewhere between the old and the new. I think values based recruiting is wonderful, but at the same time, we shouldn't forget the social aspect of the organization, the old 3 B's. Both things are important. I'm not going to pretend to have some sort of cohesive philosophy about recruitment and what works. It never really was my forté. I just think that the truth is somewhere in between the old ways and the new way.. and I'll just leave it at that.

(my opinions are my own, and I do not speak for any other person or entity here)

[Kedzman]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Brother, I hear what you're saying, but I don't agree 100%.

Back a few years ago, when I was just starting off in my own colony's existence, a long time alumnus who also happens to be very influential within our organization introduced me to the 'iron triangle,' or 3 B's of recruiting -- that being babes, bucks, and booze (not necessarily in that order). These things are key to how many very successful organizations operate today.

Later on, I attended our College of Chapters in 2001 (the first return to Lexington). There, HQ introduced the Values Based Recruitment program. I think that's what you're alluding to. VBR is great in that it involves somewhat of a paradigm shift in recruiting. No more do they want us to go after the guys who are going through Rush only to have a good time -- we want the guys who are after what we're after -- Brotherhood, Support and Friendship. We talk up things like our core values, the reason we were founded, etc.

I still think that the key to success lies somewhere between the old and the new. I think values based recruiting is wonderful, but at the same time, we shouldn't forget the social aspect of the organization, the old 3 B's. Both things are important. I'm not going to pretend to have some sort of cohesive philosophy about recruitment and what works. It never really was my forté. I just think that the truth is somewhere in between the old ways and the new way.. and I'll just leave it at that.

(my opinions are my own, and I do not speak for any other person or entity here)

Brother,

I am disappointed to see you perpetuating "the Iron Triangle" or the "3-B's" of recruitment. Just because that alumnus is influential doesn't mean he is right. We are called to a higher standard than that.

I've been involved in Greek life since 1987 and seen a lot. The 1980's were indeed "the big '80's" where fraternities surged in numbers, in part, due to the popularity of movies like Animal House (1977) and others to come. Until about 1986 or so, there were no rules. Fraternity parties were wide open. As a result, there were many alcohol related deaths, property damage to our historic homes and injuries - and of course, law suits. Risk management rules imposed by National organizations were the result of unchecked liability. Law suits financially threatened the existence of our National organizations.

Risk management heated up in the 1990's. Huge numbers of chapters around the nation were shut down. Other chapter went by way of the dinosaur and were victims of their own actions. The mid to late 1990's on my campus were devastating. At our chapter, for example, I knew it was game over when I saw our "good kids" leaving and the knuckleheads staying. Parties and drugs were increasing. Chapter involvement, GPA and recruitment numbers were decreasing. That was the beginning of the end. You cannot recruit quality TO the organization if you do not have quality IN the organization. Alumni stepped in a quitely pulled the charter. Massive drug busts happened at Delta Upsilon and Sigma Chi in 1999 - two of our historically best chapters. There was a strong "anti-establishment" attitude in the mid to late 1990's influenced by the "grunge" culture with young people - kind of similar to the decline of Greek life in the early to mid 1970's.

In 2005 and beyond, it seems many organizations are becoming a lot more responsible. New groups like ours are starting out on the right foot. Other organizations are trying hard to turn the tide of the culture because of the risk and poor results they have gotten.

I'll challenge you to make a slight paradigm shift. Instead of leading with Beer, Babes and Bucks - try leading with all of the attributes a top fraternity offers by way of leadership development and personal growth. What will happen is the best of the best will be attracted to you. From that, the bucks will come from higher manpower. The Babes will beat a path to your door because quality women desire to be with quality men. The Beer is simply a constant on a college campus and within fraternity culture. Everyone knows it's there. You don't need to flaunt it or promote it. Pushing parties only hurts you - it cannot help you. What I mean is, a party-centric recruitment message can scare away top students who become concerned that they will not be able to be high-achievers if the culture is too party oriented. Conversely, the party-only guys will find a home at your fraternity and they may bring little else to your chapter and put you at risk.

Again, if you lead with personal development, the bucks and babes will follow. The beer will always be there.

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by Kedzman

Brother,

I'll challenge you to make a slight paradigm shift. Instead of leading with Beer, Babes and Bucks - try leading with all of the attributes a top fraternity offers by way of leadership development and personal growth. What will happen is the best of the best will be attracted to you. From that, the bucks will come from higher manpower. The Babes will beat a path to your door because quality women desire to be with quality men. The Beer is simply a constant on a college campus and within fraternity culture. Everyone knows it's there. You don't need to flaunt it or promote it. Pushing parties only hurts you - it cannot help you. What I mean is, a party-centric recruitment message can scare away top students who become concerned that they will not be able to be high-achievers if the culture is too party oriented. Conversely, the party-only guys will find a home at your fraternity and they may bring little else to your chapter and put you at risk.

Again, if you lead with personal development, the bucks and babes will follow. The beer will always be there.

Nationals are supposed to say this kind of stuff, not actually mean it.

[62231]

I have no idea what you're talking about Kedzman. The chapters at my school that are on top of the social ladder are also home to the campus leaders.
I'll give an example breakdown for UF.
~130 members
~75 have some sort of leadership position in a campus organization other than the fraternity.
Probably 10-15 of those are very active in several campus organizations.
And ALL 130 know how to balance school with drinking and girls.

You're probably the same guy who claims it's too difficult to have quality and quantity in a pledge class.

[CrackerBarrel]

NIU is only about 5% Greek. This reflects poorly on the quality of Greek Life at NIU.

No, that reflects poorly on NIU.

Sigma Nu believes there is a market to create a winning organization that will appeal to those who have not been attracted to Greek Life at NIU thus far. We've accomplished that by recruiting 40 new men who would not have joined the Greek System otherwise.

So GDIs?

They have posted a 2.91 cumulative GPA as a fraternity vs. the All-Men's average of 2.70. Sigma Nu is the only NIU fraternity of the 15 that is above the All-Men's GPA making them the pre-dominant academic fraternity at NIU.

Woo hoo, I go to a school a lot better than NIU and even the chapters which are thought of as the coke-heads have a better GPA than that. They're outperforming you, at a much better school, on two hours of sleep a night. Really overacheiving there, huh?

To be the best, you have to attract the best. This new fraternity is not for average men or underachievers. We seek top students, athletes and leaders to claim the top spot amongst NIU's men's social fraternities.

Mmmhmm, and if you are attracting the best leaders, tell me again why you need a leadership development program? You said it yourself, you're a SOCIAL fraternity.