Tiers in The SEC

[macallan25]

Yeah I agree. I'm not a Big XII fluffer. The only other schools in the region that you can really include are SMU and TCU, and obviously they are not in the Big XII. It would even be hard for me to include TCU just because of how their set-up is.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by macallan25

Yeah I agree. I'm not a Big XII fluffer. The only other schools in the region that you can really include are SMU and TCU, and obviously they are not in the Big XII. It would even be hard for me to include TCU just because of how their set-up is.

Agreed.

I think SMU should be somewhere up there, perhaps in the upper 2nd...the top houses are tops, the tier in the middle is very questionable. The people it draws from are not the people I would wish in my fraternity. But Phi Delt definitely does well.

[bowsandtoes]

"Old Money" isn't really considered a technical term anymore, in relation to the War of Northern Aggression. It mostly means that the family has been wealthy for several generations. Yes I know that wealth does not equate to class, but its impossible to deny some connection. It is true that "a fool and his money are soon parted" so the very fact that a family is able to maintain their wealth should be an indication that they're doing something right.

That said, I'm not from an old money family (not ashamed of it either), neither are some of my pledge brothers, and I can tell you that there is honestly no distinction between the two within our fraternity.

In terms of certain towns producing more top-house guys, that's also true. Just as with family money, a town or neighborhood that has money will likely have better high schools, etc. For example in Dallas, even if you're not from a high-class background, if you go to a good private school or Highland Park, some of that is going to rub off on you.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by SECdomination

Guys on here talk about schools to recruit from and cities that we draw from because we know what to expect. That's why in bigger cities, certain high schools are important, and in smaller towns location is important.

100% truth.

At Arkansas, I can tell you where every fraternity recruits from.

It defines their fraternity (as it should).

[bowsandtoes]

3-4 generations in Highland Park would definitely not put a family in the 'new money' category. I didn't go to HPHS, but I'm from the area and can speak with confidence on the subject.

By your definition, there's only a handful of houses on beverly that would qualify.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by bowsandtoes

3-4 generations in Highland Park would definitely not put a family in the 'new money' category. I didn't go to HPHS, but I'm from the area and can speak with confidence on the subject.

By your definition, there's only a handful of houses on beverly that would qualify.

Well and I don't think maccallen was specifically talking about his own family's situation, he was only defining it.

I enjoy bummin around Highland Park...the Blue Goose on Greenville is pretty good.

Neither here nor there, Highland Park is an excellent place to recruit from.

[baci]

I found this thread to be very interesting and I want to thank everyone for proving we can discuss somewhat "touchy" subjects without huge fallouts.

I am not fully in the know about fraternities, but I can say I am a lifelong Floridian. I attended UF and I can agree that it is different when it comes to fraternities vs. "The South". I would like to think after numerous generations continue to pass here, it may establish itself in time and its powers just like the old south. It is odd to say/explain, but in a way Florida sort of stands on its own. I do think many people can understand what I am saying (especially those who live here).

I came through at a time when So Florida was growing. I was a little girl when hardly anyone was here. My city began development when I was a toddler and I have lived there since. It was a nice area/well respected among upper middle class families and some ultra rich. My point in this, when you rushed/were recruited it almost didn't matter where you lived because everything was so new and unestablished. People just thought it was neat to hear if you lived near them or they recognized your little suburb. It was comforting to talk to someone and they knew little quirks about your area and its newness.

I can speak for my knowledge about sororities. It was not peaches and cream. It was extremely tough and competitive and it really was out of your control for the most part. Majority of the girls on my hall rushed and only three received bids. It was first and foremost about how you looked. If you did not have the level of "good looks", you immeditaley were knocked out of numerous groups. Then, your "figure" came into play. After that, it was what your father did for a living and how much money you were perceived to have. From there it was how you dressed, your jewelry, and what handbag you carried etc. It then went to your grades, high school activities, what area you were from, and possibly a mention of your school. (Remember, our areas and schools were all so new). If you were the daughter of someone very important you garnered a pass on much of the above and everyone knew it. If you were a legacy it was important, but all the recs were not as important.

This was the truth and it was extremely hurtful to so many young girls. I will never forget all the tears and hurt from the rush week and on for the entire school year. I have to say it brewed some hate between greek and non-greek women. It was hard to see so many girls upset and everyone knew much of it was based on looks and an outward visual. Many outstanding girls were never even close to being part of a sorority and they had greatness to offer.

A great deal of time has passed and I am sure aspects of this have changed, but I am a realist. To a degree, this is what real life is like and I don't like to hide this when I speak to younger people. I really like to be honest, but I do it with encouraging words and a positive angle.

When I was at the university, it was really like this. I see the parallels as I read the fraternity stories. To tell someone to go into rush now with an open mind is nice, but you aslo have to go in realistically as well.

I love the entire greek system and there is so much goodness involved, but I know from my experience that many people do not enter into the system at such a young age for the philanthropy and for reasons in which it was initially established. That is life. I am one of the people who cheer for the people who go AI because many of those women really want to be a part of the group for strong reasons, especially if they enter the group at much older ages.

The tier system will always be here and there is no getting away from it. This is how life really is. As you age, you will see that this does become less important. How you look, how much money you have, where you live, what type of work you engage in all become less important. The goodness inside of each person is much more important. How you live your life, how you carry yourself, how you treat others, and the goodness you do is of much more importance. Kind of funny because "doing good" is what sorority life is truly based.

[PhiGam]

Great post

[PhiGam]

I would assume that in Texas all of the top tier guys would be from oil money. I plan to make a trip out there and visit our chapter there, I've heard that they are one of the top chapters of any fraternity in the nation.

[bowsandtoes]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

I would assume that in Texas all of the top tier guys would be from oil money. I plan to make a trip out there and visit our chapter there, I've heard that they are one of the top chapters of any fraternity in the nation.

There's still some but a lot of Dallas really benefited from the technology boom, going all the way back to the 50's and 60's when TI was founded here.

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

I would assume that in Texas all of the top tier guys would be from oil money. I plan to make a trip out there and visit our chapter there, I've heard that they are one of the top chapters of any fraternity in the nation.

Eh, not so much. Real estate, investments, banking, finances, oil, etc. etc.........pretty good mix.

...and yes, FIJI down here is a very solid house. Excellent guys.

[Elephant Walk]

Have to get back on track a bit... I think the whole point about going into Texan cities and so forth is that there are still some holdout cities which are great places for fraternity men because of the size of Texas. I forgot to mention places like Midland, which is/was loaded with oil money. In the book Friday Night Lights they say it had more square feet of office space than New York at one time. In Georgia it's getting sparser with the growth of Atlanta. Florida gets a bit screwed. There's a couple of great places but it seems like the panhandle guys go elsewhere and the giant South Florida isn't always the most exceptional place.

[Lucky SC]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

Have to get back on track a bit... I think the whole point about going into Texan cities and so forth is that there are still some holdout cities which are great places for fraternity men because of the size of Texas. I forgot to mention places like Midland, which is/was loaded with oil money. In the book Friday Night Lights they say it had more square feet of office space than New York at one time. In Georgia it's getting sparser with the growth of Atlanta. Florida gets a bit screwed. There's a couple of great places but it seems like the panhandle guys go elsewhere and the giant South Florida isn't always the most exceptional place.

It doesn't really matter anymore though because so many kids are coming from out of state now. #5 public school in the country has a pull of its own when recrutiing people, not to mention the stafford effect and the football team's new promise it holds.

[shinerbock]

Originally Posted by Lucky SC

It doesn't really matter anymore though because so many kids are coming from out of state now. #5 public school in the country has a pull of its own when recrutiing people, not to mention the stafford effect and the football team's new promise it holds.

You're undoubtedly right, but I don't think guys like Stafford (football ability aside) are the kind many traditional fraternities are looking for.

Unfortunately, improvement of a school's national reputation and growth doesn't always (perhaps often) coincide with sustainment of a great greek system.

[Lucky SC]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

You're undoubtedly right, but I don't think guys like Stafford (football ability aside) are the kind many traditional fraternities are looking for.

Unfortunately, improvement of a school's national reputation and growth doesn't always (perhaps often) coincide with sustainment of a great greek system.

very true.

i think throughout this whole conversation we have forgotten that it isn't necessarily going to result in quality or quantity. It almost seems to me that this whole conversation in a way has made the point that the more intelligent people are the less likely they are "cool" are a "fraternity man".

i dunno bout the rest of yall but i would like to be considered intelligent lol. i think we forget the difference between a nerd and a intelligent, worldly man.