How to help PNMs who don't get first choice? - Page 2

violetpretty · #1 02-22-2008, 01:35 PM

This is why I think it's important for the women to open their bids in front of the Rho Gammas in private. The Rho Gamma can help her get over any disappointment and help her see the big picture.

Last year when I was a Rho Gamma, there was a girl who went to my high school who got her second choice on bid day. It was tough for her because her Rho Gamma was in her first choice chapter (she knew for a while), and she and her Rho Gamma got along really well. I sat down with her and her Rho Gamma and we talked about it. She cried, she wanted to make sure it wasn't a mistake (no), she asked me if it would have been different if she had suicided (she would have been unmatched), she asked me if she could go through in the fall (no), she asked what her chances would be like next spring (not so good---she was a sophomore at the time, so she'd be a junior). She liked her second choice, but she just needed to get over the initial shock.

Because of her class standing, my answer to her was basically, it's this chapter or no sorority at all. You can walk away now, you can walk away tomorrow, you can walk away after a couple weeks, or you can walk away right before you are about to be initiated. I told her she might as well stick it out and see if she can be happy there. She ended up going to bid day with a good attitude and is very active and happy in her chapter.

ETA: While I understand the sentiments of "well if you didn't want the chapter then don't put them on your pref card" or "you should be happy to get any chapter", like gee_ess said, it seems like the end of the world of a NM at that moment they see the second or third choice in their hands. There are tons of women who are initially disappointed, not so much that they don't like their second choice, but because they didn't get their first choice. Sometimes they just need to talk about it and it can really change their attitude for the better.

Zillini · #2 02-22-2008, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 33girl

Oh, I meant much later, like a year later, when the XYZs did something really stupid and the member says "I have an extremely embarrassing confession...I put XYZ first. What the heck kind of crack was I on?? I would hate it there so much!! I love you guys!!"

I've seen PNMs/new members announce at their new house during the Bid Day celebration that they didn't get their 1st choice. I've seen PNMs in tears having to be talked into putting a jersey on. Not the best way to start off one's membership even if it does end up working out for the best in the long run.

Zillini · #3 02-22-2008, 02:14 PM

This is probably going to come across as my being cold or heartless. Sure I'm sad for a PNM who doesn't get a bid at all or doesn't get her first choice. But you know what? Rejection is a part of life. I think maybe the bigger problem here is that society has gotten so concerned with protecting/promoting kids' self esteem that for many this is the first time they've ever faced failure or not gotten exactly what they wanted. If you don't learn that lesson at a young age, it's much harder to deal with when you are older. "Oh we don't keep score at our soccer games because everyone is a winner! Everyone gets a trophy just for showing up!"

Competition does not have to be an evil thing. Being rewarded for hard work or trying harder the next time or just not fitting in are things that all kids need to learn. Not getting what you want for whatever reason does not mean you are a bad person or that they are bad people for not wanting to give it to you. So if someone hasn't learned this lesson at age 18 or 19, maybe this is a good thing. How will they deal with rejection at age 22+ when they are 1 of 1,000 job applicants for only 10 entry level positions? Do employers need to provide counselors for the 990 who didn't get hired?

In the imortal words of the Rolling Stones: You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes you just might find you get what you need.

ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl · #4 02-22-2008, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zillini

This is probably going to come across as my being cold or heartless. Sure I'm sad for a PNM who doesn't get a bid at all or doesn't get her first choice. But you know what? Rejection is a part of life. I think maybe the bigger problem here is that society has gotten so concerned with protecting/promoting kids' self esteem that for many this is the first time they've ever faced failure or not gotten exactly what they wanted. If you don't learn that lesson at a young age, it's much harder to deal with when you are older. "Oh we don't keep score at our soccer games because everyone is a winner! Everyone gets a trophy just for showing up!"

Competition does not have to be an evil thing. Being rewarded for hard work or trying harder the next time or just not fitting in are things that all kids need to learn. Not getting what you want for whatever reason does not mean you are a bad person or that they are bad people for not wanting to give it to you. So if someone hasn't learned this lesson at age 18 or 19, maybe this is a good thing. How will they deal with rejection at age 22+ when they are 1 of 1,000 job applicants for only 10 entry level positions? Do employers need to provide counselors for the 990 who didn't get hired?

In the imortal words of the Rolling Stones: You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes you just might find you get what you need.

That's kind of how I felt about it as well. We explained to every woman in the general meeting that they weren't guaranteed a bid. If they had bad grades, there was next to no chance of getting one. And they might not get their first choice. If they can't handle the possibility of rejection they may want to try again at another time.

It's negative, yeah, but it's reality.

We're told not to encourage suiciding...personally I don't have a problem with it. I did it. But I did have a girl tell me after she got invited back to only two that she couldn't possibly take a bid from her second choice. I told her that yes, it was an option to put down only one sorority, but that she'd be dropped from recruitment if she didn't get matched up. She ended up deciding that she wanted to be in a sorority badly enough to think twice about her second choice...she got it and now loves it. And that's just the way it goes sometimes.

AOII Angel · #5 02-25-2008, 07:12 PM

I think the vast majority of women who get their second choice are okay and no one ever knows they didn't suicide their chapter! Only on occasion does a PNM become despondant over getting her second choice, and in my experience it's people who thought they had an "in" with the chapter. I've told this story before...we had a NM who came down our hall crying her eyes out because Phi Mu didn't give her a bid as a double legacy. Oh boo hoo. I pulled her aside and said, very bluntly, "Stop the crying. I understand you are hurt and confused, but there is no changing that you didn't get a bid to Phi Mu. If you keep acting this way, you are going to ruin any chances that you will ever fit in with the group that actually wants you. Dry your eyes, wash your face and put on a big smile. Enjoy today, and you can figure out tomorrow what you're going to do. Just don't ruin today for the girls that are excited to be here!" She stopped crying and did what I said. Her major issue was shock and a feeling that she failed her bio sisters who were Phi Mu's from another chapter. Her mother had actually redecorated her room at home in pink and lions! Her sisters were extremely supportive and told her that they were happy she was an AOII. They even sent her a basket of red AOII items. She is a great AOII to this day. Some people just are not able to hide their emotions well.

ree-Xi · #6 02-25-2008, 08:09 PM

The practical part of me asks, if you aren't going to be happy with your second or third choice, why do you list it? If I could choose 3, and could not see myself as happy getting into three groups, I would only list 2.

The emotional side of me understands that it can be hard to "instantly" be psyched with #2 if you obviously had a #1 in your heart. Like, if you audition for a play, and you don't get the lead, but a supporting role, you are probably going to be disappointed at first. But most people didn't get a real part.

I think the important part for the PNM is to realize that someone really wanted them. And that some girls, maybe a lot of girls, didn't get chosen at all.

Recognize the situation for what it IS and not for what it ISN't. What it "IS or "WAS" for me - *I* was invited to be part of a very close, very special group. In the vastness of the school, the world - these girls chose ME to be one of them -for the rest of our academic careers, for life. I was, and still am, deeply honored. Especially because so many years later, these girls still want me.

My advice, then, is to accept what DO have, and an invitation to an Inter/national, lifelong sisterhood is an amazing gift. And honestly, given how little time most PNMs have with the groups during rush, the difference between their top two is mostly in their minds.

gee_ess · #7 02-25-2008, 08:52 PM

The pnm's are really not "allowed" to leave a pref unranked. First, if they are invited back to two houses, they MUST attend those two parties or be dropped from rush. Then, they do everything humanly possible to discourage the pnm from listing only one house on her bid card - even when the girl clearly feels that she only wants one of the houses. So, that can sometimes lead to a girl ranking her houses with the strong feeling that all she wants is first choice and is only ranking number two to keep the Gamma Chi happy.

That aside, my original post was not intended to suggest that we change the way bids are distributed based on these few girls who are disappointed, but to ask what can the chapter or, better yet, PANHLLENIC do as a follow up for these girls. I'm talking about an extra conversation that may, as one of you noted, be a "buck up" speech. Or a pep talk or a time to convince her to count her blessings, etc.

But, if you don't know who those girls are, then you don't know who to reach out to and you risk them feeling unhappy about the sorority from the get go and that (imo) can lead to an unhappy pledge experience. Which gets into the whole 6 week pledgeship vs semester and is another topic for another time!

Benzgirl · #8 02-22-2008, 06:35 PM

This all seems a little foreign to me. I would have been happy to have either of my top two choices, and would have been ok with Number 3, also. Maybe it was because I was a Junior when I rushed and I was thrilled to have three very good houses to Pref.

We never really talked about it too much, but I don't remember anyone in my chapter mention that we were not their first choice. Of course, we never knew who was snapped up either.

brunetteddd · #9 03-01-2008, 03:23 AM

At my school, you go to up to 2 sororities for Pref Round. That being said, when you rank on your bid card, you can technically put down all 4 sororities on campus (but that's only if you were invited back to all 4 at one point and declined the other 2 "with interest"). We rank these on our own time in relative privacy, but are allowed to consult with our Gamma Chi (or another Gamma Chi, because as we all know, sometimes there's one that you get along better with than your own, in my case, the Gamma Chi my roommate was assigned to sorta took me under her wing due to my own GC being a little over scheduled and had little time for her GC group; but I digress).

On Bid Day, we wait in a room and are lined up alphabetically by GC group. You're called out into a hallway one by one, and in said hallway you're handed your bid card by someone in Panhellenic Council. You open it, read it, they ask you if you accept, and then a) if you do, you immediately run out to your new sisters, b) if you don't, you leave through the back, and c) if you need more time, you can step aside and think about it "in privacy" (which I stress isn't very private, you just sorta stand off to one side of the hallway).

I think it's a relatively good process, the only thing is that it all happens so fast that you really don't have time to mentally process what's happened in the way of bids that were extended to you. From my experience, I had a hard time with ranking my #1 and #2; I ended up only getting a bid from one of them (which I had ranked #2). But looking back on it, I am EXTREMELY happy that it turned out the way it did; I love my sisters and, looking at the other sorority I had ranked on my card, I know things for sure worked out for the best for me (I loved alot of the older girls in that sorority, but I feel like I would have had difficulties fitting in with the pledge class I would have been a part of).

So the long and short of it - even if you don't get your #1, at least try it out for the pledge period. You may find that you are really in the right place, and if not, you don't have to become a fully initiated member.

gee_ess · #10 03-01-2008, 10:35 AM

So the long and short of it - even if you don't get your #1, at least try it out for the pledge period. You may find that you are really in the right place, and if not, you don't have to become a fully initiated member.
__________________

That is exactly the advice I would give a pnm in that situation, and isn't it nice that you had a moment to think about it when you received your bid card. Maybe someone even said those exact words to you on bid day.

On some campuses, the pnm's (roughly 400 girls) are given their bid cards in a large area where all the members are also in attendance (along with family, friends, etc - it is a big spectator sport) and on the count of three, they open their bid cards. Then, the screaming and hugging and chaos begins...Girls who get their second choice are left to their own devices - sure it works out fine for most. I just feel that our PC sort of washes their hands of the entire process from that moment on.
It's like rowing someone to the middle of a lake and then handing them the oars and jumping overboard. "Thanks for playing, pnm's. We have no more services, or help, or emotional support from this point forward. "

UGAalum94 · #11 03-01-2008, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gee_ess

So the long and short of it - even if you don't get your #1, at least try it out for the pledge period. You may find that you are really in the right place, and if not, you don't have to become a fully initiated member.
__________________

That is exactly the advice I would give a pnm in that situation, and isn't it nice that you had a moment to think about it when you received your bid card. Maybe someone even said those exact words to you on bid day.

On some campuses, the pnm's (roughly 400 girls) are given their bid cards in a large area where all the members are also in attendance (along with family, friends, etc - it is a big spectator sport) and on the count of three, they open their bid cards. Then, the screaming and hugging and chaos begins...Girls who get their second choice are left to their own devices - sure it works out fine for most. I just feel that our PC sort of washes their hands of the entire process from that moment on.
It's like rowing someone to the middle of a lake and then handing them the oars and jumping overboard. "Thanks for playing, pnm's. We have no more services, or help, or emotional support from this point forward. "

But to be honest, it IS over from their perspective. Once the bids are issued, there's nothing else that can change other than the new member's feelings. You could continue to offer advice and counseling, but it's a lot to ask of rho gammas in my opinion that they would be expected to continue to remain mentally and emotionally disaffiliated enough that they could counsel girls who are new members of other groups.

I think that maybe the way to address this issue, from the PC angle, is to talk about it more during recruitment, so they have some ideas already about what they should do.

Maybe put the realistic information out there about whether re-rushing is a realistic option on your campus: some places it may actually be the case that a girl can decline a bid or drop out during the pledge period and get a different bid, but other campuses, it's not very likely to happen.

carnation · #12 08-17-2012, 11:30 AM

This was a good thread! It had advice that's important during recruitment season.

pearlalum · #13 08-17-2012, 11:56 AM

Back in my day and on my campus, there were no bid opening ceremonies. You went to your pref parties (we had a max of 2), and then the next day, you waited in your dorm room. You could see and hear the chapters going throughout the campus and dorms to "pick up" their new pledges. Then, you'd hear a knock on your door (all was quiet in the hallway), and open it up to see your new sisters standing outside of your door, singing and cheering when you opened your door. Your new sorority handed you your bid card to join them.

Ironically, my roommate and I had the same 2 prefs, but ranked them differently. Her sorority came first to our door, and acted sad that they didn't have a bid card to give me. When they left with my roommate, I was so excited, knowing that my number one was on their way to pick me up! But, I would have been happy to go with my roommate too. When it's all said and done, it worked out perfectly for both of us.

dukemama · #14 08-17-2012, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pearlalum

Back in my day and on my campus, there were no bid opening ceremonies.

Same here, but I would have definitely preferred that my school had a bid opening ceremony at a central location. It was torture for me to see my freshman year roommate get welcomed by her new sisters at our dorm room after I was cut from every chapter after the 2nd round. Then again, I suppose I should have had the foresight to get out of dodge and hide in the library that morning!

WCsweet<3 · #15 08-17-2012, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dukemama

Same here, but I would have definitely preferred that my school had a bid opening ceremony at a central location. It was torture for me to see my freshman year roommate get welcomed by her new sisters at our dorm room after I was cut from every chapter after the 2nd round. Then again, I suppose I should have had the foresight to get out of dodge and hide in the library that morning!

My first school had a bid opening ceremony. I would have been such a mess if they had come to the dorm as my three best friends (including my roommate) who lived on my floor of 20 women all received a bid to the sorority I SIP and did not receive a bid from.

My second school also had a ceremony, but the rho gammas were placed throughout the PNMs. We also were given lists of where our group members received bids. Most of the rho gams were able to predict which PNMs would be unhappy with their bids.