Your "Blackness" Questioned?????

[Steeltrap]

Originally posted by nikki1920
ambicion6, thanks for sharing. I didnt know that "talking white" occured in other communities. Interesting....

I'm not surprised that the "talking white" phenomenon occurs in other communities of color, particularly those who have been extremely marginalized. I wonder, though, whether it goes on in Asian Pacific American communities.

[nikki1920]

In the study I've done about racial assimilation, surgery to have eyelids "Americanized" is popular in some Asian communities. I don't know about language/linguistic issues, though..hmmm

[starang21]

Originally posted by nikki1920
In the study I've done about racial assimilation, surgery to have eyelids "Americanized" is popular in some Asian communities. I don't know about language/linguistic issues, though..hmmm

add to that peroxide treatment to supposedly have lighter skin. it's more a phenomenon outside of the US.

assimilation is rampant in the asian american community. it's evident in the disparity of interracial dating differences between asian men and women. a lot of different reasons for it.

[SummerChild]

Originally posted by Honeykiss1974
Has anyone ever had their "blackness" questioned because you happend to have a particular stance on certain issues (i.e. Democrat vs. Republican) or maybe because of your profession or the neighborhood that you reside in. Today, I had a discussion with an old high school chum and she proceed to tell me that I have changed and become one of "them"now. I asked her how and she stated that since I moved to the "upscale" part of town and got my new job, I've been talking and flinging my hair back like some white girl, forgetting where I came from. She then proceed to tell me that because of "sell-outs" such as myself, this is why black folks will never be unified and excel. After a silent prayer (because I felt like beating that itch down with a bat! ) I explained to her that my "blackness" is not defined by the small limited scope of her mind. I suggested that once she ventures out into the world she will find that all black people do not fit into a steretyupical mold that she has been taught to believe. The nerve of that heifer! Anyway, has anyone else haas their "blackness" questioned and if so, how did you handle it?

HK, I understand your annoyance with your friend b/c she was making many assumptions. However, I also understand why she may have made those assumptions. Many of us (black people) get our jobs and move as far away from black people as we can and never look back or try to aid the community from when they came. I don't think that it's absolutely necessary to live among blacks (although I will b/c when I go to work in the mornings, I want black children to see a young black professional and know that they too can do that), I do think that it is essential to continue to take part in the struggle.

Don't be mad at her. Maybe she didn't mean any harm.

SC

[SummerChild]

My sister called and my answering machine came on once and she said that she hung up b/c she thought that she had dialed the number of a white woman. It wasn't my English being proper (b/c my mother didn't raise any fools and she speaks proper English as well). It was the inflection in my speech. I can't deny that other races do tend to have a different inflection when speaking and more of a nasal way of speaking sometimes. Of course this does not go for everyone but I must admit that I understood why my sister mistook me for someone else. It's just like how I can tell if I'm talking to a black woman when I call the telephone company - and it's not a matter of her English being proper or not.

It may also be a regional thing b/c when I lived in Cali, quite a few times while riding the train, I thought that the person standing behind me talking was white and turned and the person was black. It was not a matter of proper English. It was the nasalness of it all.

SC

[SummerChild]

Originally posted by CrimsonTide4

First the whole "acting Black versus acting White" issue is a divisive problem in our culture. For some acting Black is equivalent to KEEPING IT REAL, to me at times it means KEEPING IT REAL IGNANT. I think for some of our brothers and sisters, when we go on to achieve, that age old crab mentality kicks in and they have to throw some sort of insult at us to "keep us in check" hence the Acting Black/acting white comments that many of us may have been the target of. I remember the first time my former best friend and former stepfather told me I sounded white on the phone, I went off -- sounded BLACK then, I bet. Anyway I digress.

In today's culture/society, this hip hop culture dominates the way of thinking, living, and behaving. Too many of our Black brothers and sisters are trying to keep up with the Joneses and Big Willies and P Diddys. Not realizing or recognizing the inherent value in themselves.

I do believe that hip hop culture has made it "seem acceptable" for whites and other non Blacks to use the N word. I don't think so. My kids, white and Black, get it from me if I hear the N word. We must change their way of thinking. However it is hard when that is all they hear at home. Hell I heard it at home. It wasn't until I went away to college that I thought "WHOA!!" No more!! I still occassionally slip and use it but I realize that in using it I continue to give our oppressors power over how I treat my fellow Blacks. [/B]

I totally agree. To me, the *real* sellouts are all of those rappers like Jay-Z and 50-cent who have made $$ off of the backs of young black boys that we bury every week from trying to emulate that crap that they sell to them. Jay-Z and 50-cent would rather put $$ into their pockets than to stop shoveling that life-threatening crap into the minds of their own black brothers and sisters who are dying from that mess daily.

The rappers need to learn how to keep it real b/c that is *not* keeping it real. That's keeping it real ignant (as CT4 said).
SC

[SummerChild]

Originally posted by DoggyStyle82
Defining "Blackness" is becoming increasingly more difficult because the range of our experiences as individuals have increases exponentially in a relatively short period. My friends and I have pondered how to best raise a child with a sense of "Blackness" when a great deal of their acculteration will be in white schools and white neighborhoods. How does one give a sense of something that cannot be defined.

It can't be defined because "Blackness" is innate. It is something that has to be lived and experienced. There were five Black students in my graduating class in high school, but when people ask me how many, I usually say "3" because the other two were racially "Black" but not culturally "Black". "What is that?" you say. I don't know. I just know that the other two never felt comfortable around us. Never spoke to us. Usually avoided us. Anything that would have been pertinent to a Black person never seemed to matter to them. It wasn't about speech patterns, complexion, or superficial things.

They didn't live in Black neighborhoods, have Black friends, go to Black churches, eat "Black foods" or otherwise live the "Black Experience", they didn't even associate with each other, yet racially, they were Black. They couldn't tell you what Kwanzaa was, nor did they care. Harlem Renaissance? Join school NAACP chapter? Sit with another Black person at lunch?

Is there a universal Black Experience or Culture anymore? Not with this second generation of intergration. Some people don't want to be Black and that's their perogative.

"Blackness" can't be defined, but you know it when you see it

I have had this same experience and totally agree with your post Doggystyle.

[Intense1920]

I had this problem a lot in middle school. All of sudden I was an "oreo" because I hung with a multicultural group and took higher level classes. That's alright because I am doing something with myself unlike those same people who called me names.

[UpPinkies]

Originally posted by Intense1920
I had this problem a lot in middle school. All of sudden I was an "oreo" because I hung with a multicultural group and took higher level classes. That's alright because I am doing something with myself unlike those same people who called me names.

That was my name in middle school too. I didn't understand why getting good grades and thinking about going to college was "selling out". I come from a line of educated AA's in my family and all of them where teachers. They expected me to go to college, and havinf two parent with four degrees, there was no way that I could not go to college and get an education. I also remember one semester I received 3 A's and one of my AA classmates grabbed my report card and shouted, "you made three A's?" like AA's kids didn't make A's.


But lately I have come across those who made fun of me back in the day and it funny how they act now. I even had one girl who tried to bring back that middle school mess and I was like sorry, I have moved on, maybe you should to. Then got mad at me because of the way I reacted. But that was over TEN years ago and I have grown up.

[Jill1228]

Thank you! I dealt with this too Ya know most of the folx that gave me isht are:
dead
in jail
got babies mommas/babies daddies scattered to the 4 winds
Or on drugs somewhere.

I know for sure that the one who was a big player in making my school years hayle was killed in a drug deal gone bad.

Karma can be a beeotch!

Originally posted by Intense1920
I had this problem a lot in middle school. All of sudden I was an "oreo" because I hung with a multicultural group and took higher level classes. That's alright because I am doing something with myself unlike those same people who called me names.

[hipshimmy]

Oh my goodness....
It depresses me to see how people are still having their blackness questioned. I don't understand and I don't think I ever will. I thought since I was born African-American that would more than likely classify me as black, but now you have to act the part and not just look it. I always tell people that make " you don't act black" comments that I am not trying to put on an "act" for anyone including you. Maybe I don't understand...is it more about where you came from&your upbringing as opposed to who you are as a person? Well...I never need anyone to remind me that I am black. I am always reminded that I am black when one of those stuck up people in mid-town Manhattan mistakes me for the help. It sucks, but it happens

I haven't seen this topic, so if it has been posted already can someone please refer me to it? Thanks in advance.

Well, here's my story. I'm really lazy and I have been saying for years how I want to go to the gym to tone up, get the legs and thighs in good shape. Now I'm not big, not thick or anything, I am a petite person. I do, however, complain if I have to walk up some stairs or participate in any type of strenuous activity (yes, I consider that strenuous lol).

Soooo, I decided that since I live by the lake I could get some skates and skate on the bike path when spring time hits. It's minutes from my apt, walking, and I figured I would be able to get fresh air and exercise at the same time. My community is diverse and all types of people are along the lake (Hyde Park for you Chicagoans) in the spring and summer. I decided to tell a black male coworker today (I'm black too) and he said: "You always acting like a white girl." I was like I got so offended. I didn't talk to him for a long while. I refused to discuss the situation with him.

My question is, did I overreact? I mean, should I have been that upset for him saying that to me? I know that you shouldn't take comments like that to heart but it really hurt me. Do you all think that comments like this build someone's character, meaning that someone will think that there is no such thing as a "stereotypical black person," or do these comments more tear people down, meaning someone will think "well, maybe I don't act black enough/act too white" and therefore should change.

This isn't the first time this has happened to me, and I'm sure it won't be the last. I've been called white and that I think I'm "too good for anyone" for going to college! Do we, as blacks, take things too far when trying to generalize our culture/people?

[SummerChild]

Hi Ms. Sweetness, I lived and went to school in Hyde Park for the past 5 years or so before moving to Cali so I am familiar with the neighborhood. I think that sometimes we (AAs) consider outdoor activities to be something outside of the realm of what AA do. For example, my bfriend and I love hiking but I don't really have any other AA friends that do also. It may be perceived as a non-AA thing to do, not sure. Also, here in Cali, most women wear a press. When I heard that upon my arrival last summer, I was like ?? b/c with so much water all around, if you're not wearing your hair natural, why would you maintain a press? Well, I soon found out that I was one of the few AA women who actually was going to get in the water anyway so it didn't matter to them. I say that to say that perhaps getting in the water is not perceived as an AA thing? I'm not sure.

Anyway, you didn't elaborate on *how* you got offended so I can't comment on whether you went too far but skating along the lake doesn't sound too non-AA to me, no matter the neighborhood that you live in. I would say to consider maintaining composure in the face of stupidity (which is a good skill to have in general b/c you *will* be confronted with blatant stupidity or foolishness in the future - by someone for whatever reason) and with the blankest most innocent look, ask why the person believes what the person believes. Most of the time they will make themselves look silly.

SC

Originally Posted by MsSweetness

I haven't seen this topic, so if it has been posted already can someone please refer me to it? Thanks in advance.

Well, here's my story. I'm really lazy and I have been saying for years how I want to go to the gym to tone up, get the legs and thighs in good shape. Now I'm not big, not thick or anything, I am a petite person. I do, however, complain if I have to walk up some stairs or participate in any type of strenuous activity (yes, I consider that strenuous lol).

Soooo, I decided that since I live by the lake I could get some skates and skate on the bike path when spring time hits. It's minutes from my apt, walking, and I figured I would be able to get fresh air and exercise at the same time. My community is diverse and all types of people are along the lake (Hyde Park for you Chicagoans) in the spring and summer. I decided to tell a black male coworker today (I'm black too) and he said: "You always acting like a white girl." I was like I got so offended. I didn't talk to him for a long while. I refused to discuss the situation with him.

My question is, did I overreact? I mean, should I have been that upset for him saying that to me? I know that you shouldn't take comments like that to heart but it really hurt me. Do you all think that comments like this build someone's character, meaning that someone will think that there is no such thing as a "stereotypical black person," or do these comments more tear people down, meaning someone will think "well, maybe I don't act black enough/act too white" and therefore should change.

This isn't the first time this has happened to me, and I'm sure it won't be the last. I've been called white and that I think I'm "too good for anyone" for going to college! Do we, as blacks, take things too far when trying to generalize our culture/people?

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by SummerChild

Also, here in Cali, most women wear a press. When I heard that upon my arrival last summer, I was like ?? b/c with so much water all around, if you're not wearing your hair natural, why would you maintain a press? Well, I soon found out that I was one of the few AA women who actually was going to get in the water anyway so it didn't matter to them. I say that to say that perhaps getting in the water is not perceived as an AA thing? I'm not sure.

So the history of most of Southern California is why most AA do not swim at the beach...

Historically, there was extreme racial segregation at almost all the prime locations on SoCal beaches. If found there pre-1970's, AA's were either beaten or killed for being on the beach or near the beach. That kind of history is hidden about SoCal and only older native Californians know this kind of history.

Also, there have always been the police officers on the beach or near the beach ready to arrest "suspicious characters". Yeah, there are billion dollar homes near the SoCal beaches, that is the price most folks pay for while living in Cali... But, there is no reason to go Sylmar Rodney King style on a brotha while he's just enjoying himself at the beach with his Nicole girlfriend... That happenend ALOT on most SoCal beaches...

Then other less desirable beaches have crap in the water, like sewage, condoms, needles, you name it, you'll find it... Those are forgotten areas... And there is rough water, or undertows that make the beaches unsafe.

I would say that most SoCal beaches rules and goers have been unbelievably racist and bigotted in the past and a lot of that has not much changed...

And I am a native California who resides in Pacific Northwest now...

[Dionysus]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

So the history of most of Southern California is why most AA do not swim at the beach...

Historically, there was extreme racial segregation at almost all the prime locations on SoCal beaches. If found there pre-1970's, AA's were either beaten or killed for being on the beach or near the beach. That kind of history is hidden about SoCal and only older native Californians know this kind of history.

Also, there have always been the police officers on the beach or near the beach ready to arrest "suspicious characters". Yeah, there are billion dollar homes near the SoCal beaches, that is the price most folks pay for while living in Cali... But, there is no reason to go Sylmar Rodney King style on a brotha while he's just enjoying himself at the beach with his Nicole girlfriend... That happenend ALOT on most SoCal beaches...

Then other less desirable beaches have crap in the water, like sewage, condoms, needles, you name it, you'll find it... Those are forgotten areas... And there is rough water, or undertows that make the beaches unsafe.

I would say that most SoCal beaches rules and goers have been unbelievably racist and bigotted in the past and a lot of that has not much changed...

And I am a native California who resides in Pacific Northwest now...

How are most SoCal beach rules and goers were/are racist and bigotted? Just curious, I've never heard that before.

Very interesting post. One of the biggest reasons why I have a crush on SoCal are what I've heard about the beaches.