Interesting article

[freethinker]

Jeez... ya take a couple of days off of the Internet, and what happens?

Anyway, I'd like to wholeheartedly agree with Icon's last statement. It is getting a bit out of hand.

And, taking a cue from Icon (search for posts he's made, they're frickin' hilarious), I've got an idea to finish the discussion.

As such, I say we handle it in bear suits. Fights at my place, next Friday night. I'll even let KA members wear their Confederate garb (over the bear suit, of course).

If I win, Statesboro, GA KA guys can't wear grey. If anyone else wins, I'll cry (like the dateless homosexual wonder that the general consensus says I am).

If somebody dies, then we'll say it's a tragic hunting accident, or hazing gone awry.

[lilly27]

I was just wondering if you know the guys in KA at GSU?

[KABillyMac]

So since we have all agreed to disagree, does that mean that you will be crawling back under the stouthouse rock now?

[seaprincess]

HI EVERYONE, THIS IS THE PERSON WHO STARTED THIS THREAD...AND I HAVE TO ADD THAT YOU GUYS HAVE BEEN OF NO HELP WHAT-SO-EVER, AND MY ESSAY IS DUE TOMORROW(APRIL 30TH) SO THATS GREAT... THANKS EVERYONE


AND FREETHINKER...I'VE NEVER BEEN MORE DISTURBED BY ANYONE THAN I AM BY YOU. PLEASE CALL: 1-800-CHECK-MY-HEAD

[KABillyMac]

Sorry, this is not the thread you started.

Good luck with you paper.

[Lil_G]

Well maybe you shouldn't have waited 6 days before it was due to start your research...especially from random ppl off the internet, you should have contacted individuals from your school....

[dzrose93]

Originally posted by seaprincess
HI EVERYONE, THIS IS THE PERSON WHO STARTED THIS THREAD...AND I HAVE TO ADD THAT YOU GUYS HAVE BEEN OF NO HELP WHAT-SO-EVER, AND MY ESSAY IS DUE TOMORROW(APRIL 30TH) SO THATS GREAT... THANKS EVERYONE


AND FREETHINKER...I'VE NEVER BEEN MORE DISTURBED BY ANYONE THAN I AM BY YOU. PLEASE CALL: 1-800-CHECK-MY-HEAD

It would probably have been better for you to post this in Greek Life rather than in a single fraternity forum. Not nearly as many people visit the KA forum as compared to the general Greek Life forum.

However, I must say that you will probably get more detailed and relevant information from people on your own campus rather than people on the internet. The reason is that it's very hard to know if someone is telling the truth online, and you don't want your paper to be based on a bunch of comments that may or may not be the truth. It's much easier to determine if a comment is factual if you actually know the person already and can speak with him/her face to face about your subject matter.

Good luck. Hope you get your paper finished in time.

[revjack]

"FreeThinker"
I read your article with the express purpose of giving you the benefit of the doubt. I assumed that you would at least know some of the facts about which you wrote. Clearly, you are quite unaware of a number of facts.

1. The major cause for the war between the states was NOT slavery. (I realize that this has been taught as fact since the late 1800s... In fact, I was taught this as a child in a GA elementary school.) The major cause was a confederation of states wanted a government that was less federalized. They wanted each state to have the authority to govern themselves. Lincoln, a good man in a difficult situation, used slavery as a tool to turn the tide in the war. (This nearly backfired, since slavery was prevelant in the north as well.)

2. The "Old South" about which you think you are writing is really only the "recent old south." The Old South celebrated and honored by the gentlemen of the Kappa Alpha Order is much older than the 1920s and 30s. The ideals that were held, chilvalry and honor, are what we celebrate. (You will notice that I used the term "gentlemen"... That is who we are. We have no need to write or speak with the type of language you use.) We are more than capable of getting our point across without the use of vulgarities.

3. The "wanton rape of black women..." that you speak of did unfortunately happen. This is unexcusable. However, it is clear to me that your idea of what the "old south" was like comes from books such as "Uncle Tom's Cabin." (While this is an important piece of literature in our history, it is FICTION!) One should read more than just biased, one-sided literature before assuming they are "educated" on a subject.

Sure you have a right to your opinion about who were are and what we do. However, there is nothing that our Order indorses that glorifies the institution of slavery. We do not seek to bring back the ills of the past, but to bring back that which we have lost that will only make life better. How can someone say that it is wrong to treat a woman as a lady? How can someone say that it is wrong to honor God? How can someone say that we must limit our constitutional and God-given right to free speech because someone might be offended due to their own ignorance. That, dear sir, is unfortunately what you have to deal with. You are ignorant of many facts. And I would suggest that until you learn more on this subject, you should refrain from maligning the many great men about whom you speak.

As Mark Twain wrote: "It is better to not speak and be thought a fool, than to speak and prove it."

[The Icon]

Everyone go home, threads over, nothing to see here.

[baby_KA83]

okay that article disturbed the sh*t out of me. I am an African-American KA and damn proud of it. It doesn't mean I "turned my back on my own people" or that I am a "sell out" cause I know where I came from and where I'm going. I don't give a f*ck what anyone thinks of me being a member of Kappa Alpha Order. Being a gentleman is something that our parents taught us WAY before we knew what a fraternity was (with the exception of KA legacies). The guy who wrote that can eat a fat d*ck (excuse my language) and for whoever spent an inordinate amount of time on diggin' dirt up on the Order, go to Riverside's chapter in CA or come to my chapter in Oklahoma City and get proven wrong. And someone said it before me there are other frats and sororities who aren't as squeaky clean either so if you are going to attack us, attack the ENTIRE greek system in the U.S. but don't come f*ckin' with us only.

Peace easy

[KABillyMac]

B.S.

[UT Martin KA]

Originally Posted by Deltadarling

I really hate to break this to you...since you are a KA you are going to be narrow minded and think that your frat is the shit, and maybe your chapter unlike the hundreds around the US are not racist ingnorant hill billy's just MAYBE your chapter is GREAT...but NOT ALL ARE.

DeltaDarling:

As a member of Kappa Alpha Order, I would like to speak privately with you on this matter. I will get you in touch with the people you need to report this horrible event to. I hate that our precious order has been permanently disgraced by the actions of a few individuals who obviously were asleep during inanition or were just not paying attention to the morals that we, as knights of our Order, hold so dear to our hearts (or at least should). I hope that you will someday see that 95% of KAs are not nearly as narrow minded as these at Steven F. Austin. I pray that you contact me so that this matter can be resolved and the individuals who so blatantly disgrace our precious letters might be brought to justice.

[SWTXBelle]

One of the main problems in dealing with a discussion of the War Between the States (I don't use the term "Civil War" because the CSA never sought to take over the USA but instead seceded) is that the history books are written by the victors. The tree remembers what the ax forgot. As a former college professor, I find it helpful to simply deliver a little pop quiz to establish certain facts.

1. In 1860, the states of the future C.S.A. paid 87% of all tariffs in the U.S.A.
- True
- False

2. No slaves came to the U.S.A. on ships flying the flag of the C.S.A., but fortunes were made by the citizens of the U.S.A. who brought thousands of captured Africans to this country.
-True
-False

3. In the 4th Lincoln-Doublas debate on September 18th, 1858, (less than 3 yrs. before the War) Lincoln stated "I will say, then, that I am not nor have ever been in favor bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the black and white races - that I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with White people; and Iwill say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the White and black races which will ever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together, there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I, as much as any other man, am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the White race. "
-True
-False

4. Slavery continued to be legal in four states of the U.S.A. throughout the War.
-True
-False

5. The Emancipation Proclamation freed slaves ONLY in the states of the C.S.A. not under U.S.A. control.
-True
-False

6. As a condition of joining the U.S.A. at the time of the American Revolution, several states, including Massachusetts and Virginia, specifically retained the right of secession.
-True
-False

7. Upon inheriting his father-in-laws property, Robert E. Lee immediately began freeing his slaves, and owned no slaves at the time of Emacipation Proclamation.
-True
-False

8. Before the WBTS, the South was one of the richest areas of the U.S.A.
-True
-False

9. In his 1860 inaugural address, Lincoln said that he had no intention to interfere with slavery because he had no legal right to do so.
-True
-False

10. Some Union generals didn't free their slaves until the ratification of the Fourteenth Amendment in 1868.
-True
-False

11. Ulysses Grant was the last U.S. president to own slaves.
-True
-False

12. In a letter to Elihu Washburne written during the War, Grant wrote "I never was an Abolitionist, not even what could be called anti slavery." To his father on May 6, 1861, Grant wrote "A few decisive victories in some of the southern ports will send the secession army howling and . . . negroes will depreciate so rapidly in value that no body will want to own them . . . the nigger will never disturb this country again."
-True
-False

13. The U.S.A. is the only country in the Western Hemisphere that did not peacefully abolish slavery.
-True
-False

14. In 1856, Robert E. Lee made this statement "There are few, I believe, in this enlightened age, who will not acknowledge that slavery as an institution is a moral and political evil."
-True
-False

15. In the 20th century, the KKK used both the battle flag of the C.S.A. and the Stars and Stripes of the U.S.A. in their marches.
-True
-False

16. After the War, many northern cities passes laws forbidding freed slaves from residing there.
-True
-False

I could go on - but my point is this. If you want to discuss the WBTS, you must deal with all of the complexities and political truths involved - not just those presented as justification for the War from the U.S.A. I will not tell you the answers - I've found it far better for those with no deep knowledge of the facts of TWBS to do their own research, and thus avoid any appearance of bias. The above statements are either true or false, and a quick internet search will lead you to the authoritative sources to establish the correct answer.
Having said that, there is no excuse for any GLO in indulge in any behavior which is racist, sexist, or in any way demeaning to anyone. I would hope that KA would immediately punish any and all members who in any way cause dishonour to themselves or the South.