After being initiated, transfering and joining another soro

[BadSquirrelBeta]

If she (or any young woman for that matter) was involved with a Beta Sigma Phi chapter on a college campus, which identifies and operates much like an active GL group on campus, she could seek membership in an NPC org.--pretty much the same as a local -OR- on the flip side, if she was in an NPC she could check out BSP, ESA or any of the other orgs discussed in the "joining a sorority" after college thread...perhaps there would be a fit for her there.

Alumnae Panhellenic may be an option for her too, if there is one, considering she left her former chapter in good standing.

Hope she can find a fit. And there of couse is nothing wrong with looking into membership in non-lettered campus clubs, organizations, etc., where friends can be made too!

[KerriMarie]

I can't imagine switching schools and wanting to get involved with any sorority other than Kappa - not after I've been through the initiation and ritual - maybe it doesn't mean as much to some people as it does to me - but I didn't say "I'm going to be a Kappa for the next short part of my life, then maybe I'll be a Zeta for a while... oooh, and DeeZee sounds cool..."

[alphagamgirlie]

Originally Posted by JessSigKap

If she still wants to be involved in the Greek Community at her new school, maybe she could get in contact with the Panhellenic Association and be a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma/Gamma Chi/Pi Chi/Sigma Rho Chi/whatever this school calls it. She'd be able to meet women in other chapters and she'd be the ultimate in being unbiased for the PNMs because her sorority does not have a chapter there. If she joined an NPC sorority, then that would be the most involved she could be in the Greek Community. If she joined a local at her old school, then she is allowed to go through recruitment.

If your school allows that, consider yourself lucky. At my school, a group of us AGDs & Phi Mus & Sigma Kappas 2 years ago tried to be Rho Gammas, and the school's Greek advisor had said that Panhellenic recruitment rules doesn't allow girls from nonexistent sororities (neither of us 3 organizations have ever been at our new school) to be Rho Gammas.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by alphagamgirlie

If your school allows that, consider yourself lucky. At my school, a group of us AGDs & Phi Mus & Sigma Kappas 2 years ago tried to be Rho Gammas, and the school's Greek advisor had said that Panhellenic recruitment rules doesn't allow girls from nonexistent sororities (neither of us 3 organizations have ever been at our new school) to be Rho Gammas.

wow, I can understand what she meant, but what an unnecessarily harsh way to put it!! Not only that, I'm not altogether sure that she's right.

[violetpretty]

Originally Posted by alphagamgirlie

If your school allows that, consider yourself lucky. At my school, a group of us AGDs & Phi Mus & Sigma Kappas 2 years ago tried to be Rho Gammas, and the school's Greek advisor had said that Panhellenic recruitment rules doesn't allow girls from nonexistent sororities (neither of us 3 organizations have ever been at our new school) to be Rho Gammas.

I only made this suggestion because I remember reading in another thread (which I convieniently can't find) that a Tri Delta transferred to Elon (this was before they colonized Tri Delta at Elon) and the Panhellenic Association let her be a Rho Chi. Maybe rules have changed since then, maybe they are only campus rules, or maybe Elon violated a rule.

I'd like to know the reasoning behind not allowing women who have transferred to a campus without their sorority to be Rho Gammas (or perhaps PHA officers), because it seems to me that it would be a good way to stay involved in the Greek community and these women would be much more likely to be unbiased.

[navane]

Originally Posted by AChiOhSnap

However, most (if not all) schools will transfer a woman's Greek history to her new school as part of her general transcript. This information is then passed along to that school's Greek Life office and she will not be allowed to sign up for recruitment or COB...or if she tried, she'd be quickly released from the process once they looked through her file.

Originally Posted by PeppyGPhiB

Really? I can't imagine my school's registrar office bothering to note my extracurriculars on my transcript...well, in fact I know they didn't, because I've seen my transcript. Is this really common?

I think I might be able to help with some clarification on this particular topic. I work as an Academic Advisor-Evaluator for a large, urban university with a 33,000+ student population. The "Evaluator" part of my job involves me processing transcripts from across the US and deciding how credit should be awarded. Needless to say, I've seen a LOT of transcripts.

That said, I have never seen a transcript which detailed a student's extracurricular activities - not the major universities, nor the small liberal arts places.

Originally Posted by AChiOhSnap

I don't actually think it's written on the transcript proper, but a part of the general transfer packet of materials sent from one school to another (along with health records, discipline records, etc.)

This would make more sense as transcripts are academic records; though, I have also never heard of a "general transfer packet" containing the items described above. I'm actually thinking that it would not be considered appropriate for an institution to send along items such as those. With our university, academic and or "student-related" probation is noted on the official transcript until the time that it is lifted. The rest of the stuff is largely irrelevant to an institution.

Even if a school sent those types of materials, and they came across my desk along with the academic transcript, I would not forward them to the student activities office. Having worked in the Greek Life office prior to moving over to advising, I can say that I've never received anything like that over there either.

I'm thinking that you must attend a unique school!

I hope this helps add some clarity to this particular point. If college Panhellenic associations want to try and suss out women who were previously initiated elsewhere, they'll have a tough time of it - universities just don't keep track of that kind of stuff. They'll have to rely on the student's honesty on the recruitment application....

.....Kelly

[MTSUGURL]

We don't have a Phi Mu chapter here, but I know we had a girl that was a Phi Mu transfer from somewhere and was on EBoard for Pan. I want to say she was the secretary... Look into this as an option.

[GDIfly]

Originally Posted by MTSUGURL

We don't have a Phi Mu chapter here, but I know we had a girl that was a Phi Mu transfer from somewhere and was on EBoard for Pan. I want to say she was the secretary... Look into this as an option.

That doesn't seem right to me. She's an NPC woman, but as someone who is not affiliated on your campus any of the decisions made by Panhellenic Exec wouldn't affect her, right? So it doesn't seem to make sense to let her have a hand in them. Being a PX is one thing, she wouldn't shape policy about greek life on campus, but letting an unaffiliated woman on the Panhellenic Exec Board seems like the same thing as letting someone who's a student at [for example] UT Dallas serve on the student government at UT Arlington. They're both 'University of Texas' students, but the membership doesn't quite transfer, she's not directly affected by the decisions, and she's probably not contributing monetarily to greek life there - at least not in the amount that an affiliated woman is.
If the decisions aren't directly affecting you, you shouldn't have a say in them, it's like... representation without taxation .

[lyrica9]

Originally Posted by AChiOhSnap

And let's hypothetically say that a woman was able to go through recruitment and join a sorority as a new member. The second she was "found out" (which would happen eventually) she would be unceremoniously booted and people would probably be pretty angry at her. It would probably be a humiliating experience for the PNM, but really, anyone who has been initiated into one NPC group should know better.

you'd be surprised how many girls don't know that once you're initiated into an NPC group you can't join any others. i've had a couple girls telling me that after they transferred to another school they were going to rush, not because they were trying to be sneaky, but because they simply didn't know.

i think a lot of girls/chapters just think that it pertains to that campus, and that if you go to another school without your sorority then it's ok to join another.

[blackngoldengrl]

Originally Posted by lyrica9

you'd be surprised how many girls don't know that once you're initiated into an NPC group you can't join any others. i've had a couple girls telling me that after they transferred to another school they were going to rush, not because they were trying to be sneaky, but because they simply didn't know.

i think a lot of girls/chapters just think that it pertains to that campus, and that if you go to another school without your sorority then it's ok to join another.

Sounds like someone in membership education was dropping the ball!

[dekeguy]

May I ask a question regarding Sorority practice in such a situation? On the Fraternity side we have the same or at least similar rules about not joining a national if you have been initiated into another national. (I understand that there are some very rare exceptions in one or two fraternities, but those are irrelevant here). Anyway, when I was an undergrad we had a transfer student who had been to high school with a couple of our guys. He had been initiated into a national that had no chapter on our campus. Since he got along well with all of us we invited him to hang with us (wearing his pin, letters, etc). He was not a member but was considered more than a visitor, not a brother but sort of a cousin. He participated in everything except closed chapter business/ritual and that sort of thing. He contributed prorata for any social events and always pulled his own weight in any activity he could join in with us. We had an informal composit photo showing the brothers and one "cousin". We thought of him as "one of the extended family".
Would an arrangement something like that be possible in the case you all are discussing?

[Drolefille]

Potentially. It depends on the rules for social activities which tend to be stricter for NPC than for fraternities. Hanging out at sisterhood or philanthropy events or even just at the house wouldn't be uncommon, IF she's good friends with the sisters. Clearly ritual would be out. But that's not the sort of arrangement that you can ask for as the person from the outside.

[dekeguy]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Potentially. It depends on the rules for social activities which tend to be stricter for NPC than for fraternities. Hanging out at sisterhood or philanthropy events or even just at the house wouldn't be uncommon, IF she's good friends with the sisters. Clearly ritual would be out. But that's not the sort of arrangement that you can ask for as the person from the outside.

Thanks for the info. The case I spoke of was unique in my house during my undergrad time, but it worked out well. We would have bid this guy if he had been eligible and as it turned out he was a very good non-member member. We had some guys who used to hang with us fairly regularly, but it was a much looser and much more informal arrangement than with our "cousin".
I understand that years ago there used to be a fairly common practice of inviting people in that sort of situation to become SA's or Social Affiliates where they were sort of cousins to the chapter. I think that has mostly died out as an official program but I think it has merit since there seem to be rather a lot of people stuck in the same situation. Much more undergraduate mobility perhaps?
As to the person in question, since she is an initiated member of XYZ couldn't she check out the orgs on her new campus, see if and where she seemed to fit, and if she found a really comfortable fit ask if she might (as a member of XYZ) be accepted as a "cousin", with the appropriate limitations, of course?
That way she would retain her XYZ identity, share close friendship with her ABC cousins, and have the chance to pull her own weight by actively helping out in all appropriate areas?

[33girl]

Originally Posted by dekeguy

May I ask a question regarding Sorority practice in such a situation? On the Fraternity side we have the same or at least similar rules about not joining a national if you have been initiated into another national. (I understand that there are some very rare exceptions in one or two fraternities, but those are irrelevant here). Anyway, when I was an undergrad we had a transfer student who had been to high school with a couple of our guys. He had been initiated into a national that had no chapter on our campus. Since he got along well with all of us we invited him to hang with us (wearing his pin, letters, etc). He was not a member but was considered more than a visitor, not a brother but sort of a cousin. He participated in everything except closed chapter business/ritual and that sort of thing. He contributed prorata for any social events and always pulled his own weight in any activity he could join in with us. We had an informal composit photo showing the brothers and one "cousin". We thought of him as "one of the extended family".
Would an arrangement something like that be possible in the case you all are discussing?

I think this used to be much more common for sororities, but now that the risk management rules are so much stricter, I don't think it happens as often. Not only that, if you have a campus with not the best Panhellenic regulations, another sorority could get wind of it and possibly use it as a rush infraction (even though the girl in question can't join). "Closed parties" (aka mixers) are much more closed than they used to be.

[dekeguy]

Originally Posted by 33girl

I think this used to be much more common for sororities, but now that the risk management rules are so much stricter, I don't think it happens as often. Not only that, if you have a campus with not the best Panhellenic regulations, another sorority could get wind of it and possibly use it as a rush infraction (even though the girl in question can't join). "Closed parties" (aka mixers) are much more closed than they used to be.

Thanks for the update on current limitations. It has been a few years since undergrad so I am not really current in my info. Would it still be a problem if her "special status" was officially disclosed to the Greek Life office and any other appropriate group? In our case, we notified the Dean of Students, whose office supervised Greek orgs, to see if there was any difficulty. We were advised that he was covered by our umbrella insurance policy and they had no heartburn about it. He then volunteered to kick in for his share of the premium since he spent a lot of time with us. A happy result all around.