Frat bashing article

[shinerbock]

When I said "popular black culture," what I meant was popular black culture. Its not prejudice by any stretch, turn on MTV or BET and see what I'm talking about. Included in that would be music (rap, etc), clothing, language (slang, etc.), and often times the glorification of things that are "ghetto." Then look at our "culture," which consists of country and classic rock, dressing "preppy," playing sports like golf and tennis...They don't really blend well.

[valkyrie]

Originally posted by shinerbock
When I said "popular black culture," what I meant was popular black culture. Its not prejudice by any stretch, turn on MTV or BET and see what I'm talking about. Included in that would be music (rap, etc), clothing, language (slang, etc.), and often times the glorification of things that are "ghetto." Then look at our "culture," which consists of country and classic rock, dressing "preppy," playing sports like golf and tennis...They don't really blend well.

Referring to "popular black culture" like you do is like calling your "culture" "popular white culture," which is a gross generalization and not at all accurate. Are you not saying that all black people are the same and fit the stereotypical MTV image you're mentioning here?

[shinerbock]

Nah, I disagree. I said white culture, when referring to mine, because it is not popular. It is not the image of white young people you see in the media or in major cities. If i meant popular white culture, i'd be referring to a more city-like style. I think that the things I said would be popular black culture, in that it is a popularly seen culture. Sure, there are black guys who are basically rednecks, and those that are really preppy, but you don't see it very often. It may even be true that the MTV and BET black culture you see doesn't represent even the majority of black people, but in my experience it does. Note I'm not referring to how people are, as in their character or education, but rather how they present themselves and the things they are involved in. I imagine the black kids on my campus are much better educated than the majority of black celebrities on MTV, but they still enjoy the same things, dress the same way, etc...

[shinerbock]

Notice me mentioning several times that popular does not include all, and therefore is not all encompassing.

[valkyrie]

Originally posted by shinerbock
Notice me mentioning several times that popular does not include all, and therefore is not all encompassing.

Eh, six of one half...

You said that most black students at your school are part of what you consider popular black culture. You're right -- you didn't say "all" -- but I still think you're generalizing.

[kk_bama]

shinerbock is right.

There is such a thing as popular black culture. Not every black person in America adheres to it or can relate to it, and many in fact disapprove of it, such as black leaders of the clergy, government and the business world. But you can't sit there and say there is no such thing. I've heard many denounce it. Just look at what the top songs in America are right now. All glorify the ghetto culture.

And beyond that, yes, race relations are different in the South! There are people in GLOs who are racist, and there are people involved in GLOs who are NOT. Do you think integrating my sorority in 2003 was easy? No, it sure as hell wasn't.

But I can say that I'm not racist. I never had a problem with anyone of any race joining my sorority, but it is disheartening to see others' reactions, even 2 and a half years later. That's why changes must slowly be made so that the South eventually will be like any other place in the country. But it's not all rainbows and smiley faces now. And strides are being made. And let's not forget that there are racists all over the country, aimed at all sorts of races and nationalities.

And finally...true Southern fraternity gentlemen who really care about their fraternities are not sitting over on fratty.net bragging about hunting ducks or sex or polo shirts or whatever. I find it hard to believe that any true 'fratty' types are spending all their time on a message board that glorifies the lifestyle.

[KSigkid]

Originally posted by kk_gphib_01
Do you think integrating my sorority in 2003 was easy? No, it sure as hell wasn't.

You may want to watch the wording on that - I think you mean your chapter, not the sorority as a whole.

[kk_bama]

Originally posted by KSigkid
You may want to watch the wording on that - I think you mean your chapter, not the sorority as a whole.

Thanks, yes, I was referring to my specific chapter. I'm pretty sure Gamma Phi internationally has been integrated for some time.

[valkyrie]

Originally posted by kk_gphib_01
shinerbock is right.

There is such a thing as popular black culture. Not every black person in America adheres to it or can relate to it, and many in fact disapprove of it, such as black leaders of the clergy, government and the business world. But you can't sit there and say there is no such thing. I've heard many denounce it. Just look at what the top songs in America are right now. All glorify the ghetto culture.

Whether there is a "popular black culture" isn't the issue. What was troublesome about the earlier post was the statement that most black people at X school are part of "popular black culture" and therefore not appropriate for membership in shinerbock's fraternity.

It's not okay to stereotype and use that as an excuse for excluding members of a race from an organization no matter where you are in the country.

[kk_bama]

Originally posted by valkyrie
Whether there is a "popular black culture" isn't the issue. What was troublesome about the earlier post was the statement that most black people at X school are part of "popular black culture" and therefore not appropriate for membership in shinerbock's fraternity.

It's not okay to stereotype and use that as an excuse for excluding members of a race from an organization no matter where you are in the country.

I don't know shinerbock's school, so I can't judge, but my feeling is that most likely the black students at shinerbock's schools don't even have a real desire to go through NIC or NPC rush. Most probably feel comfortable in NPHC orgs. That's how it is at Alabama, but there are exceptions.

So maybe it's a two-sided thing?

[valkyrie]

Originally posted by kk_gphib_01
I don't know shinerbock's school, so I can't judge, but my feeling is that most likely the black students at shinerbock's schools don't even have a real desire to go through NIC or NPC rush. Most probably feel comfortable in NPHC orgs. That's how it is at Alabama, but there are exceptions.

So maybe it's a two-sided thing?

I hope that if people of any race decide they aren't interested in NIC or NPC organizations, it's not because they dismiss members of such organizations as being backass, redneck, fashion-impaired, racist, stereotyping, small-minded assholes.

It sounds like you're saying, "Well, we have our organizations and they have theirs, so let's all be happy with that."

[WyoAlph]

Originally posted by frathole
This summer I wore the equivalent of, Nantucket Red 5 inch inseams, button down blue polo, rainbows, ray bans, croakies just about every day I wasn't at my internship where I had to wear a suit.

No gel in the hair, no funny slogans.

Five-inch inseam? I'm sure everyone appreciated seeing your goods.

Rudey – You're a pretty funny guy. But Mr. Pibb? Give me Dr. Pepper or give me death.

[valkyrie]

Originally posted by kk_gphib_01
There is such a thing as popular black culture. . . . All glorify the ghetto culture.

I'm not sure how I missed this -- but are you saying that black = ghetto?

[Rudey]

Originally posted by kk_gphib_01
I don't know shinerbock's school, so I can't judge, but my feeling is that most likely the black students at shinerbock's schools don't even have a real desire to go through NIC or NPC rush. Most probably feel comfortable in NPHC orgs. That's how it is at Alabama, but there are exceptions.

So maybe it's a two-sided thing?

There was a good article a while back on that.

It is two sided.

Who wants to join a fraternity to change it?

-Rudey

[Rudey]

Originally posted by WyoAlph
Five-inch inseam? I'm sure everyone appreciated seeing your goods.

Rudey – You're a pretty funny guy. But Mr. Pibb? Give me Dr. Pepper or give me death.

I also drink chamomile tea.

-Rudey