JHU Sigma Chi "Halloween in the Hood Party"

[shinerbock]

DSTS, maybe I should have said natural consequences. Isn't the university taking action against the fraternity? I think they should make the fraternity fend for themselves, and work to rebuild their image.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

DSTChaos, maybe I should have said natural consequences. Isn't the university taking action against the fraternity? I think they should make the fraternity fend for themselves, and work to rebuild their image.

What constitutes "natural consequences?" God's wrath? Volcanos and earthquakes?

Again, I don't know what campus cultures some of you are used to. If GLOs want to not have to potentially deal with university sanctions, be able to fend for themselves, and work on their OWN image, they need to remove themselves from the campus. If they choose to remain on the campus, they will always have to answer to the university and remember that their image as a GLO is never as important to the university as the university's image is. Moreover, campus organizations often have to respond to the challenges of other campus organizations, especially when other campus organizations have some political or administrative pull.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by centaur532

I don't deny that you make good points, but hear me out. The invite was incredibly racist. However, Sigma Chi brothers saw it, deemed it highly inappropriate and asked that it be taken down. It was, then put back up. The BSU saw the invite and went over the party to see what was up. Fair enough, I would have done the same thing. They saw the skeleton and that was enough. They did not go into the party where they may or may not have found some hard evidence. Accusing the Sigma Chis of racism based upon a PotC skeleton and an invite the Sigma Chis themselves condemned is just out of hand. They don't have anything to go on other than the racist facebook invitation which Sigma Chi did not condone in any way, and a skeleton that was unrelated.
That's the problem here.

So where is the disagreement? We both acknowledge that an investigation began as a result of a facebook advertisement. So they went to the party and the first thing they saw was a (misinterpreted) skeleton and they figured they wouldn't be welcomed or comfortable at the party, anyway, because they deemed it racially offensive. I wouldn't have gone into the party, either, unless I was going to call them out. Human beings are very unlikely to say "ohhhh, fun party...Pirates of the Carribean skeleton...I guess we can forget about the facebook invite and call it even."

The point of an investigation is to iron things out and see if further action needs to be taken, which is why we now know that it was one Sigma Chi who did the invitation and put it back up. That one Sigma Chi was punished before this investigation became public but how would the BSU really know this? Did the Sigma Chis attempt to do some form of outreach to smooth things over? If so, good. If not, bad. But if anyone is calling the entire chapter racist solely based on this information, they are idiots and I don't make it my business to debate about the thoughts and actions of idiots.

[Tom Earp]

The whole thing is B S!

Illegal-NO.
Insenative-YES.

Some people will get their noses bent out of joint for any small reason.

Chastise them and go along with life.

To many people are so thin skinned, they ought to stay in a closet and hide from the world.

[shinerbock]

DSTS, well I don't know how it works up there either. Its my opinion that organizations should be allowed to exist unless they break the law, or something else that really disturbs life at the university. Simply because something is not PC, and offends somebody, doesn't mean the organization should get the boot. An atheist group or a gay group probably doesn't reflect the values or students of a university, but that doesn't mean they should get reprimanded for their views. I'm just generally against legislating how people are allowed to think and act in their own time, regardless of what they're a member of. Let the group, and the national fraternity, decide what to do.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

DSTChaos

something else that really disturbs life at the university

Well there ya go. You don't get to determine what disturbs life at the university.

[macallan25]

But a Black Student Union does?

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by macallan25

But a Black Student Union does?

If a group of students expressed concern and felt their learning environment and campus experience is threatened by intolerant assholes? Yep.

Most universities have regulations that reasonably encourage "nonthreatening learning environments" both inside and outside of the classroom.

[macallan25]

Oh come on.....their learning environment???? You could say 99.999% of all of the parties that fraternities throw would be considered a hindrance to one's "learning environment."

I'm sorry, maybe its different on all of the campuses I have been to and know of. I've never heard of s student group actually having that type of authority which would enable them to help in an investigation and play a role in the fate of a chapter.

Nice of you to categorize Johns Hopkins chapter of Sigma Chi as "intollerant assholes" because one guy made a dumbass Facebook group....which was obviously not condoned by the fraternity.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by macallan25

Oh come on.....their learning environment???? You could say 99.999% of all of the parties that fraternities throw would be considered a hindrance to one's "learning environment."

Good observation. Many universities have made a similar observation and are more closely regulating parties.

Originally Posted by macallan25

I'm sorry, maybe its different on all of the campuses I have been to and know of. I've never heard of s student group actually having that type of authority which would enable them to help in an investigation and play a role in the fate of a chapter.

It's not real to you therefore it doesn't exist, right?

Originally Posted by macallan25

Nice of you to categorize Johns Hopkins chapter of Sigma Chi as "intollerant assholes" because one guy made a dumbass Facebook group....which was obviously not condoned by the fraternity.

You're way smarter than to draw this conclusion. I hope.

[shinerbock]

I don't really think this party disturbs anything more than an atheist group holding some event would. When I said serious disturbances, I meant something that really hindered life on campus, not something that people got their feathers ruffled over.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

I don't really think this party disturbs anything more than an atheist group holding some event would. When I said serious disturbances, I meant something that really hindered life on campus, not something that people got their feathers ruffled over.

If the atheist group used religious-sattire or offensive words and images aimed at nonatheists to advertise? Perhaps.

As someone who has been on campuses with racial tension sparked by what many white people (not all b/c there were whites who protested, as well) thought was harmless fun because they never had to think about anyone other than themselves, I can say that a group of concerned students and/or administration is the determinant of what is a hinderance.

[LaneSig]

I have kept quiet for a while because I felt that my being a Sigma Chi might be clouding my judgement on this issue. I still stand by my first posting in this thread.

I am disturbed by the fact that a JHU official(s) told them that the party was a bad idea and they should not hold it (or maybe they should change the theme). For the chapter to go ahead shows a complete lack of sense and judgement. This is where the local alumns and HQ should step in and have the chapter take a serious look at themselves and what they feel is the image of Sigma Chi.

I am disturbed by the BSU getting so involved. With all due respect to members on this board who think that BSU has a right to be involved: I believe that BSU has a right to their opinion and to express that opinion. But, I do not believe that they have the right to be in the investigation (if I am reading that correctly). They should let the JHU administration and Sigma Chi HQ investigate. If the BSU does not agree with the recommendation of the admin and our HQ, let us know. I would feel the same way if this were any other group. I didn't agree with the Campus Republican groups that held the Affirmative Action Bake Sales. It is not up to me or my group, but the admin and whatever HQ they have to decide the punishment or lack thereof.
If I am misreading the extent of the BSU's involvement with the investigation, please let me know and I will edit out my comments.

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

Good observation. Many universities have made a similar observation and are more closely regulating parties.



It's not real to you therefore it doesn't exist, right?



You're way smarter than to draw this conclusion. I hope.

I never said something similar didn't exist......however, judging from the responses of many people in this thread....it does appear that the idea of having a student organization take a role in the investigation process of another student organization is rather foreign. That is why I said that maybe it was different at places that I am familiar with.

Maybe I drew the wrong conclusion.....but it did seem like you were making a pretty strong inferrence with the "intollerant assholes" comment.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

I find it hard to believe that you've read that book or any other book.

Wow, insulting intelligence. Now that's never been done on a message board. Instead of being able to come up with some eloquent come back, it's just drivel that you usually write.