Recession? What recession? The Bushes Buy Fine China for almost 1/2 a mil.

[DaemonSeid]

Ok...so now that we are back talking china...here is my question...if there is a question of replacing it so often, then how often are they using the china that it needs replacing? LOL

Are foreign dignitaries just dropping in weekly or something?

I mean it's not like they eat off the fine china daily....heck if that's the case, then donate some of that stuff to me so I can throw out my old plates I have been using the past 2 terms....heheheheh!!!

[RU OX Alum]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

They should have bought a shoe rack instead.

heh

[cheerfulgreek]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

And what is the environmental impact of Styrofoam? Hmmmm??

eta - And I'm getting a headache from the more illogical arguments. Teaching logic warps you, it must be said. Sigh. Putting people on ignore also doesn't work if they get quoted by others -

I'm not sure what the environmental impact would be, but I'm sure the leaking juices from the meat and veggies would be a very messy impact on Daemon's $10,000.00 table cloth. lol (DS I'm kidding)

I'm guilty of putting people on ignore...

[KSigkid]

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

And FTR I think this bail-out was total crap. Mofo's just getting billions for no reason.

I'll agree with you on that one - unfortunately, it looks like both sides of the aisle are more than happy to make that mistake.

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

Ok...so now that we are back talking china...here is my question...if there is a question of replacing it so often, then how often are they using the china that it needs replacing? LOL

Are foreign dignitaries just dropping in weekly or something?

I mean it's not like they eat off the fine china daily....heck if that's the case, then donate some of that stuff to me so I can throw out my old plates I have been using the past 2 terms....heheheheh!!!

I'm not an expert on this by any stretch, but is it used just for foreign dignitaries? I would imagine the china is also used for formal dinners with members of Congress, Governors, etc.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by cheerfulgreek

I'm not sure what the environmental impact would be, but I'm sure the leaking juices from the meat and veggies would be a very messy impact on Daemon's $10,000.00 table cloth. lol (DS I'm kidding)

Hence styrofoam plates and they have to take their shoes off at the door, not for fear of them being thrown but I will be damned if they mess up the White House carpet.....and put plastic on the White House couches too:

Originally Posted by KSigkid

I'm not an expert on this by any stretch, but is it used just for foreign dignitaries? I would imagine the china is also used for formal dinners with members of Congress, Governors, etc.

Serve bag and box dinners to them...it's more eco friendly.

Heh!

[cheerfulgreek]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

Hence styrofoam plates and they have to take their shoes off at the door, not for fear of them being thrown but I will be damned if they mess up the White House carpet.....and put plastic on the White House couches too:

lol lol lol (o.k. that's it...you owe me two cups of Starbucks, and possibly a new computer)

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

To hell with the historical legacy crap. Buying china is not the best way to enhance the historical legacy of the white house. I would have been more understanding if the Bushes purchased art of some kind. That is something that I would consider a legacy, but dinnerware? Nope. Its not like they dont already have china for dignitaries to eat from so what is the need for more? What dignitaries are they hosting over the next 14 days that they'll need china for?

From The Washington Post:

White House china is displayed in many rooms of the house, and the designs and shapes reflect the style and food in vogue through 200 years of presidential families. There are the French porcelain oyster plates and bonbon stands of the Rutherford B. Hayes administration and the cocktail cups and oatmeal bowls of Woodrow Wilson.

"The china shows the taste of the day. It records history," White House social secretary Amy Zantzinger said.

The frequent entertaining at the White House takes its toll on the china, and breakage depletes the numbers over the years.

"Right now, we only have two complete sets of china we can use for a state dinner for 134: the Reagan and the Clinton services," Zantzinger said.

Mrs. Bush explained that up to now, presidential families have used the formal state services for their meals and entertaining in the upstairs private quarters. She said that she most frequently used the red Reagan china but that her husband is partial to the Johnson service, which Lady Bird Johnson designed to depict wildflowers from throughout the country. Now, Bush said, future first families will have the option of using the "more informal" set for lunches and small dinners.

. . .

The debut of the Bush china occurred at a small luncheon this week for U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon.

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

If your next door neighbor just got a new expensive couch (to add to the many he already has and you know that the person who is moving in after he leaves in 2 weeks is going to buy another) after he turned to you and asked you to sacrifice to help his friend pay for a huge mistake she made would you not question why he let someone buy him a Couch when he knew his friend needed help? Personally, he'd have to sell the Couch or make some type of personal sacrifice before he could step to me and ask for my dollars. I would question his discretion.

Your analogy is off in so many ways. To make it a bit more on target, my next door neighbor would have ordered that couch a few years ago, before any economic turndown. He didn't pay for it with his own money or with my money -- he paid for it with a gift of money that came with the stipulation that it can only be used for buying new furniture for the house. And while he has other couches already, they are not sufficient to meet the entertaining needs that everyone in the neighborhood expects him to fulfill on our behalf, which is one reason we've been letting him and his family live in the house to begin with.

The Bushes didn't just go to Ikea last week and buy new china. The process for designing and buying this china started years ago, and the reports all note that the new china had been expected to arrive long before now, but was delayed for a variety of reasons.

The money that was used to buy the china couldn't have been used for some other purpose, such as helping people who are having trouble paying mortgages. The money came from a foundation, which can only spend its funds on items related to the care, conservation, history and furnishing of the White House. So, there were three choices here: spend the money on china for the White House, spend the money on something else for the White House, or don't spend the money at all. They spent the money on china, putting a half-million dollars back into the economy that might not have been there otherwise.

Just not that big of a deal.

[SWTXBelle]

Also, there seems to be a belief that spending money during a recession is bad. This is false. The BEST thing for those with money to do right now is SPEND it - businesses are going under because there simply are no buyers. If money doesn't start moving we are going to have even more problems- a terrible trickle down effect which some are feeling even as we speak.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

Also, there seems to be a belief that spending money during a recession is bad. This is false. The BEST thing for those with money to do right now is SPEND it - businesses are going under because there simply are no buyers. If money doesn't start moving we are going to have even more problems- a terrible trickle down effect which some are feeling even as we speak.

Can't spend what you don't have.

Can't make it to spend if you don't something to make it with.

[EE-BO]

Originally Posted by epchick

They've got the china, it wasn't paid with your tax money---Seriously, just get over it.

Exactly. This is just silliness.

SWTXBelle is right as well. This is a time when you WANT people spending money.

Those who can and do spend money right now are the ones who are going to bring this economy back eventually.

It is never a "good time" to make an extravagant purchase because there are always people out there who are envious and jealous- poor economy or not.

So I am certainly not of the mind that those who can live large in a down economy need to be ashamed of it. The First Lady wisely chose to not make note of the price because that would be tacky. It was the media that decided to play that up.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

Can't spend what you don't have.

Can't make it to spend if you don't something to make it with.

Which is why it's important for those who do have the money to spend to get out and spend it for the sake of the rest of us.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

Which is why it's important for those who do have the money to spend to get out and spend it for the sake of the rest of us.

Let me borrow 10 bucks form you, I'm good for it once the recession is over!

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

Let me borrow 10 bucks form you, I'm good for it once the recession is over!

LOL - hey I included myself in that "us." Then again, I did wait until the economy was in the toilet to buy two cars and a house. It was intentional!

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by deepimpact2

I'm amused that you actually wrote this. There are practicing attorneys who can barely write. At least these 1Ls you speak of have an excuse (IF their writing is really unclear and unpersuasive...we only have YOUR asessment of that... which is definitely not a final authority).

There are footballs that aren't properly inflated, too - that doesn't change the score of last night's game.

Seriously, formal logic, ace.

[I.A.S.K.]

Originally Posted by epchick

The Bush family is NOT paying for the china. If you even read the article, you'd know that the White House Historical Association is paying for the china (as they did for the Reagans and the Clintons).
The only thing the Bush family has to do with this china is that they picked the design.

I know that they are not paying for the China! My point is that it was the Bush family's choice to buy the china. Like I said before I think that this is horrible timing and sends a bad impression. I also don't agree with the purchase because I think that art would have been more sensible than China especially because the incomming fam may buy new China.

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Your analogy is off in so many ways. To make it a bit more on target, my next door neighbor would have ordered that couch a few years ago, before any economic turndown. He didn't pay for it with his own money or with my money -- he paid for it with a gift of money that came with the stipulation that it can only be used for buying new furniture for the house, or something else valuable for the house, or not spending the money at all. And while he has other couches already, they are not sufficient to meet the entertaining needs that everyone in the neighborhood expects him to fulfill on our behalf, which is one reason we've been letting him and his family live in the house to begin with.
The thing about the china is that since it was paid for years ago (the price of it was still extreme to me) and is just being delivered now the only thing I'm really talking about is impression and appearance. Even if your neighbor ordered the couch two years ago I believe that the couch would factor into your decision to give him money. I did not say it should but it will.

The money that was used to buy the china couldn't have been used for some other purpose, such as helping people who are having trouble paying mortgages. The money came from a foundation, which can only spend its funds on items related to the care, conservation, history and furnishing of the White House. So, there were three choices here: spend the money on china for the White House, spend the money on something else for the White House<-- what I said would have been a better choice in my opinion, or don't spend the money at all <---Also an option they could have used. They spent the money on china, putting a half-million dollars back into the economy that might not have been there otherwise.

Just not that big of a deal.

^^ I agree that its not that big of a deal. As I said the money is spent and I wouldn't reverse it if I could. That does not mean that I agree with the purchase. I happen to believe that there could have been a better purchase and much better timing.

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

Also, there seems to be a belief that spending money during a recession is bad. This is false. The BEST thing for those with money to do right now is SPEND it - businesses are going under because there simply are no buyers. If money doesn't start moving we are going to have even more problems- a terrible trickle down effect which some are feeling even as we speak.

I know that when in a recession the government spends money to keep our economy at equalibrium. This is the reason that the New Deal was a success. What I'm saying is that in a recession money should be spent in a more concientious manner. FDR spent money on the arts (which many people considered frivolous) but it was money well spent. I happen to put new China in the unnecessary and frivolous category.

While I agree in part about the need for people to spend money I also understand that if the people with money spend their money they will not be the people with money for long. In a recession most people cannot afford to be buyers. The only thing I would consider buying is CDs, Bonds, and other things that garuntee a return. The thing about the trickle down effect is that when there are cut backs they trickle all the way down, but when there are profits, they dont necessarily trickle.