Greek acceptance in the church! - Page 6

Kevin · #1 11-21-2002, 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CUPrez
Speaking of Christianity and Greek Life... There are quite a few Christian sororities and fraternities that were founded by Christians for Christians.

This doesn' t mean that there are not Christians in other organization, because there are! In fact, my own parents belong to other Greek organizations that do not necessarily have a Christian base, and they are very much Christian.

But, there is something to be said for organizations that hold this as their ideal and that unswervingly and unashamedly proclaim Christ and Him crucified. It bothers me when organizations say they have a Christian foundation, but you go to their websites and see ladies with their behinds hanging out. Why even fake it?

Why must your organization practice a certain religion to be acceptable? It is what's in YOUR heart that counts. My fraternity was founded when 3 men gathered around a Bible and took an oath to stop the physical and mental abuse present at VMI in 1869. All 3 men were very strong Christians. Today, my fraternity remains in its essence an organization that is very in-line with the Bible's teachings. I don't think Jesus would have had any qualms with our 3 cardinal virtues, Love, Honor and Truth...

We however gladly accept brothers of ALL religions. It is not about religion.. I believe that's why we have church -- a place where religion is the common thread.. It's about brotherhood.

If you have to have religion in common to have a bond that's just fine. I see you're in an exclusively Christian organization and that's fine. It's just not for everyone... Neither is mainstream Greek Life though.

You have to go where your values take you.

I do have a problem with your comment where you seemed to be saying that NONE of us practice our ideals. I think that's a very incorrect and judgemental statement. You know as much about my fraternity and others (with the exception of those we've come in direct contact with) as I know about yours.

CUPrez · #2 11-21-2002, 02:00 AM

Woah,

I think you read into my comments something that was not there...

First of all, all fraternities and sororities have requirements and a membership profile. That's why we are exclusive organizations. Ours happens to be that our members be Christian. They can be apart of any denomination, but we are a sorority for Christian women.

Never did I say that no one was living up to their ideals. I merely stated that those that claim to be Christian and don't follow through are reprehinsible. I believe everyone should do their best to keep their word and uphold their ideals. I didn't say anything about your organization not upholding it's ideals. I don't know where you got that from.

As I stated, there are Christians in other organizations. But, that doesn't mean that they are in a Christian organization. There's nothing wrong with that. But, they shouldn't claim that their organization is Christian if it isn't. That doesn' t make anyone better or worse. I'm just saying that everyone should be real about what their organization really is...

CUPrez

Kevin · #3 11-21-2002, 02:08 AM

And how would you know what that organization really is if you weren't in it?

You wouldn't.

Without studying the reasons an organization was founded and the entire history (much of which many organizations keep secret I'd assume) you'd really have no clue as to the TRUE purpose. Most of our mottos are secret so the only people that truly understand an organization are its members.

Bottom line is that if an organization claims to be Christian in its founding beliefs and principles you'd best take their word for it. You have no right and no factual base to say otherwise.

We just don't exclude others based on religion.

But merely stating that it's reprehensible for individuals not to follow their organization's ideals.. well I'd say to some degree EVERYONE is guilty of that. So why pass judgement on others?

Let he (or she) who is without sin cast the first stone.

kstar · #4 11-21-2002, 07:32 AM

Two things:

One when you read the Phi Kappa Theta website, it says Pope John Paul the SECOND, who was from the USA, but he is not the current pope, that is John Paul the THIRD.

And Two, why do you care so much what the church thinks of you, are you that despret in seeking approval that you have be liked by all? And if it is a Christian thing (I don't know, because I'm Jewish) and if you really get judged by god after you die, won't he be forgiving, isn't that what you preach? Didn't he give you free will for a reason?

CarolinaCutie · #5 11-21-2002, 09:33 AM

This is an interesting topic... Religion is always one thing that people feel VERY strongly about.

As for me, I'm with PinkIce on a lot of points. My organization is founded on Christian principles, and that means a lot to me. I have not been through initiation yet (Friday

), but I know that several of my sisters are religious, and they would not be a member of an organization that was not Christian-based. As I've said before on this board, the use of Bible verses in the Pref night ceremony and the double mention of God in the Creed were two factors that influenced my decision to go Phi Mu. Our chapter even has a weekly optional Bible study. Christianity and being Greek CAN go hand in hand.

My church is not adverse to the Greek community at all. Actually, my decision to rush was heavily influenced by a Delta Zeta from another school who goes to my church. I think some people believe the hype about binge drinking and immoral behavior... but I think Christians in GLOs are working to change those stereotypes.

I would be interested to hear from a member of Chi Omega on this subject. I know we've all seen the website

and truthfully, I WOULD have a problem with their ALLEGED ritual. I'm 100% sure there are many members of Chi Omega who consider themselves Christian... I would like to know how they feel about it. I'm not sure that will ever happen though... it's obviously taboo to talk about ritual on GC for everyone to see.

33girl · #6 11-21-2002, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kstar
Two things:

One when you read the Phi Kappa Theta website, it says Pope John Paul the SECOND, who was from the USA, but he is not the current pope, that is John Paul the THIRD.

Actually, the current Pope is John Paul the Second...

John XXIII 1958-63
Paul VI 1963-78
John Paul I 1978 (he took the names of both previous Popes to honor them...he was only Pope for a couple months)
John Paul II 1978-present - he is from Poland.

Incidentally, there was also a Pope Dionysius.

CUPrez · #7 11-22-2002, 12:35 AM

The Bible also says that "by their fruits ye shall know them." If an organization is founded on Christian principles, and are doing totally un-Christian things and carrying on in ways that are not by the Bible that is how you can see that.

Many organizations hold things secret, but not their history and why their were founded-- that is usually public knowledge. So if they say they are Christian and don't follow through (as an organization) that is a problem. Sure, you will always have a member or two that does not do the right thing, but that isn't what I'm talking about.

The Bible also says, "faith without works is dead." So to proclaim you're a Christian organization and act another way-- that's not right.

CUPrez

adduncan · #8 11-22-2002, 12:48 AM

Quote:

The Bible also says that "by their fruits ye shall know them." If an organization is founded on Christian principles, and are doing totally un-Christian things and carrying on in ways that are not by the Bible that is how you can see that.

Many organizations hold things secret, but not their history and why their were founded-- that is usually public knowledge. So if they say they are Christian and don't follow through (as an organization) that is a problem. Sure, you will always have a member or two that does not do the right thing, but that isn't what I'm talking about.

The Bible also says, "faith without works is dead." So to proclaim you're a Christian organization and act another way-- that's not right.

CU Prez, be really, REALLY careful.

The Bible also says, "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."

Accusing others of behaving opposite to Christian virtues can potentially come back to bite you in the behind. You may not "intend" to make accusations, per se, but your words are treading a fine line.

Unless you and your group can claim to be absolutely perfect, never make mistakes, never have an episode of bad judgement, or otherwise engage in wrong doing, you are setting yourself up to be lambasted as hypocrites. **Everyone** makes mistakes at one point or another. **Everyone** makes a judgement call that they would not repeat given another chance. I'll bet members of your group do too, we just don't know about it. It's part of being human and why we need forgiveness.

I would also not condemn anyone for wanting to maintain their privacy. GLOs keep certain things private. Just like you do. If you want your group to be respected, the quickest way to achieve that is to GIVE respect and be patient with people you disagree with.

Jesus didn't condemn the woman busted for adultery. Why are you condeming other Greeks for simply not proclaiming their faith in the same manner that you do?

Just food for thought.

Kevin · #9 11-22-2002, 01:29 AM

Quote:

The Bible also says that "by their fruits ye shall know them." If an organization is founded on Christian principles, and are doing totally un-Christian things and carrying on in ways that are not by the Bible that is how you can see that.

You want to compare Christian organizations $'s donated to charity/service hours to that of regular GLO's?

Go right ahead

33girl · #10 11-22-2002, 11:02 AM

Many "Christian principles" do not necessitate a belief in Christ to be followed. Christians don't have a corner on loving their neighbor as themselves, turning the other cheek, etc. My ex was (at the time) an atheist and treated others in a far more Christian manner than some of the "Christians" who were shouting all the time about how righteous they were.

I think there are very few mainstream fraternities these days that say they are Christian orgs, since that used to mean that non-Christians were not allowed in.

MTSUGURL · #11 11-22-2002, 01:29 PM

Quote:

You want to compare Christian organizations $'s donated to charity/service hours to that of regular GLO's?

Go right ahead

One thing that has impressed me so much about the AOPi chapter on our campus is their annual babecue for arthritis. This year they raised $15000. Before then, I didn't know any AOPis and hadn't watched them very much to form an opinion, but this definitely gave me a great impression.

I belong to the Baptisit Collegiate Ministries on my campus, and every year we set a goal for our missions fund of $6000. This may not seem like a lot to groups that have 80-150 members, but we've only have about 30 people who were really active and about 15 that helped fundraise, so it was a big deal and something we were proud of when we raised $8-9000 the past few years. There are a lot of other things they do - a couple of years ago, when I wasn't even in school, I was having a hard time paying my bills and they paid my rent. They routinely donate to people's families if they need money for hospital bills, money after a family member dies, etc. My church has been showing the same kind of support to people in the community since it was started 15 years ago.

I personally have 80+service hours this semester - and found most of these opportunities through my church and BCM.

Just because a Chrisitan organization doesn't advertise everything they do in areas of charity or community service doesn't mean it's not there. Most of the good they do isn't advertised because they don't want to call attention to themselves, but to God instead. I'm not saying we're perfect, but I'm also not going to agree that GLOs (mine included) are better because they do so much to help their charities and do advertise it.