Hazed: A greek tragedy at Northwestern-Lambda Phi Epsilon

[jon1856]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

nwu43, stop talking. You don't owe us anything. This is a matter for your national organization to handle -- it's bigger than you. Trust me on this.

(And I still owe you a reply to a PM from March - sorry!)

BON I was thinking along these lines as well.
I truly thought that he was going to add to prior posting something along the lines of "under the advise of attorney" rather than what he did write in post.

[pReciouSdRaguN]

Originally Posted by aggieAXO

Personally having ALL of your pledges drop out makes you look pretty bad to me. I admit I am a little biased after hearing about the death of one of your pledges here in Austin 3 years ago.

Not that Im trying to get involved in this debate of sorts, but I just have to say.. just because a whole pledge class decides to DP doesnt mean the organization itself is doing a bad job or anything. It could've happened to anyone. It just s0o happens that they felt Lambdas wasnt for them.

And secondly, we shouldnt compare one chapter's pledging style with another because pledging styles and traditions do vary depending on the school and location, although they may have some similarities. I feel that it's a little unfair to base one chapter's actions against their national organization. I mean, you can be biased towards that chapter, but not nationally. Ok, that's all. Thanks for reading

[SoCalGirl]

Originally Posted by pReciouSdRaguN

Not that Im trying to get involved in this debate of sorts, but I just have to say.. just because a whole pledge class decides to DP doesnt mean the organization itself is doing a bad job or anything. It could've happened to anyone. It just s0o happens that they felt Lambdas wasnt for them.

And secondly, we shouldnt compare one chapter's pledging style with another because pledging styles and traditions do vary depending on the school and location, although they may have some similarities. I feel that it's a little unfair to base one chapter's actions against their national organization. I mean, you can be biased towards that chapter, but not nationally. Ok, that's all. Thanks for reading

Seriously???? If your entire pledge class drops you're doing all sorts of wrong things. Be it picking the wrong people or hazing the hell out of them or something in between. Don't blame the pledges for the chapter's problem.

[pReciouSdRaguN]

Originally Posted by SoCalGirl

Seriously???? If your entire pledge class drops you're doing all sorts of wrong things. Be it picking the wrong people or hazing the hell out of them or something in between. Don't blame the pledges for the chapter's problem.

Im not saying that it's solely the pledges' problem if they dont cross, but it's also not solely the chapter's either. Sometimes they [the pledges] feel the organization is just not right for them or they cant hack it.. sometimes it's the organization's fault for their methods of teaching. There are times when organizations dont cross a class; it's unfortunately, but it happens. Im just saying there are many perspectives to see this from, not just one.

But then again, I dont go to Northwestern and I didnt pledge Lambdas there, s0o I wouldnt really know if there really would be someone to blame.. not like I was pointing a finger to begin with.

[Kevin]

I don't think anyone is ready to conclude guilt.

Back in my active days, I had a little something to do with getting a pledge kicked out. I was, of course, accused by both this kid (and his mother) of hazing, which was a lie. In fact, they went so far as to try to seek redress through the University and through our Headquarters. Fortunately for me, no one found them credible enough to even take it to the next step.

All we know is this: An entire pledge class dropped.

As to why, consider this clip from the story:

Four of the pledges, who were granted anonymity because they feared retribution from active Lambdas, had slightly differing accounts of DTYD and other pledge events. (Some of them attempted to retract their tape-recorded statements in similarly worded e-mails sent earlier this week, denying they ever pledged the fraternity.) All accounts in this story were reconstructed from coinciding details.

Often when pledges drop out or are asked to leave, they will want to take revenge. There are other possible explanations here.

[PhiGam]

I really don't see what the big deal is. Nobody died or got hurt. Of course hazing is wrong but this is not newsworthy IMO.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

I really don't see what the big deal is. Nobody died or got hurt. Of course hazing is wrong but this is not newsworthy IMO.

Feelings were hurt.

Aren't feelings important?

[L.O.C.K.]

I am not saying whether or not this chapter was guilty because there hasn't been any results from an investigation.

As for LPhiE's National Board, as Vice Chair of the umbrella organization for 10 Asian American fraternities and sororities, we have offered them the opportunity to join our organization and work with us to improve the Asian American Greek community. However, they have refused. At this point, we have no contact with their National Board (nor do we know who they are).

While I respect the tenants of Lambda Phi Epsilon and I know brothers of the organization who are very respectable and uphold the organizational values, as a whole, Lambda Phi Epsilon has been very hard to work with.

Unfortunately, I just saw this article about a death of one of their brothers from Binghamton. It is a very sad story and my heart goes out to the family of this man who died way too young.

http://www.pressconnects.com/apps/pb...NTPAGECAROUSEL


If you all have more questions, feel free to post here or PM me.

Sincerely,
Nate

[CULater]

Originally Posted by L.O.C.K.

I am not saying whether or not this chapter was guilty because there hasn't been any results from an investigation.

As for LPhiE's National Board, as Vice Chair of the umbrella organization for 10 Asian American fraternities and sororities, we have offered them the opportunity to join our organization and work with us to improve the Asian American Greek community. However, they have refused. At this point, we have no contact with their National Board (nor do we know who they are).

While I respect the tenants of Lambda Phi Epsilon and I know brothers of the organization who are very respectable and uphold the organizational values, as a whole, Lambda Phi Epsilon has been very hard to work with.

Unfortunately, I just saw this article about a death of one of their brothers from Binghamton. It is a very sad story and my heart goes out to the family of this man who died way too young.

http://www.pressconnects.com/apps/pb...NTPAGECAROUSEL


If you all have more questions, feel free to post here or PM me.

Sincerely,
Nate

that's so sad, i know people who go to Cornell and Binghamton...

mentioning Cornell, they have a Sunshine Policy where greeks who have gotten hazing sanctions are put on blast:

http://www.hazing.cornell.edu/incide...ngBlotter.html

Lambda Phi Epsilon has gotten into trouble twice, both alcohol and calinsthetics related

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Feelings were hurt.

Aren't feelings important?

Not important enough to warrant a damn newspaper article or an "outrage." Most pledges would be happy if this "drink til you drop" was the worst part of their pledgeship.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by L.O.C.K.

I am not saying whether or not this chapter was guilty because there hasn't been any results from an investigation.

As for LPhiE's National Board, as Vice Chair of the umbrella organization for 10 Asian American fraternities and sororities, we have offered them the opportunity to join our organization and work with us to improve the Asian American Greek community. However, they have refused. At this point, we have no contact with their National Board (nor do we know who they are).

While I respect the tenants of Lambda Phi Epsilon and I know brothers of the organization who are very respectable and uphold the organizational values, as a whole, Lambda Phi Epsilon has been very hard to work with.

Unfortunately, I just saw this article about a death of one of their brothers from Binghamton. It is a very sad story and my heart goes out to the family of this man who died way too young.

http://www.pressconnects.com/apps/pb...NTPAGECAROUSEL


If you all have more questions, feel free to post here or PM me.

Sincerely,
Nate

Nate, I take issue with this..... Theta Nu Xi hasn't joined the National Multicultural Greek Council and both they and NMGC are doing fine. LPE might not feel your council is the best fit for them, and that's okay.

[Educatingblue]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

nwu43, stop talking. You don't owe us anything. This is a matter for your national organization to handle -- it's bigger than you. Trust me on this.

(And I still owe you a reply to a PM from March - sorry!)

I was going to PM him this...I think coming on GC and trying to defend your org is one of the biggest mistakes younger orgs make. As hard as it may be, you have to read and ignore.

[Kevin]

I agree.

Younger organizations would do well to understand when it's time to circle the wagons and when it's time to speak.

That said, anything anyone needs deleted regarding this (that is false), PM me.

I'm thinking about locking this thread, but I'm not there yet.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by CULater

mentioning Cornell, they have a Sunshine Policy where greeks who have gotten hazing sanctions are put on blast:

http://www.hazing.cornell.edu/incide...ngBlotter.html

The problem with that is, some of them are ridiculous (the toilet paper) and it just makes everyone laugh at it...so even if you got caught "hazing", if it's something the general populace finds funny or not bad it's not going to hurt your numbers....it will more likely help them because it gives you PR.

[nittanyalum]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

Most pledges would be happy if this "drink til you drop" was the worst part of their pledgeship.

I think Kevin's post was meant to be sarcastic (dripping with it, in fact).

And the danger of the statement above is that too quickly, these sentiments could turn into ridiculous things like boiling water being poured on pledges and disfiguring them for life.