Grammar, please!

[MysticCat]

Originally posted by ROWDYsister (in part)
I dug this up because I was wondering about the "alum" thing.

So alumnae is pronounced "alum-nay?"

If "alumni" refers to masculine or mixed plural, then why is it dead wrong when used for an all-female college? Wouldn't it be like one of those situations you could use the male form for, just to be safe? I mean, I know "alumnae" would be preferred...

As for your first question:

In Latin, "alumni" is pronounced alum-nee (as in that joint in the middle of your leg), and "alumnæ" is pronounced "alum-neye" (as in the organ with which you are reading this post ). American English pronunciation typically reverses the Latin pronunciation, so that alumni = alum-neye and "alumnæ" = alum-nee.

As for your second question, alumni is dead wrong for an all-female college because it is the masculine plural -- it is only properly used when refering to a group of male graduates or a group of male and female graduates.

All male graduates = alumni.
All female graduates = alumnæ.
A group of 9,999 female graduates and one male graduate = alumni (because it is mixed male and female, however slightly).

The word "alumnus" means "foster son" in Latin (literally someone that one feeds or supports); by extension it means pupil. As the feminine version of alumnus, alumna means "foster daughter." The idea is that a graduate is a foster or adopted child of Alma Mater ("dear Mother"). That's why "alumni" is inappropriate for an all-female college or a sorority -- graduated students/members are "daughters," not "sons."

[Tink16]

I can see how incorrect grammar can get to you. Incorrect spelling bothers the heck out of me. I know I have been guilty of it especially when I'm tired, but it still bugs me.

[Kevin]

It's not what you say but how you say it.

A few well placed mispellings can ruin an otherwise excellent message.

Of course people SHOULD attempt to look past that to the root meaning of the message which is ultimately what is important.

People's opinion of you (especially here) is formed based on how you write... So write well!

[dekeguy]

I have been watching this with a smile. For those of us who joyfully (or not) suffered through Latin at School or College, you will remember that Latin pronunciation is never a simple thing and its hard to say who is right or wrong unless it is for use of Latin in a very specific situation. There are several "right" pronounciations among which should be counted:
Ecclesiastical Latin (Church Latin)
Classical Latin
Medievil Latin
Oxford Latin
Legal Latin
All of these vary widely in their pronounciation and all can be viewed as correct within certain usages. Remember that in British schoolboy Latin (essentially classical Latin) Julius Caesar's great boast "I came, I saw, I conquered", "Veni, Vedi, Vici", is pronounced "weenie, weedie, weekie"!!! The great orator Cicero is classically pronounced 'Kee Ka Row"!
And who can forget in "De Bello Galico" (Carsar's Gallic Wars) that Publius Flavius, Preator of the XIIth. Legion, before joining battle bolted to his tent where he thrust his glaudius into a vagina! You will understand of course that this meant he put his sword into a scabbard so he could carry it into the fight.
For purposes of this thread, it seems to me that if we remember to use the masc. form for male alumni, and the fem. form for female alumnae it really doesn't matter too much which of the several "right" pronounciations we choose to use.
Perhaps the opening line of Cicero's Cataline Oration might be appropriate here, "Quo usque tandem, Cateline..." which can be translated as "Hay Cataline, how far do you want to push this?"

AVE ATQUE VALE!!!

[Tom Earp]

BOOOOO!

How do you expect me to respond!

I use Earpisms and Earpadotes and bad typing skills to profess my missives!

While some people including myself cannot totally understand my thougts, you too will get old and your mind may work but wont send the electrical impulses to the fingers!

I am a purist, give me a # 10 pencile and a Big Cheif Tablet, only way to fly!

"If wishes were chicken shit, I would have a Chicken Coop Full!"

[Tink16]

Awww Tom,

We understand what you say You're one of the best on the board

[MysticCat]

Originally posted by dekeguy (in part)
I have been watching this with a smile. For those of us who joyfully (or not) suffered through Latin at School or College, you will remember that Latin pronunciation is never a simple thing and its hard to say who is right or wrong unless it is for use of Latin in a very specific situation. There are several "right" pronounciations among which should be counted:
Ecclesiastical Latin (Church Latin)....

So true, and it gets even more complicated. pronunciation of Church Latin (and, I would suspect, other forms of Latin) varies from country to country. In English-speaking countries, Church Latin has a noticable Italian accent, while in Germany, some rules of German pronuncation apply. Go figure.

[DNTKE]

Teaching this should be done in each and every one of our chapters new member ed. programs. (learn it early cause you'll use it the rest of your life.)

No we don't have a the same rituals, but we do have this in common.

It could be titled "A lesson in keeping your foot out of your mouth."

The wrong use of these terms grates on me too.

[OnePlus69Is70]

Just do what I do- say graduate and graduates. I'll never understand why people insist on using Latin plurals in English- it's technically allowed, though my grammar book says it's not necessary (words like alumnuses are perfectly correct). Using a Latin 2nd declension nominative plural is about as silly as trying to use Old English in everyday language- eom ic rihte?

[EagleChick19]

In my chapter's NME, they do learn it! But, who knows if they remember it?!?

[Aquastar]

Uhmmm ... some people might not like to be labled by GENDER and may type in a male voice cause they WANT to ... ever think of that?

Just trying to start some shit and get you to think