GHB and chicks......bad combination

[AXJules]

I totally agree. If you need drugs to make your body do something, it's probably not something your body should be doing in the first place.

[James]

GHB was made to force you to sleep whether you want to sleep or not.

You kids are a little clue aren't you?

When I say that, I mean you tend to put what you think/feel/believe forward as facts or data and then ask others to draw conlusions from that.

That seems intellectually irresponsible.

GHB is basically an anasthetic. ITs designed to put you to sleep. So a normal dose will render you unconscious. Thats the way its supposed to be used.

While unconscious you may have something called clonic spasms where it looks like you are twitching, or having seizures. These are normal, dose dependant (which means their severity will depend on how much you take), and harmless.

Depending on how much you take (dose dependance again) you may be difficult to impossible to wake and may be completely disoriented, not remember your name, or relevant details until you reorient.

The disorientation is because GHB forces you into a stage 4 sleep. Very Deep sleep and you will normally be disoriented waking from one of those normally. Imagine not sleeping for two days and then haiving soeone try and wake you after two hours. ITs a similar model.

This is what GHb is supposed to do to you. so the vast majority of people taken to the hospital for a so-called overdose, just took the normal dose that puts you to sleep whether you want to go to sleep or not.

While in the hospital the Doctor's will do a lot of intervention work because they don't know whats wrong with you. Then usually after about an hour or so you will suddenly come awake and be oriented.

A very expensive rest.

Neat eh? So remember lesson 1. GHB is designed to put you to sleep whether you want to sleep or not.

[James]

GHB as a recreational drug.

Well here we have this neat little drug that puts you to sleep. And its been used for 20 or so years to treat insomniacs, narcoleptics and cataleptics (people with excessive daytime sleepiness).

In those populations, even though they have used the drug in large amounts for decades there have been no adverse effects. In fact the LD-50 (lethal dose) for GHB is so high that the Salt content would kill you before the actual GHB did.

Neat eh? So how did it become a recreational drug? after all its designed to put you to sleep or help you sleep right?

Well, if you take less than the sleep producing dose it makes you feel high. The effect is very similar to a clean alcohol feeling. I say clean because GHB metabolizes into water and carbon dioxide within four hours of entering your body. And then its gone.

Alcohol metabolizes into water and acetylaldehyde. Acetylaldehyde (think formaldehyde, embalming fluid) is 20 times more toxic than alcohol and take over an hour to pass every ounce out of your body.

10 ounces of alcohol and you are still processing it 13 hours later.

In fact GHB is so closely akin to the buzz from alcohol that it has been used as an alcohol substitute to take alcoholics off alcohol.

So there you go. You have a drug that makes you feel buzzed or drunk that has no calories, no hang over, and wears off much quicker than regular alcohol and most club drugs.

[damasa]

Originally posted by James
GHB was made to force you to sleep whether you want to sleep or not.

You kids are a little clue aren't you?

When I say that, I mean you tend to put what you think/feel/believe forward as facts or data and then ask others to draw conlusions from that.

That seems intellectually irresponsible.

GHB is basically an anasthetic. ITs designed to put you to sleep. So a normal dose will render you unconscious. Thats the way its supposed to be used.

While unconscious you may have something called clonic spasms where it looks like you are twitching, or having seizures. These are normal, dose dependant (which means their severity will depend on how much you take), and harmless.

Depending on how much you take (dose dependance again) you may be difficult to impossible to wake and may be completely disoriented, not remember your name, or relevant details until you reorient.

The disorientation is because GHB forces you into a stage 4 sleep. Very Deep sleep and you will normally be disoriented waking from one of those normally. Imagine not sleeping for two days and then haiving soeone try and wake you after two hours. ITs a similar model.

This is what GHb is supposed to do to you. so the vast majority of people taken to the hospital for a so-called overdose, just took the normal dose that puts you to sleep whether you want to go to sleep or not.

While in the hospital the Doctor's will do a lot of intervention work because they don't know whats wrong with you. Then usually after about an hour or so you will suddenly come awake and be oriented.

A very expensive rest.

Neat eh? So remember lesson 1. GHB is designed to put you to sleep whether you want to sleep or not.

Kids being a little clueless? I don't really understand your point of this post beside letting people on gc know that GHB is a drug "that makes you sleep whether you want to or not."

I don't see anyone having an argument about this? So I don't understand how you are saying people are putting their thoughts/beliefs out as actual facts. This is kind of a moot point. Mainly because of the difference between lab produced GHB (which is legal to produce) and street produced GHB - which most of the people in this thread are talking about.

In smaller doses you don't feel this "sleep factor." In fact people sometimes tend to get giddy and feel a little "upiddy" or whatnot. Perhaps the reason that it was also used as a body building agent to stimulate growth hormone release - which could also aid in fat reduction.

Another point - some countries are using GHB as a treatment drug for alcoholism because it has a tremendous ability to reduce alcohol withdrawal symptoms.

[James]

GHb adverse effects?

They are there. The biggest problem is that there is no forgiveness when it comes to dose.

Remember lesson 1. GHB is designed to put you to sleep. So if you take a little bit you feel good, if you take a little more you feel better, but if you take a little too much, you fall asleep.

If you are sitting down or lying down somewhere you are fine. Standing in a club you might very well fall over or start nodding off.

Mixing it with other central nervous system relaxants is another easy way to fall asleep. One plus one equals 2. Alcohol makes you tired and GHB makes you tired. Also, when you are out its normaly late and you are tired.

Fatigue will intensify the effects of alcohol or GHB or whatever.

Also, you don't know the strength of what you are taking. It generally mixed with something else so it could be one gram per ounce or four grams per ounce. And remember: it has very little dose forgiveness. If you take too much you are going to fall asleep.

[James]

I just said what you stated in my follow-up post.

Originally posted by damasa
Kids being a little clueless? I don't really understand your point of this post beside letting people on gc know that GHB is a drug "that makes you sleep whether you want to or not."

I don't see anyone having an argument about this? So I don't understand how you are saying people are putting their thoughts/beliefs out as actual facts. This is kind of a moot point. Mainly because of the difference between lab produced GHB (which is legal to produce) and street produced GHB - which most of the people in this thread are talking about.

In smaller doses you don't feel this "sleep factor." In fact people sometimes tend to get giddy and feel a little "upiddy" or whatnot. Perhaps the reason that it was also used as a body building agent to stimulate growth hormone release - which could also aid in fat reduction.

Another point - some countries are using GHB as a treatment drug for alcoholism because it has a tremendous ability to reduce alcohol withdrawal symptoms.

[damasa]

Originally posted by James


Also, you don't know the strength of what you are taking. It generally mixed with something else so it could be one gram per ounce or four grams per ounce. And remember: it has very little dose forgiveness. If you take too much you are going to fall asleep.

This is the single reasone why I don't understand how people can do the shit? They buy it on the street, they have NO IDEA how potent the stuff could be.....forget that.

[SSS1365]

James, are you trying to imply that GHB is NOT bad for you? I'm not trying to start an argument, I'm just a little confused.

[damasa]

Originally posted by James
I just said what you stated in my follow-up post.

True, but my I had other points to what I was trying to say. I was actually looking for information while I was posting and had no idea you posted a follow-up.

I don't think you have the right to call people clueless. Mainly because I don't see the debates surrounding this "sleep factor" that you made a point to highlight. Yes, your post was informative, but you gotta give people some credit as to what the know or not. I haven't read about anyone pushing their opinions or experiences off as data in this thread.

I don't know much about GHB, mainly because I don't use it and I haven't really cared about what ti does. It has a horrid reputation for being a "date rape" drug and that's all I need to know. It just sounds like a nasty drug.

[James]

Clueless seems harsh, but there is a lot of false information being posted, some mixed with truth and what can happen is that people will sense that false information is false and hurt themselves because they will ignore real risks.

Hence the comment about intellectual irresponsibility. Like some of Uf_pikes information is way off . . and could be harmful, or ignore the real harm.

Originally posted by damasa
True, but my I had other points to what I was trying to say. I was actually looking for information while I was posting and had no idea you posted a follow-up.

I don't think you have the right to call people clueless. Mainly because I don't see the debates surrounding this "sleep factor" that you made a point to highlight. Yes, your post was informative, but you gotta give people some credit as to what the know or not. I haven't read about anyone pushing their opinions or experiences off as data in this thread.

I don't know much about GHB, mainly because I don't use it and I haven't really cared about what ti does. It has a horrid reputation for being a "date rape" drug and that's all I need to know. It just sounds like a nasty drug.

[James]

GHB and its analogues are less harmful to you when put into your body than alcohol or even marijuana, but the results can be more extreme if you are out and about.

So for example: alcohol can push you into unconsciousness but it will take several drinks to do it. With GHB we might be talking about ounces or mililiters.

Originally posted by SSS1365
James, are you trying to imply that GHB is NOT bad for you? I'm not trying to start an argument, I'm just a little confused.

[ZTABullwinkle]

I am a little clueless about all of this talk about the whole GHB, what drugs we have tried, etc....

I am going to go out on a limb here and tell you guys something about myself.. First off I have been a Paramedic. I have seen what alcohol and drugs (ALL TYPES!!!) can do to you. People it isn't pretty!! I have seen when people just took one and haven't woken up. Their families were devastated. It was some of the saddest things I have had to deal with in my life. I hope that none of you ever, ever have to witness it. Let alone experience it personally.

As for GHB...I have had it put in my drink. I have woken up afterwards wondering what the hell a "friend"/neighbor did to me. It took me several hours to figure out what happened. Do you know how scarred you are when you finally realize why you wake up naked and bruised in your bed???? The last thing I can remember is taking a SIP of a Diet Coke and Captain Morgan's Rum. I know it was a sip, b/c I hate Diet Coke. Always have.

Before anyone asks, I didn't report it. I invited him in. I accepted the drink. I thought I was responsible. Yes, I saw him almost every day. We were neighbors. He finally moved. When I did see him again, he told me "boy we did have fun the last time we saw each other!"

So, again I ask, why are we discussing the GHB. The benefits, taking it, etc.....

Meredith

[librasoul22]

Originally posted by James
Clueless seems harsh, but there is a lot of false information being posted, some mixed with truth and what can happen is that people will sense that false information is false and hurt themselves because they will ignore real risks.

Hence the comment about intellectual irresponsibility. Like some of Uf_pikes information is way off . . and could be harmful, or ignore the real harm.

Maybe it would be helpful if people posted the sources from whence their info came. James, even though you are calling people clueless, who is to say that YOUR facts are indeed the accurate ones? Not saying they aren't, but it would behoove people to do their own research before believing anything they read on GC or anywhere else.

Anyway, it kinda goes without saying to take what UF_Pike posts with a grain of salt.

[AXJules]

A few things:

I don't know how you can label someone clueless without knowing where they're coming from. I don't really think I said that I was a Dr., just what I knew from my experiences. Sometimes, experiences are more of a lesson than anything you'll read in a book. Now, this goes both ways. I think people who roll once and go, "I was fine, I'll base my knowledge on that and tell everyone X is good" is ignorant. Really ignorant. I have observed this kind of drug usage since my sophomore year in high school and I'm sharing what I know. Pike corrected me in the types of GHB, and while James can say that GHB is pharmeceutically made to put you to sleep, most of us have been talking about the street kind which is pretty different. Either way, until someone comes on here who has written a book on drug users or has a degree in pharmecology, I'm going to pretty much weigh what everyone says equally.

2nd, Bulllwinkle asked why we're talking about taking it, its benefits, etc. I didn't think this was a forum on weighing the benefits of GHB, but rather UF_Pike wanting to warn people about the effects. I may or may not believe his entire story (agreeing w/librasoul, take it w/a grain of salt) but I posted what I knew in response. That's a discussion. This is a discussion board. If you're going to question why people are talking about it, why are we talking about Houlihans? Or hating members of the opposite sex. I would think out of all threads, this one has a little bit more importance.

[damasa]

Originally posted by AXJules
I would think out of all threads, this one has a little bit more importance.

A voice of reason.