Universities Under Investigation Re: Handling Sexual Assault

[SydneyK]

Ok. So I just went back and read all 16 pages. I should've done that before posting earlier. (I even read the entire Duke thread Kevin posted, just for fun.)

I don't think honorgal is a troll.

I don't think it's either fair or accurate to say that either the victim is lying or that the accused is lying. I agree with Low D Flat - it's possible that both parties remember the same event differently.

I don't think our colleges/universities should have to shoulder the responsibility of determining someone's innocence or guilt in regards to rape cases. Nor do I think it's appropriate to oust a student based on an accusation of rape.

Having a husband who has worked in college administration does not qualify someone as having a "front row" seat to the inner workings of administration. I've personally been a part of many university administrative meetings, and to think that that qualifies my husband as a knowledgeable commenter on such subjects is laughable.

Originally Posted by honorgal

And that's usually what happens when a solution is devised for a non-problem.

It may be a non-problem in your eyes, but to a college/university administration, it's helpful and comforting to have a solution/response to situations regarding student-safety concerns.

Dr. Phil, in an attempt to bring something new to the discussion, are you familiar with the University of Kentucky's green dot/VIP program?

http://www.uky.edu/StudentAffairs/VI...n_greendot.php

[honorgal]

Originally Posted by SydneyK

Ok. So I just went back and read all 16 pages. I should've done that before posting earlier. (I even read the entire Duke thread Kevin posted, just for fun.)

I don't think honorgal is a troll.

I don't think it's either fair or accurate to say that either the victim is lying or that the accused is lying. I agree with Low D Flat - it's possible that both parties remember the same event differently.

Absolutely agree.

Having a husband who has worked in college administration does not qualify someone as having a "front row" seat to the inner workings of administration.

I never made this claim. I was responding specifically to this from another poster:

I'm just trying to understand where you're coming from. When someone gets on a soapbox the way you have, they tend to provide some background for perspective

It may be a non-problem in your eyes, but to a college/university administration, it's helpful and comforting to have a solution/response to situations regarding student-safety concerns.

I find it hard to reconcile the above statement with your earlier one:

I don't think our colleges/universities should have to shoulder the responsibility of determining someone's innocence or guilt in regards to rape cases. Nor do I think it's appropriate to oust a student based on an accusation of rape.

Colleges are having to shoulder the responsibility, and they are ousting students based on nothing more than accusations.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by honorgal

I find it hard to reconcile the above statement with your earlier one:

One statement had to do with schools shouldering the responsibility for student safety, the other with schools shouldering the responsibility for determining guilt.

[squirrely girl]

Originally Posted by honorgal

Colleges are having to shoulder the responsibility, and they are ousting students based on nothing more than accusations.

Yeah... that's still not a real thing.

[honorgal]

Originally Posted by squirrely girl

Yeah... that's still not a real thing.

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/1...campus-rapists

[squirrely girl]

Originally Posted by honorgal

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/1...campus-rapists

The plural of anecdote is not data.

[exlurker]

Connecticut Data - College by College - Shows Variation in Increase / Decrease of Reports

The schools with larger increases, according to the article [below] are the U of Connecticut, Wesleyan, and Trinity.

Schools with declines include Connecticut College, Yale, and Eastern Connecticut State U.

The article contains some information on settlements -- for example, "UConn agreed to a $1.28 million settlement" of a case "in July."

http://www.courant.com/education/hc-...ry.html#page=2

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by SydneyK

I don't think it's either fair or accurate to say that either the victim is lying or that the accused is lying. I agree with Low D Flat - it's possible that both parties remember the same event differently.

That's fair, of course people don't remember events in exactly identical detail*. My point, however, is that when you have two different stories, I don't think that the default should be that the accused is giving the correct version of events and the alleged victim is not. While that makes sense in the official criminal justice system, I think universities should use a lower burden of proof (as does Title IX).

Obviously a lot of people disagree with me, and feel that universities should not expel someone unless they have proof beyond a reasonable doubt that a rape occurred. Many other university honor code violations are handled in this manner, and I see no reason that, when rape is on the table, we suddenly need to give more weight to what is said by the accused and/or need to suddenly go out of our way to try to discredit the victim.

*Also note that consent, or a lack thereof, is usually clear. Rapists know what they are doing as they do it.