"They all look alike": Understanding the "other race effect"

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

Prime example of what the study this thread is based on is talking about. YOU as a black person may notice hair texture, skin tone, etc as distinguishing characteristics. Since Asians tend to have the same hair texture and skin tone (with some variance - just as all white people aren't as pale as Lindsey Loho), they have other things they look for. I know eye shape is one. You look and see Asian eyes, they look and see upward slant, downward slant, size/openness. I did have three friends in college who were Asian, and while we didn't discuss race in regards to the question I posed, one was Japanese, one was Korean, and one was Malaysian and they had very different eyes...but to someone who didn't know, they would all be identifiable as Asian eyes.

Good point and to the average non Asian, eyes aren't something that we would tend to notice on first glance.

But I also would tend to think that anyone, not just someone of color would be able to see huge differences between people of African descent because, IMO it's much more noticable than mostly anything else.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

But I also would tend to think that anyone, not just someone of color would be able to see huge differences between people of African descent because, IMO it's much more noticable than mostly anything else.

In YOUR opinion...as "someone of color". See thread title.

My $0.02 as the white person here...I tend to identify caucasians by hair color. I think other whites do as well. Example: When I started dying my hair red, people in my church started mistaking me for another redhead in our church. Even people who had known us for years couldn't tell us apart from behind, and she's got a good 4 inches on me.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

My $0.02 as the white person here...I tend to identify caucasians by hair color.

I do too, at least at first. That said, I think I do identify by differences in skin tone as well.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

In YOUR opinion...as "someone of color". See thread title.

My $0.02 as the white person here...I tend to identify caucasians by hair color. I think other whites do as well. Example: When I started dying my hair red, people in my church started mistaking me for another redhead in our church. Even people who had known us for years couldn't tell us apart from behind, and she's got a good 4 inches on me.

I see your point but almost anyone could make that mistake even with the height difference, but what does that say when confronted by a group of 2 or more individuals being viewed from the front?

This is the same kind of thing that is considered with criminal cases that comes to a question of getting a reliable witness description of a suspect.

Racist tendancies aside, when people go to describe a suspect of color, one who is Asian or hispanic, how accurate is their description if they don't know the difference of features that sets us apart?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by rhoyaltempest

Some won't like me saying this but I think (at least in America), many Whites just don't take the time to see the differences in Black folks and I think it's a historical thing that goes back to racial discrimination in this country and just not caring to see anything but Black (not that most Whites today are conscious of this). I have been among the only few Blacks in many situations over the years (including currently at my place of work). I have seen 2 totally different Black people (different hair texture, facial features, complexions, etc.) be mistaken for one another.

Yes and that's what I was alluding to when I concluded my post with dominant-minority relations. That's also not what this research or this thread (based on people's posts) are about.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

Prime example of what the study this thread is based on is talking about.

That actually isn't what the study and this thread are talking about. What she and I are talking about isn't just "they all look alike/look similar." Instead it is a dominant group ideology and it doesn't boil down to what that NEW and unreplicated study by psychologist researchers found.

I have been the only Black person or one of few Black people in settings all of my life and I have been called by someone else's name--someone who looks absolutely NOTHING like me to the point of having a different complexion and different body shape and everything--all of my life. I have had white people say "you look like this actress" not because I look anything like the actress and white folks can't tell the difference when it comes to nonwhites but because that actress is THE Black woman that those white people can think of/have seen. Even sharing a complexion or a hairstyle is different than looking like someone. That is what "othering" really means.

The most recent time that I was mistaken for another Black woman was by a colleague a month ago and he later apologized profusely because he knew what was embedded in that mistake. I just laughed it off with him and said "I have a difficult time remembering people, too" but I know that my difficult time remembering names and faces spans across race and ethnicity. I don't remember Black folks, white folks, etc. He just called me "the other Black woman's name" because he was used to there being only ONE Black woman in his colleague circle. Since I replaced that ONE Black woman on that particular day and he wanted to introduce HER to his wife, I became HER in his mind.

As for my mistaking white folks, I used to do that to two men all the time because most of the people in my nonfamilial settings were whites. I mistaked my teachers in college and they were different heights but had the same hairstyles, same voices, and style of dress. Years later, they don't look as much alike but I have a difficult time remembering faces, in general. It used to be funny when I walked up to one person talking about something that I should be talking about with the other person and the one person would always say "uh...I'm not Paul." Embarassing yet doesn't hold the same potential weight and outcomes as when coming from the majority in power.

[rhoyaltempest]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

Good point and to the average non Asian, eyes aren't something that we would tend to notice on first glance.

But I also would tend to think that anyone, not just someone of color would be able to see huge differences between people of African descent because, IMO it's much more noticable than mostly anything else.

Exactly...huge differences vs. subtle differences. I stand behind what I stated and those that can't see it either don't choose to see it or won't allow themselves to see it, which is fine.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by rhoyaltempest

I stand behind what I stated and those that can't see it either don't choose to see it or won't allow themselves to see it, which is fine.

This has been researched and discussed for generations. I am actually quite nonsurprised by what people seem to have taken from the conclusions of the study that prompted this thread.

[rhoyaltempest]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

That actually isn't what the study and this thread are talking about. What she and I are talking about isn't just "they all look alike/look similar." Instead it is a dominant group ideology and it doesn't boil down to what that NEW and unreplicated study by psychologist researchers found.

I have been the only Black person or one of few Black people in settings all of my life and I have been called by someone else's name--someone who looks absolutely NOTHING like me to the point of having a different complexion and different body shape and everything--all of my life. I have had white people say "you look like this actress" not because I look anything like the actress and white folks can't tell the difference when it comes to nonwhites but because that actress is THE Black woman that those white people can think of/have seen. Even sharing a complexion or a hairstyle is different than looking like someone. That is what "othering" really means.

The most recent time that I was mistaken for another Black woman was by a colleague a month ago and he later apologized profusely because he knew what was embedded in that mistake. I just laughed it off with him and said "I have a difficult time remembering people, too" but I know that my difficult time remembering names and faces spans across race and ethnicity. I don't remember Black folks, white folks, etc. He just called me "the other Black woman's name" because he was used to there being only ONE Black woman in his colleague circle. Since I replaced that ONE Black woman on that particular day and he wanted to introduce HER to his wife, I became HER in his mind.

As for my mistaking white folks, I used to do that to two men all the time because most of the people in my nonfamilial settings were whites. I mistaked my teachers in college and they were different heights but had the same hairstyles, same voices, and style of dress. Years later, they don't look as much alike but I have a difficult time remembering faces, in general. It used to be funny when I walked up to one person talking about something that I should be talking about with the other person and the one person would always say "uh...I'm not Paul." Embarassing yet doesn't hold the same potential weight and outcomes as when coming from the majority in power.

I have done this too but with white folks that have similar features (slender long nose and thin lips for example), not when one person has a slender long nose and the other has a wide bigger nose and thin lips vs. full lips. That's because I REALLY LOOK at people to distinguish between them.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by rhoyaltempest

I have done this too but with white folks that have similar features (slender long nose and thin lips for example), not when one person has a slender long nose and the other has a wide bigger nose and thin lips vs. full lips. That's because I REALLY LOOK at people to distinguish between them.

Yeah well most people aren't that observant and that lack of observation does not operate the same for every group of people.

But what's really important is that this topic isn't so much about distinguishing Chinese vs. Japanese (that was a great martial arts movie) because that requires a general knowledge of the physical differences between ethnicities and cultures that the average person across societies does not have. DUH. Instead, it's about being able to distinguish diasporas of people and knowing that THIS Chinese person is not the same person as THAT Chinese person (or THAT Japanese person if people want to go inter-ethnically).

[Drolefille]

I think it comes down to exposure in one's every day life. My clients are predominantly black male (which is a whole nother topic) and after having had them in my groups once I don't tend to forget their names or mix them up. But it took me having interactions with them where I was using their names and identifying them by sight as "Mr. ______." Except for brand new clients (or ones who never show up) I only have 2 guys whose names I confuse and it's because they're both tall, thin, have names that start with the same letter and similarly shaped faces. But they don't look alike, my brain just fumbles with the right name for the unique face.

But with another population entirely I don't know that I'd do as "well" without more exposure.

[knight_shadow]

I don't think I've ever tried to guess someone's ethnicity/race. If the topic comes up, I will generally ask the person what his/her background is.

Ex. Instead of "You're Mexican, right?" I'll ask "What is your background?" or something. Easy fix.

[AOII Angel]

I don't think Asians can tell as well as they say they can. I went to Tokyo last year for my birthday with my husband and my good friend, Sarah, who is Vietnamese and was adopted at birth by a white couple. She was mistaken for Japansese everywhere we went in Tokyo. Many times, waitresses would try to speak Japanese to her and get mad when she didn't understand them, then look at me like I could explain why she didn't know Japanese. I think they thought she was out Japanese tour guide. Sarah was also baffled that everyone kept handing her flyers and coupons as we passed stores but never handed them to my husband and I. The flyers were in Japanese, not Vietnamese, so they would only benefit her if the people thought she was Japanese.

[PiKA2001]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

I don't think Asians can tell as well as they say they can. I went to Tokyo last year for my birthday with my husband and my good friend, Sarah, who is Vietnamese and was adopted at birth by a white couple. She was mistaken for Japansese everywhere we went in Tokyo. Many times, waitresses would try to speak Japanese to her and get mad when she didn't understand them, then look at me like I could explain why she didn't know Japanese. I think they thought she was out Japanese tour guide. Sarah was also baffled that everyone kept handing her flyers and coupons as we passed stores but never handed them to my husband and I. The flyers were in Japanese, not Vietnamese, so they would only benefit her if the people thought she was Japanese.

Maybe she was mistaken for being a resident of Japan, not necessarily of Japanese heritage. It's my understanding (I've never been there) that because of Japans economic clout they attract a lot of immigrants from other Asian countries.

[carnation]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

I don't think Asians can tell as well as they say they can. I went to Tokyo last year for my birthday with my husband and my good friend, Sarah, who is Vietnamese and was adopted at birth by a white couple. She was mistaken for Japansese everywhere we went in Tokyo. Many times, waitresses would try to speak Japanese to her and get mad when she didn't understand them, then look at me like I could explain why she didn't know Japanese. I think they thought she was out Japanese tour guide.

Haha, you should see the shock on the faces of Japanese people when they realize that BlazerCheer and SweetTea not only don't speak Japanese but that since they came as infants, they have deep Southern accents. They want to know why we didn't find them tutors--yeah right, where? The weird thing is that Filipino and Vietnamese people have never asked us why our daughters from those countries don't speak their native languages...they have, however, been able to ID them right off as Filipina and Vietnamese.