2010 Midterm Elections Thread

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by AGDee

You do realize that $9 an hour is poverty level for most families, don't you?

A family does not make 9$ an hour.

A person does.

You do realize that a person cannot live on $9/hr?

On the contrary,
9$ is 360 dollars a week. 18, 720 a year. The per capita income in my town is 15,000, the median income for males is 28k, and the median income for women is 21 k. So I guess roughly 40% of females "can't live".

Plenty do live on that amount of cash. Now if the government would remove themselves from our wallet, 18,720 would be a fairly easy existence. Unfortunately it does not do this.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

18,720 would be a fairly easy existence.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

A family does not make 9$ an hour.

A person does.

On the contrary,
9$ is 360 dollars a week. 18, 720 a year. The per capita income in my town is 15,000, the median income for males is 28k, and the median income for women is 21 k. So I guess roughly 40% of females "can't live".

Plenty do live on that amount of cash. Now if the government would remove themselves from our wallet, 18,720 would be a fairly easy existence. Unfortunately it does not do this.

Show me your budget for yourself and two kids for $18,720. Please include rent, utilities, transportation, day care, food, health expenses, clothing and school supplies.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Show me your budget for yourself and two kids for $18,720. Please include rent, utilities, transportation, day care, food, health expenses, clothing and school supplies.

Add savings, insurance, phone/tv/internet service, and other incidentals.

[starang21]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

LMAO, right. same look i gave.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

Without kids, sure. You did leave out the part about taxes..which makes it harder. (that includes food taxes, building taxes, etc)

I lived on less an hour myself. Not too difficult. My parents don't coddle. My friends had no help either living on their own. Shoot, the people next door to me right now live on less and are doing fine.

Originally Posted by AGDee

Show me your budget for yourself and two kids for $18,720. Please include rent, utilities, transportation, day care, food, health expenses, clothing and school supplies.

Wait, you're talking about someone who made poor decisions (that being having kids while making minimum wage). If you make poor decisions, then I'm not sure I feel sorry that you're making 18,720 while making aforementioned poor decisions. Even if you have a high paying job and then was fired, while having two kids you took a calculated risk/gamble and failed. Still don't feel sorry.

Originally Posted by VandalSquirrel

I can't remember my last raise, my health insurance is FUBAR starting January 1,

I wonder why.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

Wait, you're talking about someone who made poor decisions (that being having kids while making minimum wage). If you make poor decisions, then I'm not sure I feel sorry that you're making 18,720 while making aforementioned poor decisions. Even if you have a high paying job and then was fired, while having two kids you took a calculated risk/gamble and failed. Still don't feel sorry.


I wonder why.

And you're an asshole. Thanks for calling, bye.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

And you're an asshole. Thanks for calling, bye.

How am I an "asshole" for expecting responsibility?

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

How am I an "asshole" for expecting responsibility?

While I wouldn't call you that personally, I would say that you are completely out of touch with reality if you think that everybody who faces a life challenge does so because they are irresponsible. I would also say that you are heartless, incapable of empathy or compassion. People like you scare me because you're one step away from wanting to just put people to death because they have had a life challenge that devastated them financially. It happens to people in all walks of life. It happens to those born with a silver spoon in their mouth, to those who are well educated, to those who have worked and made a good income for longer than you've been alive, to those who bust their butts to contribute to our society, and to those who have never done anything irresponsible in their lives. It happens. It is life. As humans, we have a moral obligation to take care of each other for the betterment of society as a whole. People like you scare me because I think that, without compassion, evil prevails.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by AGDee

While I wouldn't call you that personally, I would say that you are completely out of touch with reality if you think that everybody who faces a life challenge does so because they are irresponsible. I would also say that you are heartless, incapable of empathy or compassion. People like you scare me because you're one step away from wanting to just put people to death because they have had a life challenge that devastated them financially. It happens to people in all walks of life. It happens to those born with a silver spoon in their mouth, to those who are well educated, to those who have worked and made a good income for longer than you've been alive, to those who bust their butts to contribute to our society, and to those who have never done anything irresponsible in their lives. It happens. It is life. As humans, we have a moral obligation to take care of each other for the betterment of society as a whole. People like you scare me because I think that, without compassion, evil prevails.

Woah woah woah...

Where did I say anything about compassion? I am very compassionate. I give heavily to several charities as well as volunteer often.

I care for the poor, which is where my economic ideologies come from. Unabated capitalism empowers and enriches the poor's life, giving them the greatest mobility possible and the best life possible. My economic considerations are far more beneficial to the poor than a statists.

[VandalSquirrel]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

Without kids, sure. You did leave out the part about taxes..which makes it harder. (that includes food taxes, building taxes, etc)

I lived on less an hour myself. Not too difficult. My parents don't coddle. My friends had no help either living on their own. Shoot, the people next door to me right now live on less and are doing fine.


Wait, you're talking about someone who made poor decisions (that being having kids while making minimum wage). If you make poor decisions, then I'm not sure I feel sorry that you're making 18,720 while making aforementioned poor decisions. Even if you have a high paying job and then was fired, while having two kids you took a calculated risk/gamble and failed. Still don't feel sorry.


I wonder why.

I don't think you know why, so let me tell you. We have changed the types and numbers of plans offered in the past few years, with a huge push to a high deductible HSA plan and two PPO plans in the last offering. There was a lot of propaganda to put people on the high deductible plan and a lot of people didn't do their own research for their own health costs and ran with the numbers HR provided. I was on a plan I paid more for, but I used it and enjoyed my lower deductible and being covered at 90% with a $15 copay. So many people were blinded by paying less without realizing the true cost that my plan had less people and has been discontinued. The same midrange plan with twice the deductible, 80% coverage, and a $25 copay is still the being offered, and the only other option other than the high deductible, so those are my choices. Single people have never had a financial advantage on the high deductible plan, and most families lost out too if one person had a lot of care as the deductible was for the family and couldn't be met by one individual.

I did the math for what it cost me per pay check and what I would have to pay out of pocket for each plan and in one case it was obvious to go with the most expensive plan, and the other it was making an active choice that I rather would pay more for insurance and be covered than have some situation that would have cost more later. Insurance is something you buy and hope you don't have to use and often don't use in the case of my auto and home policies, but without fail I've had some medical issue that would have hurt me financially if I chose to pay $50 or so less a month. That $600 savings on the difference between 80% and 90% coverage, the $175 with the deductible being lower, and the $10 for every office visit ended up not being an issue and I made the right choice. I say it is FUBAR because I am going to potentially have less savings if something comes up, and the amount saved a month isn't going to cover it. The one thing that is nice is that adults now have orthodontia care, as I was really irritated I was paying the same amount to cover someone's kids and not allowed that same benefit. It was the one area where people paid the same and were not getting the same benefit and many people had issues with it and it finally changed. My teeth are visually straight but are slightly out of alignment jaw wise and with my sinus and allergy issues it causes a lot of pain so I'd like to get it fixed. I never had work done as a kid but I'm wisdom tooth free so there's some space to work with.

I wish people wouldn't have kids without planning and realizing everything that comes with being a parent, but unfortunately that isn't going to change because people are dumb.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

A family does not make 9$ an hour.

A person does.

On the contrary,
9$ is 360 dollars a week. 18, 720 a year. The per capita income in my town is 15,000, the median income for males is 28k, and the median income for women is 21 k. So I guess roughly 40% of females "can't live".

Plenty do live on that amount of cash. Now if the government would remove themselves from our wallet, 18,720 would be a fairly easy existence. Unfortunately it does not do this.

If the per capita income is $15K and the medians for males and females are higher than that then it stands to reason that you're including kids in there somewhere. And yes, I'd wager a guess that 40% of the females are the second income in two income families and would have a hard time making it without the other income.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by AGDee

If the per capita income is $15K and the medians for males and females are higher than that then it stands to reason that you're including kids in there somewhere. And yes, I'd wager a guess that 40% of the females are the second income in two income families and would have a hard time making it without the other income.

And don't forget that once both of you work the kids need day care. My aunt - an RN - went back and forth about working while her kids were young because she wanted to get out of the house, but 100% of her paycheck went to daycare. It just wasn't worth it.