Obama orders end to the practice of denying same-sex partners hospital visits

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

I'm failing to see how this is a dictatorship in the making.

Me either.

Originally Posted by Kevin

I'm pretty sure Hitler made a similar decree at some point.

Godwin's Law!!!!

I kid.

Originally Posted by Kevin

Is this really a problem?

I don't know. I've had some understanding that lots of hospitals have a "relatives only rule," at least in some cases. That would exclude partners in states that don't recognize gay marriage, which is, of course, the vast majority of states. I'd be interested in whether AOIIAngel and some of the other medical prople around here see it as addressing a real problem or just as window-dressing, or some of both.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

I've never heard of the hospital preventing someone from seeing his/her same sex partner. Usually it's a next-of-kin, like a homophobic parent or jealous child from a previous heterosexual relationship, who's raising hell.

Gotcha. Yeah, I can definitely imagine that.

[Alumiyum]

I HAVE heard of partners being denied access to their loved one in the hospital. It IS important that partners are able to make medical decisions and have access to each other in the hospital just like a heterosexual couple. I know of a gay man that was denied access to his partner in the hospital when he was dangerously ill because the patient's parents did not agree with their relationship and took over...and of course the law was on their side, so had the patient died, his partner wouldn't have even been able to say goodbye.

However...can the president just do that?

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

However...can the president just do that?

The president has, as I understand it, directed the Department of Health and Human Services, which is the executive agency that administers Medicare and Medicaid, to promulgate regulations concerning same-sex couples and visitation issues. Though I haven't looked at the relevant statutes, I have little doubt that Congress has given DHHS fairly broad rule-making authority.

So, the DHHS can do it. And since DHHS is an executive agency under the president and the Secretary of which serves at his pleasure, the president can direct DHHS to do that. Other than the headline-grabbing subject matter of this particular rule, there's really nothing out of the ordinary about it.

[DaemonSeid]

Is water still wet today?

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

I've never heard of the hospital preventing someone from seeing his/her same sex partner. Usually it's a next-of-kin, like a homophobic parent or jealous child from a previous heterosexual relationship, who's raising hell.

Yep.

My mom told me a sad story about a gay patient of hers (she's a nurse) who was being taken off of a ventilator after being declared braindead following a serious motorcycle accident.

He had been with his partner for 15 years (no civil unions here and Partner was all the family he had living in the area. Partner visited him everyday for a week. However, he was not Patient's legal next-of-kin. He never made Partner his NOK because he didn't want to open up the convo and upset his parents (and of course no one ever thinks they'll end up in a coma).

Well, Patient's PARENTS finally get into town to see their son and make decisions regarding taking him off of life support. They made that decision, and not only did not tell Partner they were planning to do that (they didn't have to, but still, how awful to go up for a visit and find out that way) but told the hospital that Partner was not allowed in Patient's room as he was dying.

[Elephant Walk]

While, I'm glad that it got rid of...him "ordering" it seems to be rather dictatorial. It's the means that matter, the end is not always as important.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

While, I'm glad that it got rid of...him "ordering" it seems to be rather dictatorial. It's the means that matter, the end is not always as important.

Where is "ordering" coming from? The actual memo "requests" that DHHS take three specific "steps."

He's done nothing more than exercise the authority every president has had for a long time. And if Congress thinks he overstepped his authority, they can always negate what he's done.

[XODUS1914]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Regardless of how I feel about denying same-sex partners hospital visits, especially since we're talking about gov't funded programs, I must say this:

Obama's turning out to be a dictator whose legacy will not be what people assumed that it would be. He's simply not as great as people thought he was. He was simply better than what many considered to be the alternative (Obama vs. "dem people").

Some of the biggest dictators and exploitative leaders of the world have been great orators who were able to draw crowds and distract people with their speech.

FAIL.

I'l roll with your bottom line on this one. Although, I'm not a supporter if same-sex marriages, I do believe that gay partners need to be afforded some basic human rights, such as visitation.
That being said, forcing hospitals to extend visitation to non-family members is a slippery slope to start off with, and this method of implementation is even worse.....

[ASTalumna06]

Question... is this more of a gay marriage issue than anything else?

Are the "partners" who are being denied access joined by civil union in states where such a thing is allowed? Or have these partners decided, with their significant other, to simply spend their lives together?

If a hospital has a "not family? No visit" policy, then they're just following policy. I'm not saying I agree with it, but it is what it is.


And aside from all of that... Aren't there more important things to worry about? I haven't heard of this being a major problem, but this is what we're focusing on? I feel that in some cases, Obama is reaching for small "victories" to overshadow big mistakes.

[VandalSquirrel]

This should also be a reminder to people, regardless of the individual genders of a couple, or legal marriage status: have legal documents for what you want for your life if you are unable to make your own choices. Even if you're single this is a good idea, and there are often clinics and workshops done by volunteer members of the bar while supervising law students. This can also be beneficial to family and friends as trying to make important decisions during an emotional time can lead to disaster.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by XODUS1914

forcing hospitals to extend visitation to non-family members is a slippery slope to start off with, and this method of implementation is even worse.....

Yeah. Next we'll be allowing the family dog into the patients' rooms... then horses, then pigs and rattlesnakes.

I totally see your slippery slope thing.

[DGTess]

Mind you, I'm all for all the visitors the patient wants. Last time I was hospitalized, I told the staff "NO visitors but my spouse and son" and told them no more than 1/2 hour each day -- but that's me. When I'm sick I don't want to see anyone.

The point, though, is this is NOT a federal government issue. Medicaid and Medicare don't pay for visitors, so that argument is specious.

Nor do I think it's a big issue. It's just another "in your face" desire.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

He's dictating on the side I believe in....

That's always how it begins.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

I've never heard of the hospital preventing someone from seeing his/her same sex partner. Usually it's a next-of-kin, like a homophobic parent or jealous child from a previous heterosexual relationship, who's raising hell.

Oh it certainly has happened and was very common early in the gay rights movement and in the early days of the AIDS epidemic. I'm very good friends with a gay couple (actually following them to Arizona.) One of them is a psychologist who specializes in couples therapy. He sees mostly gay couples but has been practicing in NYC since the 60s. He has told me so many sad stories of couples who couldn't visit their partners as they died in hospitals from complications of AIDS. They also couldn't inherit and often lost their homes after the death of their loved ones.

I do wonder what hospitals are still doing this, but there are still many catholic hospitals out there and other religious institution associated hospitals, as well as hospitals in very conservatives areas that may be refusing to let people visit their partners in the hospital. Just because we don't know about cases doesn't mean it still doesn't occur.