White men in NPHC

[poeticace]

Originally Posted by Reds6

I'm just a little confused with this statement. Are you saying you were told by D9 Sororities that you wouldn't be accepted because you were multi-racial? I wanted to ask if that was your experience before I called this statement ridiculous. Do you think we have a bias against those of mixed-heritage that most likely would be identified as a person of color? While I wouldn't vote for a white member (my opinion), I just don't see being of mixed-heritage an issue. May I ask how you self-identify? And please know that when they come with the rope for us they coming for your azz too.

Not to put words into my Soror's mouth, but I'm going to explain one of her statements from my personal end... I too am mixed (although in appearance, I'm white) - with Czech, Norwegian, English, Black, Cherokee, and Spanish. When I was seeking out orgs, I headed to the multicultural ones simply because a) by appearance ALONE I would not be "black" or "Latina" enough to join D9 or Latina orgs b) I wasn't considered "white" enough (in actions) to be a part of a historically white org. I was never rejected or any such sort from any other org, so I don't think she's saying that the D9 organizations reject people who are mixed, I think she's saying she didn't feel comfortable enough to be in an org who is historically black. That does not mean that they wouldn't have accepted her, it's just a personal decision...

Soror, please correct me if I'm wrong, this is just my interpretation of what you were trying to say

[RedefinedDiva]

Originally Posted by poeticace

When I was seeking out orgs, I headed to the multicultural ones simply because a) by appearance ALONE I would not be "black" or "Latina" enough to join D9 or Latina orgs

What the hell is "Black" enough? Do you think we all come in one shade? Are we supposed to have a color quota when it comes down to "Blackness"?

It's ridiculous statements like that which makes ME happy that people who have twisted thoughts like that didn't bother to seek membership into my sorority. While I can ONLY speak for Alpha Kappa Alpha (though I'm sure my sistergreeks would agree), we accept young women from ALL shades of the rainbow. We have Sorors that have deep chocolate skin all the way to the palest white. In fact, one of my very good Sorors is white. We have Sorors from all nationalities, cultures, and backgrounds.

For people to use the scapegoat that they were not "____________" enough to join a particular sorority just goes to show that you were never really interested, nor did you do any research. Membership in an NPHC sorority doesn't automatically grant you force you into an NAACP membership, nor would you have to stage a sit-in at the local lunch counter.

I wonder what year this is sometimes....

[Reds6]

Originally Posted by poeticace

Not to put words into my Soror's mouth, but I'm going to explain one of her statements from my personal end... I too am mixed (although in appearance, I'm white) - with Czech, Norwegian, English, Black, Cherokee, and Spanish. When I was seeking out orgs, I headed to the multicultural ones simply because a) by appearance ALONE I would not be "black" or "Latina" enough to join D9 or Latina orgs b) I wasn't considered "white" enough (in actions) to be a part of a historically white org. I was never rejected or any such sort from any other org, so I don't think she's saying that the D9 organizations reject people who are mixed, I think she's saying she didn't feel comfortable enough to be in an org who is historically black. That does not mean that they wouldn't have accepted her, it's just a personal decision...

Soror, please correct me if I'm wrong, this is just my interpretation of what you were trying to say

Ok you and your Soror sound mis-informed. Do you realize how many of us can go down our family line and say we have this and that in regards to different heritages in our blood line. When I hear someone say they aren't this or that enough I think they aren't comfortable with themselves and who they are.
Oh BTW, they coming for your azz too.

[Little32]

Also, from what I have read, Ethel Hedgeman had some Native American ancestry.

The assertion that one has to meet some sort of "blackness" standard to pursue our organization is ridiculous. I agree that such a claim just demonstrates a lack of serious research.

[delph998]

Good luck to you, OldBlue!

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Little32

Also, from what I have read, Ethel Hedgeman had some Native American ancestry.

The assertion that one has to meet some sort of "blackness" standard to pursue our organization is ridiculous. I agree that such a claim just demonstrates a lack of serious research.

Please understand that I'm not contradicting you about your, or any other organization as a whole here but in this thread as in others there have been multiple members who stated they would not vote for a white person, usually followed with "that's just what I think" or something similar. I've seen it repeatedly. It isn't hard at all to get the impression that there's a caveat to all the remarks of openness.

I'm not surprised that on some campuses interests might not feel like they're "black enough" and would be discriminated because of it, just as there are assumptions of racism in NPC orgs where they don't exist.

[Jody]

Drolefille,

If you don't think that one of your Sorority Members won't vote for someone "just because" they are white, black, Asian, Latina, from the South, from the North, a naturalized citizen, or whatever, you're either very young or very naive.

When I was in college, I may have not voted for young ladies that had a particular major, if I indicated what that major was and young ladies knew, if they were stupid enough to switch majors for my ONE VOTE they didn't deserve to be Sorors anyway.

So what is three or four or even twenty D9 Sorors on a MESSAGE BOARD said they wouldn't vote for a white girl. If you use that as a limitus test to determine that you would have issues in a D9 Sorority then again, you're either very young or very naive. I say that as a young lady who pledged a D9 Sorority at an HBCU in the South and is the OPPOSITE physical look or what AKA's are supposed to be (tall, light skin and long hair) I'm short, dark skin and short hair...and beautiful I might add.....

[RedefinedDiva]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Please understand that I'm not contradicting you about your, or any other organization as a whole here but in this thread as in others there have been multiple members who stated they would not vote for a white person, usually followed with "that's just what I think" or something similar. I've seen it repeatedly. It isn't hard at all to get the impression that there's a caveat to all the remarks of openness.

I'm not surprised that on some campuses interests might not feel like they're "black enough" and would be discriminated because of it, just as there are assumptions of racism in NPC orgs where they don't exist.

Ok, serious question here. Is EVERY member of your org. a member of GC? I'm guessing no. Well, every member of Alpha Kappa Alpha is not a member of GC. Considering that there are over 200,000 members of my Sorority across the WORLD, the small number of us that are actually regular posters on GC make up less than 1% of our total membership. Therefore, if folks are to take what that .08% of persons say to be the LAW as it pertains to the entire Sorority, then they have a problem with reality.

No one will know until they try. If you don't try, well, you never really wanted it anyway. All that "not Black enough" talk is a bunch of bullisht. All we can do is encourage folks to try.

ETA: Soror Jody and I must have been typing at the same time!

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by RedefinedDiva

Ok, serious question here. Is EVERY member of your org. a member of GC? I'm guessing no. Well, every member of Alpha Kappa Alpha is not a member of GC. Considering that there are over 200,000 members of my Sorority across the WORLD, the small number of us that are actually regular posters on GC make up less than 1% of our total membership. Therefore, if folks are to take what that .08% of persons say to be the LAW as it pertains to the entire Sorority, then they have a problem with reality.

No one will know until they try. If you don't try, well, you never really wanted it anyway. All that "not Black enough" talk is a bunch of bullisht. All we can do is encourage folks to try.

ETA: Soror Jody and I must have been typing at the same time!

I do understand that, that's why I said I wasn't talking about any organization as a whole. My point was that, despite the bullshit that is "So-and-so can't join XYZ because they're *race*, there are campuses on which that is the feeling given off or where, indeed, there is racism present in the membership process despite the feelings of our organizations as a whole.

I was mostly responding to what I saw as a criticism of an individual who felt ostracized by both NPC and NPHC organizations, whether her mixed race would have actually affected her chances. I suspect she never rushed nor went to interest meetings. However, I don't see that as a reason to criticize her for what she felt or experienced. Does that make sense? Her comments about membership in an NPC org are equally disheartening, but I won't turn around and criticize her how she says she was treated by people on campus, because that was how she was treated.

Also, though seperate from the poster's comments, and more relevant to the overall thread, despite a message board only being a small subsection of the population, even one member saying so can give the impression of an atmosphere of non-acceptance and doubt. Because if one member on a message board says it, expand that to the real world, and that's a significant number. And what are college freshmen but young and naive?

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

I was mostly responding to what I saw as a criticism of an individual who felt ostracized by both NPC and NPHC organizations, whether her mixed race would have actually affected her chances. I suspect she never rushed nor went to interest meetings. However, I don't see that as a reason to criticize her for what she felt or experienced. Does that make sense? Her comments about membership in an NPC org are equally disheartening, but I won't turn around and criticize her how she says she was treated by people on campus, because that was how she was treated.

She didn't say that she was treated poorly by anyone and she revealed herself when she stated that she had only "heard and read" about issues in Latina sororities but still based an opinion on the rumors. What she did was project her own insecurities onto the sororities on her campus which is very different from indicating that she didn't join an organization because it didn't focus on her area of interest.

Unfortunately, there's a lot of mainstream Greek bashing among multicultural sororities because the members are often misguided as to the real purpose of their orgs. Or, in some cases, the founders themselves perpetuate stereotypes of other orgs to give their members ammo against questions about why they joined because they are unsure and insecure themselves - particularly when the organization was founded out of an isolated bad experience with a mainstream org.

[Reds6]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Please understand that I'm not contradicting you about your, or any other organization as a whole here but in this thread as in others there have been multiple members who stated they would not vote for a white person, usually followed with "that's just what I think" or something similar. I've seen it repeatedly. It isn't hard at all to get the impression that there's a caveat to all the remarks of openness.

I'm not surprised that on some campuses interests might not feel like they're "black enough" and would be discriminated because of it, just as there are assumptions of racism in NPC orgs where they don't exist.

Oh, I've said it before and I'll say it again I personally wouldn't vote for a white person. I just don't think a white woman can identify with the historical or present day experience that I have or had as a Black woman. But with that said if I met a white Soror I would treat her with respect. I also support people's decision to pursue what is in their hearts regarding anything thing in life. But also as Little32, "stated in her post Most black people (most people really--quiet as it’s kept) are multicultural, multiracial, or multiethnic (whatever term you choose) in some way; so the suggestion that a mixed race heritage would be a hindrance to membership in one of the D9 is really problematic and needs to be addressed." If some of mixed-race/heritage thinks a multicultural organization best fits them, that's great! But to be a person of color and make statements of "not black, Hispanic, or white enough," tells me you aren't comfortable with yourself.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Reds6

Oh, I've said it before and I'll say it again I personally wouldn't vote for a white person. I just don't think a white woman can identify with the historical or present day experience that I have or had as a Black woman. But with that said if I met a white Soror I would treat her with respect. I also support people's decision to pursue what is in their hearts regarding anything thing in life. But also as Little32, "stated in her post Most black people (most people really--quiet as it’s kept) are multicultural, multiracial, or multiethnic (whatever term you choose) in some way; so the suggestion that a mixed race heritage would be a hindrance to membership in one of the D9 is really problematic and needs to be addressed." If some of mixed-race/heritage thinks a multicultural organization best fits them, that's great! But to be a person of color and make statements of "not black, Hispanic, or white enough," tells me you aren't comfortable with yourself.

Oh I completely agree that she isn't comfortable with herself, it was the "I'm Glad someone so screwed up isn't in my sorority" comments that made me post. I'd rather see all of our organizations working towards lifting women up, not breaking them down.

Also, while I understand what you're saying that you would not vote for a white person, I cannot help but be offended by it. Perhaps, this is a personal failing but I could never imagine saying or thinking anything like it myself, and I just find it offensive.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Also, while I understand what you're saying that you would not vote for a white person, I cannot help but be offended by it. Perhaps, this is a personal failing but I could never imagine saying or thinking anything like it myself, and I just find it offensive.

Think of it in other terms. I you were a member of a Muslim sorority, wouldn't you be kinda skeptical of a Christian woman looking to join your organization? The cultures are extremely different and the ability of the Christian woman to support the purpose of a Muslim organization would be in question. It doesn't have to be a personal affront. Even this example isn't adequate as a Christian could convert to Islam and understand the culture from the inside out. That can't ever happen with a white person who wants to join a black organization. He/she could never fully understand.

[Reds6]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Oh I completely agree that she isn't comfortable with herself, it was the "I'm Glad someone so screwed up isn't in my sorority" comments that made me post. I'd rather see all of our organizations working towards lifting women up, not breaking them down.

Also, while I understand what you're saying that you would not vote for a white person, I cannot help but be offended by it. Perhaps, this is a personal failing but I could never imagine saying or thinking anything like it myself, and I just find it offensive.

Oh you can be.

[RedefinedDiva]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Oh I completely agree that she isn't comfortable with herself, it was the "I'm Glad someone so screwed up isn't in my sorority" comments that made me post. I'd rather see all of our organizations working towards lifting women up, not breaking them down.

I said it before and I'll say it again. I'm glad that someone with such screwed up thinking DID NOT become a member of my Sorority.

D9 Sororities are ALWAYS working within the community with young woman and girls to ensure that they are molded and have a better understanding of their own self-worth. However, we cannot undo all the nonsese that may be ingrained in a person's mind after YEARS of denying their own heritage. I don't know anyone's personal circumstances, nor do I care to. But just like you take offense to my comments, I take offense to hers. To make statements like "I'm not 'Black' enough to be a member of the XYZ Sorority" is ridiculous. You see no one with all these wild accusations has been back to explain what they mean. How can a white chick be "Black enough" to join a D9 Sorority, but a chick that is HALF Black isn't? That goes to show that she has no clue about her Black heritage, nor has she taken the time to find out.

I would much rather someone just say they didn't find the right "fit" when it came to NPHC or NPC Sororities instead of saying they aren't "Black" or "White" enough to make it in. You can choose not to be offended, but I am.