2006 College Football

[xo_kathy]

Originally Posted by kstar

They aren't called INDIANS you moron, Indians are from India, Native Americans are the indigenous people of North America.

Just a note - indigenous people of North America call themselves Indians. To clarify they will sometimes say American Indians, but Indians nonetheless. In fact, the American Indian Hetiage Foundation's website is www.indians.org.

Native American is just a pc term someone came up with a while ago.

[shinerbock]

I'm not sure if Arkansas can get in. Its like we were in 2004, if you start too low, it takes too long to get up. That being said, I think they're playing the best football of any one loss team. Back before Auburn played the worst game in their history saturday, there was the debate over who deserved to be first, Ark or AU. I thought that Arkansas was probably a better team than we were, but I could justify them being behind us simply because AU had wins over UF and LSU. So for the same reasons I can buy into the argument that Arky will get the credit when they beat LSU and UF. If they do that, however, I think it would be ridiculous for them to be denied. At that point, the would have beaten Tenn, LSU, UF and Auburn (and despite Auburn/Tenn looking rather pedistrian, a win over a 10-2 or 9-3 team is still a quality win), and I think that would be the most accomplished one loss record. Now, I don't know if they can do it with the system we have, but I think they deserve it if they can get through. The Ark team that played USC is obviously a completely different team now. I think they're heads above the mediocre play of the other one loss teams, but, my question is whether Nutt is really good enough to get the team to 12-1.

[kstar]

Originally Posted by xo_kathy

Just a note - indigenous people of North America call themselves Indians. To clarify they will sometimes say American Indians, but Indians nonetheless. In fact, the American Indian Hetiage Foundation's website is www.indians.org.

Native American is just a pc term someone came up with a while ago.

Many of the tribes around here prefer the term Native American. They use it on their literature.

My friends and family that have tribal affiliations use the term Native American. OK even uses the term in their tourism literature.

Most Native Americans that I know take great offense to being called an "Indian," and the few Indians I know also don't like the term being used to refer to Native Americans.

[xo_kathy]

Originally Posted by kstar

Many of the tribes around here prefer the term Native American. They use it on their literature.

My friends and family that have tribal affiliations use the term Native American. OK even uses the term in their tourism literature.

Most Native Americans that I know take great offense to being called an "Indian," and the few Indians I know also don't like the term being used to refer to Native Americans.

Well, all my family and friends with tribal affiliations call themselves "Indians" or "Natives" - not Native Americans. Mostly because they were here first, so they are not native to America - they are native to this land (their land). And the literature? If you're trying to get in some tourism dollars, you'll put whatever you think gets people interested.

And Indians from India?! They don't even speak English so why would they care about an English word being used in America? And if you are referring to immigrants, well that's just dumb. It's an English term for the first peoples in this land, and it was used long before people from India started coming here I'm sure.

/hijack

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by kstar

Most Native Americans that I know take great offense to being called an "Indian," and the few Indians I know also don't like the term being used to refer to Native Americans.

And tribal members that I know use "Indian," "American Indian" or perhaps, when speaking of all American Indians as a group, "native" or "indigenous people" -- or they get specific and say "Cherokee" or the like. So this proves . . . ?

BTW, been to the National Museum of the American Indian lately?

When in doubt, one can always consult that omniscient source, The Wiki:

The term Native American was originally introduced in the United States by anthropologists as a more accurate term for the indigenous people of the Americas, as distinguished from the people of India. Because of the widespread acceptance of this newer term in and outside of academic circles, some people believe that Indians was outdated or offensive. People from India (and their descendants) who are citizens of the United States are known as Indian Americans.

However, some American Indians have misgivings about the term Native American. Russell Means, a famous American Indian activist, opposes the term Native American because he believes it was imposed by the government without the consent of American Indians. Furthermore, some American Indians question the term Native American because, they argue, it serves to ease the conscience of "white America" with regard to past injustices done to American Indians by effectively eliminating "Indians" from the present. Still others (both Indians and non-Indians) argue that Native American is problematic because "native of" literally means "born in," so any person born in the Americas could be considered "native". However, very often the compound "Native American" will be capitalized in order to differentiate this intended meaning from others. Likewise, "native" (small 'n') can be further qualified by formulations such as "native-born" when the intended meaning is only to indicate place of birth or origin.

A 1996 survey revealed that more American Indians in the United States still preferred American Indian to Native American. Nonetheless, most American Indians are comfortable with Indian, American Indian, and Native American, and the terms are now used interchangeably. The continued usage of the traditional term is reflected in the name chosen for the National Museum of the American Indian, which opened in 2004 in Washington, D.C..

Recently, the U.S. Census introduced the "Asian Indian" category to more accurately sample the Indian American population.

Don't hurt yourself getting off that high horse.

[xo_kathy]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Don't hurt yourself getting off that high horse.

ha ha ha ha ha

Sorry, but that was funny!

Thanks for the info (as always), MysticCat!

[Kevin]

Guys, this is a college football thread. I don't see how the potential offensiveness of this term has much to do with anything in this thread unless you want to talk about the NCAA's stance on indian/native american mascots which is ridiculous. A local D-II school just played their last game as the "Redmen" which they had been called for 81 years. The funny thing is that the school is in the same town as the Cherokee Nation's capitol, and it was the NCAA, not the Cherokee nation which forced/asked for this change.

The unfortunate Native American mascots out of football movement began in earnest in Oklahoma as they did away with the "Little Red" mascot. Little Red was usually a native American/indian student who dressed up in full indian regalia and performed a lot of native american/indian dances and such to cheer on the football team -- a pretty cool tradition IMHO, a lot better than the wagon. My brother used to date the daughter of a former Little Red, and my father was good friends with another in law school.