Israel at War?

[RACooper]

Well the IDF released it's "findings" concerning the "accidental" shelling and air-strike that killed for UN observers... and the conclusion is: that IDF was using a hand-drawn map to plot it's artillery battery and air-strikes

http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/nation...el-report.html

Anyways since my opinion is obviously bias (apparently like everyone else who questions some Israeli actions), I'll let others with military experience or knowledge comment on the likelyhood of a hand-drawn map countering GPS positioning, Laser guidance, and 20+ years of maps showing the UN post (and former Israeli post before that).

[Rudey]

Originally Posted by RACooper

Well the IDF released it's "findings" concerning the "accidental" shelling and air-strike that killed for UN observers... and the conclusion is: that IDF was using a hand-drawn map to plot it's artillery battery and air-strikes

http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/nation...el-report.html

Anyways since my opinion is obviously bias (apparently like everyone else who questions some Israeli actions), I'll let others with military experience or knowledge comment on the likelyhood of a hand-drawn map countering GPS positioning, Laser guidance, and 20+ years of maps showing the UN post (and former Israeli post before that).

No your opinion is biased because you have never done anything but question American and Israeli motives before any investigation. But I'm sure your two second glance from a few thousand miles away of an area you know nothing about is just as valid as any investigation someone else might conduct.

-Rudey

[RACooper]

Originally Posted by Rudey

No your opinion is biased because you have never done anything but question American and Israeli motives before any investigation. But I'm sure your two second glance from a few thousand miles away of an area you know nothing about is just as valid as any investigation someone else might conduct.

-Rudey

Yes... far be it from me to question how one of the world's most advanced militaries operates on hand drawn maps

So the IDF is one of the most advanced militaries in the world. They use guided munitions acurate within less than half a metre. Their airborne devlivery targeting systems use advanced C3 systems in constant communication. They make almost exclusive use of guided artilery munitions, many being laser designated. Their bombs are laser and GPS guided, with pilot control up to the point of impact thanks to the use of digital imaging in the weapons package. They are in a constant state of planning and training, developing and reviewing battle strategies on all borders. They keep a constant vigilance on the Lebanese border, noting and marking every item of military value.

Yet this same military resorts to hand drawn maps of a position that they once held, and has been mapped again and again for the past 2 decades? Does this same military fail to see the UN flag flying from the post during the 14 bombardment that preceeded the air strike? Does this same military have pilots with such poor vision that they fail to notice a giant 10m "UN" painted on the roof of the building? Or for that matter does this same military recruit extremely poor sighted operators for it Drones as well, given that one was observing the strike as well? Does this same military some how miss or ignore the stream of communications from this post? Does this same military forget the website posting of Hezbollah troops movements posted from the observers? Hmmmm...

Sorry but I find the excuse of inconcievable incompitence and stupidity, combined with freakishly improbible coincidence hard to swallow... but hey it worked for the IDF before in covering up criminal acts...

[Rudey]

So what you're saying is you're not an expert, weren't there, didn't conduct any sort of investigation and that's that right? OK. I just wanted to check.

-Rudey

Originally Posted by RACooper

Yes... far be it from me to question how one of the world's most advanced militaries operates on hand drawn maps

So the IDF is one of the most advanced militaries in the world. They use guided munitions acurate within less than half a metre. Their airborne devlivery targeting systems use advanced C3 systems in constant communication. They make almost exclusive use of guided artilery munitions, many being laser designated. Their bombs are laser and GPS guided, with pilot control up to the point of impact thanks to the use of digital imaging in the weapons package. They are in a constant state of planning and training, developing and reviewing battle strategies on all borders. They keep a constant vigilance on the Lebanese border, noting and marking every item of military value.

Yet this same military resorts to hand drawn maps of a position that they once held, and has been mapped again and again for the past 2 decades? Does this same military fail to see the UN flag flying from the post during the 14 bombardment that preceeded the air strike? Does this same military have pilots with such poor vision that they fail to notice a giant 10m "UN" painted on the roof of the building? Or for that matter does this same military recruit extremely poor sighted operators for it Drones as well, given that one was observing the strike as well? Does this same military some how miss or ignore the stream of communications from this post? Does this same military forget the website posting of Hezbollah troops movements posted from the observers? Hmmmm...

Sorry but I find the excuse of inconcievable incompitence and stupidity, combined with freakishly improbible coincidence hard to swallow... but hey it worked for the IDF before in covering up criminal acts...

[RACooper]

Originally Posted by Rudey

So what you're saying is you're not an expert, weren't there, didn't conduct any sort of investigation and that's that right? OK. I just wanted to check.

-Rudey

Actually... funny thing about that... if you'll remember Rudey I "technically" qualify as an expert on military hardware and technology - or at least that's what the contract said with Military Intelligence a couple years back...

If you'd like I could give a rousing discourse on the developement of Israeli armour (tanks being my specialty)... but hey that's not the issue is it? Rather the issue is the validity of the IDF claims in light of their operational standards and capabilities.

[Rudey]

Originally Posted by RACooper

Actually... funny thing about that... if you'll remember Rudey I "technically" qualify as an expert on military hardware and technology - or at least that's what the contract said with Military Intelligence a couple years back...

If you'd like I could give a rousing discourse on the developement of Israeli armour (tanks being my specialty)... but hey that's not the issue is it? Rather the issue is the validity of the IDF claims in light of their operational standards and capabilities.

Dude let it go. I don't know where this huge animosity comes from but it can't be good for you. It really can't.

-Rudey