Minimum Wage

[Rollergirl2001]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Thanks for the platitudes . . . do these statements really mean anything?

Let's discuss the reality of the 'free market' - few people live at minimum wage as it is, and those who do are generally in areas with a ridiculously low cost of living. Employers will pay what they need to in order to attract employees, and "living wage" laws most likely foist the problem onto the backs of the lower middle class - it's not really the grand "top-down" or "bottom-up" ideal that people envision, and it's essentially partial socialism without any sort of reasonable utility.

The cost is NOT taken from the top of the chain - it's imparted on the rest of it, which affects the bottom rungs more than anything.

Yes, they do. Go to the grocery store, and see the ridiculous prices. The highest price for a gallon of milk is over $3. A movie ticket is expensive. It's $8here in many theaters. Many seniors can't afford prescription drugs, becasue of being paid low wages. They are given a choice between medicene and food. You can guess which they chose. In my state, thousands of people were cut from TennCare and many have to find other ways to pay. That's were the decision comes to for many poor people about medicene. That's exactly what I'm talking about the buying power becoming less.

Did we not learn from Hurricane Katrina? It seems that the Republicans have not learned from it. All the Republicans care about it the rich. I'm not saying that they don't give to the poor. It's just that they want to get greedy.

It's true that many people are paid more that the minimum wage, but the income still put them below the poverty line.

[KSigkid]

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

Did we not learn from Hurricane Katrina? It seems that the Republicans have not learned from it. All the Republicans care about it the rich. I'm not saying that they don't give to the poor. It's just that they want to get greedy.

Thanks for the generalizations and attacks on Republicans. They do a whole lot to help the argument.

I'm with Kevlar and the others that raising minimum wage isn't going to do much, except hurt small and medium-sized business owners. Do we raise the minimum wages, help the small number who live off of these, but in return doom the small businesses that hire these people? Doesn't make sense to me.

- Worked at least part time through high school, full-time in college, and did it for minimum wage at points (which at the time was less than $7 per hour).

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

Yes, they do. Go to the grocery store, and see the ridiculous prices. The highest price for a gallon of milk is over $3. A movie ticket is expensive. It's $8here in many theaters. Many seniors can't afford prescription drugs, becasue of being paid low wages. They are given a choice between medicene and food. You can guess which they chose. In my state, thousands of people were cut from TennCare and many have to find other ways to pay. That's were the decision comes to for many poor people about medicene. That's exactly what I'm talking about the buying power becoming less.

I know you don't understand, but most of this paragraph actually supports what KSig RC is saying. If you raise min. wage, that $3 gallon of milk is suddenly going to be $5, and that $8 movie is going to be $12. Now, not only are the people who were making $5.15 struggling, but the people who are making $7 are now stuggling too.

[PM_Mama00]

[QUOTE=AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

Yes, they do. Go to the grocery store, and see the ridiculous prices. The highest price for a gallon of milk is over $3. A movie ticket is expensive. It's $8here in many theaters. Many seniors can't afford prescription drugs, becasue of being paid low wages. They are given a choice between medicene and food. You can guess which they chose. In my state, thousands of people were cut from TennCare and many have to find other ways to pay. That's were the decision comes to for many poor people about medicene. That's exactly what I'm talking about the buying power becoming less.
QUOTE]


I know you don't understand, but most of this paragraph actually supports what KSig RC is saying. If you raise min. wage, that $3 gallon of milk is suddenly going to be $5, and that $8 movie is going to be $12. Now, not only are the people who were making $5.15 struggling, but the people who are making $7 are now stuggling too.

Not to mention, but if you can barely afford food, then why are you going for the most expensive gallon of milk? And why are you going to the movie theater when you can rent the movie for way cheaper when it comes out on video?

I'm making $8 at one job, and $10 at the other. I work a total of maybe 3 days a week. I could survive on my own if I didn't have a car, insurance, paid for BC and a pretty expensive phone bill every month. I could probably have a decent apartment with a roomate, maybe nothing special to it, but a roof over my head and a job that I can work my way up on or just get experience for another job. If you're making minimum wage, or around what I'm making (which amounts to horsecrap) maybe you should skip out on that $8 movie and buy yourself a $1something gallon of milk. It's all about budgeting wisely.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

If you're making minimum wage, or around what I'm making (which amounts to horsecrap) maybe you should skip out on that $8 movie and buy yourself a $1something gallon of milk. It's all about budgeting wisely.

Aldi's = broke person's best friend.

[valkyrie]

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

If you're making minimum wage, or around what I'm making (which amounts to horsecrap) maybe you should skip out on that $8 movie and buy yourself a $1something gallon of milk. It's all about budgeting wisely.

Unless that movie is Snakes on a Plane, in which case it's totally okay.

[Drolefille]

WOOOOO SoaP!

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by valkyrie

Unless that movie is Snakes on a Plane, in which case it's totally okay.

LOL!

[Rollergirl2001]

[QUOTE=PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

Not to mention, but if you can barely afford food, then why are you going for the most expensive gallon of milk? And why are you going to the movie theater when you can rent the movie for way cheaper when it comes out on video?

I'm making $8 at one job, and $10 at the other. I work a total of maybe 3 days a week. I could survive on my own if I didn't have a car, insurance, paid for BC and a pretty expensive phone bill every month. I could probably have a decent apartment with a roomate, maybe nothing special to it, but a roof over my head and a job that I can work my way up on or just get experience for another job. If you're making minimum wage, or around what I'm making (which amounts to horsecrap) maybe you should skip out on that $8 movie and buy yourself a $1something gallon of milk. It's all about budgeting wisely.

I'm afraid that you misinterpret what I said. I'm not saying to go for the expensive milk. What I meant is that things are getting expensive, thanks to inflation and the weaseling of the Bush administration. I don't remember a gallon of the most expensive milk being that high. BTW, the cheapest gallon of milk in my area is just over $2.25. Even if a person were to budget wisely, he (she) might come up on the short end of the stick when it comes to getting essentials. When a person has to get gas, the station with the cheapest gas price may be a 5 or even 10 minute drive as opposed to another station that is a 2 minute drive.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

I'm afraid that you misinterpret what I said. I'm not saying to go for the expensive milk. What I meant is that things are getting expensive, thanks to inflation and the weaseling of the Bush administration

Thanks to inflation. What do you think raising min wage will do??

INFLATION

[bluefish81]

As far as minimum wage goes, aren't some small businesses exempt from having to pay minimum wage, depending on how much they make or size or something? One of my summer jobs back in high school was at the hometown grocery store (employed 5 people) and they didn't pay me federal minimum wage.

And as far as cost of items goes, I'm no expert, but my guess would be that some of the reason that items might be going up in the stores could be in part, due to gas prices. A majority of your goods arrive via semi, and diesel has gone up in price over the past couple of years which has causes shipping prices to go up. Maybe I'm completely off target, but I'm going to bet that the cost for that is getting passed on to the consumer.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

Yes, they do. Go to the grocery store, and see the ridiculous prices. The highest price for a gallon of milk is over $3. A movie ticket is expensive. It's $8here in many theaters.

AlphaFrog has already explained why you're totally wrong here, but I'll go into more detail.

Prices are set by the provider. The provider is a company. The first priority for any company has to be to make a profit, whether it be for shareholders, employee-owners or simply to pay salaries etc.

Raising wages significantly increases cost, which reduces profits, which leads to higher prices. Because the first dollar you earn is SIGNIFICANTLY more important than the last dollar you earn, these additional dollars in turn hurt people who make less money. You're taxing the semi-poor to pay the possibly poor (or the young, or the governmentally-assisted, or etc.).

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

Many seniors can't afford prescription drugs, becasue of being paid low wages. They are given a choice between medicene and food. You can guess which they chose.

Many seniors are also past retirement age, and already qualify for governmental assistance. Also, if you can show me a study where raising the minimum wage any reasonable amount (say, to $7/hr) would alleviate all drug-related ills among the elderly, I'll run with this argument - however, this problem is NOT a minimum-wage issue.

Also, this would be subject to market correction if seniors would a.) keep working the jobs they retired from, b.) utilized their collective power in organizations such as the AARP (seniors are NOT getting screwed in this country; they're the most overrepresented group on Earth) or c.) actually used the programs available, and didn't cheat them.

I get why this is your clarion call, but it's a touchy-feely argument that essentially amounts to BS under scrutiny.

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

In my state, thousands of people were cut from TennCare and many have to find other ways to pay. That's were the decision comes to for many poor people about medicene. That's exactly what I'm talking about the buying power becoming less.

In your state, why were these people cut from TennCare? Did they . . . no longer meet the requirements? Meaning . . . they earned too much?

Again, this is a feel-good argument that doesn't address the actual point: raising minimum wage may not help their 'buying power', and will significantly hurt those in the next tier(s) above them.

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

Did we not learn from Hurricane Katrina?

I did learn from Hurricane Katrina - I learned that it was a catastrophe, and using it as a bizarre strawman in an unrelated argument is pretty distasteful. You're distorting the issue for emotional effect - grow up.

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

It seems that the Republicans have not learned from it. All the Republicans care about it the rich. I'm not saying that they don't give to the poor. It's just that they want to get greedy.

Maybe, instead of 'protecting the rich', they're simply not favoring a very small part of society at the expense of an equally large segment (if not larger)?

Also, insinuating that this is purely a Republican problem is pretty short-sighted - both sides have attempted to tack increases onto non-related bills to kill them, it's a bipartisan effort, my friend.

Originally Posted by Rollergirl2001

It's true that many people are paid more that the minimum wage, but the income still put them below the poverty line.

This is only true in situations where one person is providing for multiple people - the poverty line for an individual is under $10,000, and 40 hours of $5.25/hr for 50 weeks is just over 10k. If you add a child, sure, it jumps to just over $13,000 - however, I don't think you want to really argue that scenario, lest ktsnake get all "down with social welfare programs" on your ass.

[adpiucf]

I'm a Republican. I'm far from rich. I believe that I have a right to earn what I keep. I don't understand why the money I make to support myself has to go to support other people so they can buy food, clothes, Nikes, Ipods and designer handbags. Why is it my job to earn money for them? I don't think anyone is entitled to health care just because they're a walking, breathing person. I honestly don't think anyone is entitled to anything just because they're a walking, breathing person. If you want services or products, go earn money and pay for them.

/Black sheep from a liberal family
/I take it back. I'm not espousing Republican views. I'm just really cheap.