School Daze question.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

I didn't do any research on this, so you can if you'd like, but I still imagine you'll agree with me that the huge majority of all college students at the time most IFC fraternities were founded were white.

Correct and, for the record, this obvious point requires no research.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by orighu

are you sure about that? i'm gonna echo what others have said - PLEASE do some research. HBCU's were founded because blacks were not allowed to attend the white universities - but i would bet there are African American families that have college degrees older than your fraternity.

Yeah but there isn't a substantial amount of blacks who received college degrees in the 1800s and early to mid 1900s--so no need to debate a point based on what are perceived as outliers to a generality. Shinerbock's post was an exaggeration but I understand what he was getting at.

The general point is that blacks were overwhelmingly shut out of most social institutions back then. There was a very small percentage of blacks matriculating at historically white colleges and universities back then and a larger percentage matriculating at whichever HBCUs were already founded.

[shinerbock]

Yeah, my point was that I don't think it was the IFC fraternities denying membership to blacks in the late 1800's. Thats not to say they would have been welcome, but I don't think the IFC fraternities at the time even had the opportunity to reject their membership.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

Yeah, my point was that I don't think it was the IFC fraternities denying membership to blacks in the late 1800's. Thats not to say they would have been welcome, but I don't think the IFC fraternities at the time even had the opportunity to reject their membership.

It is called a self-fulfilling prophecy. You (meaning: the powerful whites who hoarded the opportunities) don't allow them into your institutions of higher learning in the first place so you don't have to worry about them trying to join your fraternities and other organizations once they get there. It didn't have to be the IFC fraternity men themselves but they were a product of their environment and cashed in on their privilege.

[shinerbock]

You're right about the point I was trying to make. However, I think your association of the IFC guys benefitting from the University's actions is like someone calling me racist because my family had a plantation.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

However, I think your association of the IFC guys benefitting from the University's actions is like someone calling me racist because my family had a plantation.

There's no denying that people both intentionally and unintentionally benefit from privilege and opportunity/resource hoarding. It happened back then and it happens now. It's not about playing the blame game so no need to fight for those IFC members' causes.

I see the point behind your (perhaps incomplete) analogy and for the record I do not use the terms "racist" and "racism" loosely. If your family owned a plantation (as many families in the South did--even some black families) then they are economic opportunists who participated in the exploitation of cheap labor in the form of slavery. It wasn't until later that the economic base became about race and racist ideology. So, no, neither your family nor you would necessarily be racist JUST because of the plantation----but this doesn't mean that your family or you aren't racist, I would have to know more about your family's situation and ideological foundation to make such a statement.