Why are there no black members in Phi Kappa Psi? Another view

[FuzzieAlum]

If you're going to go by how many pay national dues=number of active alums, then Alpha Xi Delta has ZERO active alums. That's right - we don't have national dues for alumnae.

Now local alum associations do have dues, but they're pretty lax about payment, and anyway not everyone lives near an alum association. Let's say Sister X is the chapter advisor for a chapter that happens to be out in BFE. There is no alum association anywhere nearby. But I would have a hard time saying, "Well, she's not active in her sorority," just because you can't count her as a dues-paying member!

[sugar and spice]

Originally posted by VirtuousErudite
I found this interesting. From the mtv webpage and the interview with Stephen, (the black Fraternity Life pledge):Bonus Question:


Q: What's your pledge name and why?

A: Token--because I am the token black guy in the fraternity

What the heck is that about????

If you look at the "Fraternity Life" thread, you'll see that that issue is currently being debated. Still, I don't think it's the best idea to look at anything on MTV as a realistic portrayal of NIC or NPC organizations -- especially since the one on "Fraternity Life" ISN'T one.

[VirtuousErudite]

If you look at the "Fraternity Life" thread, you'll see that that issue is currently being debated. Still, I don't think it's the best idea to look at anything on MTV as a realistic portrayal of NIC or NPC organizations -- especially since the one on "Fraternity Life" ISN'T one


Whether Sigma Chi Omega is NIC or not it is still an example of a minority joining a greek letter organization in which they are a minority. This is the point I was making, I would be upset if i was referred to as "token" by my "brothers" whether it was a joke or not.

[Sistermadly]

Originally posted by VirtuousErudite
Whether Sigma Chi Omega is NIC or not it is still an example of a minority joining a greek letter organization in which they are a minority.

But it's an example - meaning ONE. It doesn't by any stretch of the imagination mean that all people of colour who join non-minority organizations are treated this way. It doesn't even mean that most people of colour who are in this situation are treated this way!

If we're going to base our opinions of others on MTV shows, then we can say that all brothers have attitude problems, all sisters have attitude problems and can't stand white girls, and all virgin mormon girls are secret party girls just waiting to bust out.

Heavens to murgatroid!

[VirtuousErudite]

Originally posted by Sistermadly
But it's an example - meaning ONE. It doesn't by any stretch of the imagination mean that all people of colour who join non-minority organizations are treated this way. It doesn't even mean that most people of colour who are in this situation are treated this way!

If we're going to base our opinions of others on MTV shows, then we can say that all brothers have attitude problems, all sisters have attitude problems and can't stand white girls, and all virgin mormon girls are secret party girls just waiting to bust out.

Heavens to murgatroid!

I realize very well that it is an example and I never meant to insinuate that it was not an example. Unfortunately in my experiences it is a COMMON EXAMPLE. But I can only speak for what I have seen.

[SapphireSphinx9]

Originally posted by VirtuousErudite
Whether Sigma Chi Omega is NIC or not it is still an example of a minority joining a greek letter organization in which they are a minority. This is the point I was making, I would be upset if i was referred to as "token" by my "brothers" whether it was a joke or not.

When we were still a colony I was referred to as "The Light Bulb." We don't have official nicknames, it was just something that some of my sisters would call me... The reason why is because when you look at our Founding Pictures I stuck out like a sore thumb... Like a LIGHT BULB. I wasn't the only white sister (there were 2 others) but I was the tallest, and the "brightest"... (I'm pretty damn pale ) But I didn't take it to heart. I thought it was funny, and even told my mom, who also thought it was funny.

So even though I wasn't referred to as the "Token", it still alluded to my skin color, or lack there of... And I knew that it wasn't meant to be malicious in any way.

Just trying to bring some light into this thread. da-da-dum...

Fraternally,
Beth

[VirtuousErudite]

You are right, I'm sure they meant "token" in the best possible way.

[pledge]

I live in the South. I am a Black female and part of a multi-cultural sorority. That really erks me when people think that the South is just full of hate and racism. Sure, we still have people here that are racist or biased. But, I can tell you that I am more likely to experience racism in the Ohio or New York, than here in Georgia. I am more likely to experience racism in California than here in the south. So, don't think that just b/c you live in "a diverse state" or go to a "diverse school" that you're immune from racism.

As for Blacks joining all white sororties or fraternities. I see no problem with it as long as they want us for the right reason and not as a token. I can also see how some of us minorities shy away from all white chapters. One example, the Sigma Nu chapter here at my school has members that walk around in Confederate flag shirts with their greet letters on the shirt. Now, I don't know if the National Sigma Nu chapter excepts this, but to the minorities and other people on campus, that says a lot about what some of their members feel about diversity.

[sugar and spice]

Originally posted by VirtuousErudite

Whether Sigma Chi Omega is NIC or not it is still an example of a minority joining a greek letter organization in which they are a minority. This is the point I was making, I would be upset if i was referred to as "token" by my "brothers" whether it was a joke or not.

You might be upset if you were referred to that way, but that doesn't mean that everybody would. Hopefully Steve was okay with it . . . otherwise I can't imagine why he would put up with it. And if he doesn't have an issue with his brothers calling him "Token," then why should you?

If he does have a problem with the name, why is he staying in the fraternity? If my sisters referred to me by a nickname that I found derogatory, and refused to stop when I pointed out the fact that it was derogatory, I'd DA so fast their heads would spin -- and I assume that anybody else would do the same.

Now I agree with you that the name could definitely be offensive, but if he doesn't have a problem with it then I'm certainly not going to worry.

And as we constantly point out -- Fraternity Life and Sorority Life are in no way accurate depictions of most fraternities and sororities. You can't base assumptions of "what non-NPHC groups are like" off of that show because there are some very significant differences all across the board.

[Phasad1913]

"One example, the Sigma Nu chapter here at my school has members that walk around in Confederate flag shirts with their greet letters on the shirt. Now, I don't know if the National Sigma Nu chapter excepts this, but to the minorities and other people on campus, that says a lot about what some of their members feel about diversity."

I'm sorry, the first part of your post said something about the south not being racist anymore, right? AW OK DEN! just checkin!!

[Kevin]

I think that she was illustrating that there is a difference in saying "the south is racist" and saying that some people in the south are racist.

Pledge, please correct me if I'm off the mark.

[showstopper_1908]

So, this thread has finally come full circle back to the original question asked. I think it was answered many times by many different people. There is not 1 answer. Organizations may want to be more diverse, why? does it look good on paper? Does it make the house feel more warm and cuddly to have minorities there? Will it be to attract more minorities? Will it be for "change"? Whatever the reason some organizations want more minorities, they do. Personally I would ask, why not just want people who want to be there, instead of trying to recruit a rainbow coalition. I am one of the people who believe that race shouldn't be an issue when looking at a prospective member. However, when looking at a prospective organization, it may happen. Others have expressed how important and esteemed the Divine 9 organizations are in the black community. Which should have ended the discussion that "Black Greek organizations are better that White Greek organizations", but it did not. It wasn't a black Greek/white Greek issue. There are predominately black Greek orgs that are known for 100% party & bs. Unless you know a little background on NPHC also known as the Divine 9, you wouldn't understand this. Many member and non-members tried to explain this. Some people were offended by the great enthusiasm shown in the posts and took it as those people looking down on organizations that are not Divine 9. No, that is not what it is. It is pride. Please just take it as that. We should all be proud. Instead of comparing notes and saying, "Oh...you gave $500 to XYZ charity, well we gave $5,000!" or the ever popular "Hey...we are still active too" speech. I know members of IFC orgs that do serious community service and are active with their fraternity after college. Just as I know NPHC members who do zero community service and do not remain active after college. No one needs to school me on who does what, I understand that there are people from all walks of life in Greek orgs and people who will work for their org until the day they die. Kudos. The purpose of those explanations was to give those who don't understand the importance of NPHC organizations a look into why perhaps this young mans parents had these feelings. Those who don't understand it's long rooted history may look in from the outside and yell reverse-racism. Those looking at it from a different perspective will see that this woman was just a tad overbearing (ya think?), but she was holding him by the hand and leading him to the place she felt he needed to be, or at least where she wanted him to be. No different than a parent choosing your religion, your school, or your dinner.

[MysticCat]

Originally posted by Phasad1913
"One example, the Sigma Nu chapter here at my school has members that walk around in Confederate flag shirts with their greet letters on the shirt. Now, I don't know if the National Sigma Nu chapter excepts this, but to the minorities and other people on campus, that says a lot about what some of their members feel about diversity."

I'm sorry, the first part of your post said something about the south not being racist anymore, right?

Ummm, no. Wrong.

Originally posted by ktsnake
I think that she was illustrating that there is a difference in saying "the south is racist" and saying that some people in the south are racist.

Correct, ktsnake. Her actual quote was:

"That really erks me when people think that the South is just full of hate and racism. Sure, we still have people here that are racist or biased. But, I can tell you that I am more likely to experience racism in the Ohio or New York, than here in Georgia. I am more likely to experience racism in California than here in the south. So, don't think that just b/c you live in 'a diverse state' or go to a 'diverse school' that you're immune from racism." (Emphasis added.)

[FuzzieAlum]

Well-said, Showstopper.

I guess I believe one of the most important functions of college is for a young person to begin making their own decisions. It's a transition period between being taken care of at home and being 100% on your own. For that reason, I don't think parents should be making decisions for their children at that age. Once you're 18, your parents should not be picking your dinner or your religion ... or even your school (although I can understand certain strong suggestions based on finance or geography).

As a parent, one no doubt wants your kids to do certain things - be Episcopalian or Baptist, be vegetarian or like Southern cooking, attend Mom's school or go Ivy League, but you can't force them, except by withholding money. And even then the kid can say, "Sorry, I'll choose to be broke and work my way through school, then." The parent should have instilled Episcopalian values or a love of vegetarianism way before then - or in this case an interest in a D9 organization.

At that age, if your kid is making a mistake, you tell them you think it's a mistake, but then you sit back and let them make it. (Excluding participation in seriously illegal acts like drug dealing!) Otherwise, how will your child ever learn to be a fully independent human being?