Division in America

[IUHoosiergirl88]

Originally Posted by agzg

Also, I see this post turning into an Oppression Olympics.

This made me LOL

[Mizeree I2K]

Originally Posted by PiKA2001

Well I'm glad to hear that the discrimination of people based on sexual orientation, gender, race ('cept blacks), religion, income, disability, and _____ has finally ended in America!

With that overly simplistic one sided "my perceived problems are the only ones that matter" line of thought I don't see the issue of "Division in America" ever going away.

Have a seat home's.

[DrPhil]

IotaGuy, you know better than this. This issue is not about racial slurs. You may never be called a racial slur in your life (to your face). But, systemic oppression does not disappear just because people are smiling at you. Systemic oppression does not require people to be overtly rude or demeaning. That is why social inequalities (all social inequalities, and not just the inequalities that individuals care about when playing the Ranking of Oppressions) will always exist. ETA: The existence of successful racial and ethnic minorities does not reduce the existence and impact of systemic oppression.

The emphasis on slurs, prejudice, the overt, and kumbaya is why "colorblindness" was attempted and the resulting "colorblind racism" is pervasive. The idea was that if we can pretend there is no such thing as race, ethnicity, culture, language, and other things that differentiate groups of people, that means that humans are all robots that look alike, talk alike, live alike, etc.. More accurately, this was the "whiteness of the world" in that white privilege allowed whites (in general) to pretend that they, themselves, do not have a race and ethnicity. Under colorblindness and colorblind racism, whites transferred this into pretending as though "I don't see race." I have heard whites say things like "I don't even notice your race...you're kind of white like me." Uh...no, bitch, do not turn me into a white person to make yourself feel more comfortable and don't equate "race and ethnicity" with "racism". They are not synonymous. Although inequalities are durable as long as there are visable differences across people, that doesn't mean that we need to be ashamed and afraid of certain differences. Race, ethnicity, culture, and language are social and cultural rather than biological but they are still "real." Things do not stop being "real" just because humans created them.

And this fits into this thread somehow: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBus4gHF1FE

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

IotaGuy, you know better than this. This issue is not about racial slurs. You may never be called a racial slur in your life (to your face). But, systemic oppression does not disappear just because people are smiling at you. Systemic oppression does not require people to be overtly rude or demeaning. That is why social inequalities (all social inequalities, and not just the inequalities that individuals care about when playing the Ranking of Oppressions) will always exist.

The emphasis on slurs, prejudice, the overt, and kumbaya is why "colorblindness" was attempted and the resulting "colorblind racism" is pervasive. The idea was that if we can pretend there is no such thing as race, ethnicity, culture, language, and other things that differentiate groups of people, that means that humans are all robots that look alike, talk alike, live alike, etc.. More accurately, this was the "whiteness of the world" in that white privilege allowed whites (in general) to pretend that they, themselves, do not have a race and ethnicity. Under colorblindness and colorblind racism, whites transferred this into pretending as though "I don't see race." I have heard whites say things like "I don't even notice your race...you're kind of white like me." Uh...no, bitch, do not turn me into a white person to make yourself feel more comfortable and don't equate "race and ethnicity" with "racism". They are not synonymous. Although inequalities are durable as long as there are differences across people, that doesn't mean that we need to be ashamed and afraid of certain differences. These are cultural rather than biological but they are still "real." Things do not stop being "real" just because humans created them in our social world.

Thank you for this. White people are afraid of "culture." In many ways we think we have no culture and traditions, but they are those mainstream traditions foisted on everyone else. Seeing someone with cultural differences is scary to people who have lived in a bubble surrounded by others who practice the same cultural norms as them. Trying to make everyone the same isn't the answer. Embracing the idea that everyone has their own traditions and they still love their children as much you do, love America as much as you do, are as intellectually competent as you are while holding to that culture and tradition is what is needed. At least that is my view from witnessing the insular world of the South for 37 years and the Southwest for 3 years.

[DrPhil]

Thanks for your insight, AOIIAngel, and I agree. Whites definitely do have culture(s) and there is a privilege in being able to choose whether to acknowledge racial, ethnic, and cultural heritage. Being a power majority requires seeing whiteness as the standard and therefore "others" are different. The same applies to men who believe that only women have a gender, heterosexuals who only believe nonheterosexuals have a sexual orientation, and the list of power majorities-minorities goes on.

As for whites existing in a bubble, most racial, ethnic, cultural, language, religious, and other groups around the world are segregated by force (including government force and city planning committees that design where residential and businesses are placed in the cities) or segregated by choice. The average person in the United States, for example, has a family and friendship environment of people who look and behave as they do. Their work environment may be more diverse but there remain nondiverse work environments. I am a cross between W.E.B. DuBois and Booker T. Washington so I believe in both running into a neighborhood and saying "I'm here now, bitches" AND allowing people to separate themselves to the extent that their separation does not mean unfair advantages and unfair disadvantages. The latter is difficult to accomplish which is one of the many reasons the world is as it is.

GC Race War Mode:
Go to hell, AOIIAngel, I didn't read your post but I'm sure there is racism in there somewhere. You typed "white" and I can only imagine that you were saying something intolerant and insensitive. Booyah. Now what?!

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Thank you for this. White people are afraid of "culture." In many ways we think we have no culture and traditions, but they are those mainstream traditions foisted on everyone else. Seeing someone with cultural differences is scary to people who have lived in a bubble surrounded by others who practice the same cultural norms as them. Trying to make everyone the same isn't the answer. Embracing the idea that everyone has their own traditions and they still love their children as much you do, love America as much as you do, are as intellectually competent as you are while holding to that culture and tradition is what is needed. At least that is my view from witnessing the insular world of the South for 37 years and the Southwest for 3 years.

I think this is absolutely spot on. It's a matter of realizing what we have in common as humans while respecting and understanding the differences of our heritages.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by amIblue?

It's a matter of realizing what we have in common as humans while respecting and understanding the differences of our heritages.

Kumbaya Kola is sugary and nasty.

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Kumbaya Kola is sugary and nasty.

I guess I don't see it in a Kumbaya way. I love my family. So do people from other backgrounds. I celebrate Christmas. Some people of other backgrounds do. Others do not. I'm not going to hate them because of it. I honestly believe our differences are interesting and enjoy finding out about other cultures. At the end of the day, I do believe that people find it easier to relate to others when they bear similarities in mind, but then again, that has more to do with individual relationships than racism.

Hell. I give up. I'll just go back to reading.

[thetalady]

It has been such a lovely, peaceful 10 months.... guess nothing is forever.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by amIblue?

I guess I don't see it in a Kumbaya way. I love my family. So do people from other backgrounds. I celebrate Christmas. Some people of other backgrounds do. Others do not. I'm not going to hate them because of it. I honestly believe our differences are interesting and enjoy finding out about other cultures. At the end of the day, I do believe that people find it easier to relate to others when they bear similarities in mind, but then again, that has more to do with individual relationships than racism.

Hell. I give up. I'll just go back to reading.

LOL. Hello, amIblue?, it is so nice to meet you. I am DrPhil and my posts are not always a response to you as an individual. You, as an individual, do not see it as Kumbaya but there are 7 billion people in the world, many of whom do see it as Kumbaya. They believe that if everyone could celebrate humanity and wave their hands at the differences across groups of people (including researching the topic, attending diversity trainings, and attending cultural events like a Hispanic Heritage Festival), things would be fine. That did not work thousands of years ago and that does not work in 2013. The power dynamics and power differentials remain the same.

Originally Posted by thetalady

It has been such a lovely, peaceful 10 months.... guess nothing is forever.

Why is this your first post in this thread?

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

LOL. Hello, amIblue?, it is so nice to meet you. I am DrPhil and my posts are not always a response to you as an individual. You, as an individual, do not see it as Kumbaya but there are 7 billion people in the world, many of whom do see it as Kumbaya. They believe that if everyone could celebrate humanity and wave their hands at the differences across groups of people (including researching the topic, attending diversity trainings, and attending cultural events like a Hispanic Heritage Festival), things would be fine. That did not work thousands of years ago and that does not work in 2013. The power dynamics and power differentials remain the same.

But what I do want to know is does Kumbaya Kola give you the diuhbeetus?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by amIblue?

But what I do want to know is does Kumbaya Kola give you the diuhbeetus?

Of course!! 20 grams of shooga.

Wait...did you only ask that because I'm a Black woman?!?!?! Oh nooooooooo!!!



Nah lemme mosey onalong 'fo GCers likea thetalady gets butthurt over dese hurr piece-full race threds no longa bein' a piece-full. 'cause u wus jus a smilin' n a typin' fo' I shows up. I causes a stirrr fo' da piece-full race threds. Da piece-full folkses don needs no stirrr n no uproarings frum a me...no surrr. U all jusa mosey onalong nah...I's so sawry...I's so sawry....

[amIblue?]

[AOII Angel]

I read you GC race war part first and was thinking, WTF did I say? LOL...you're really trying hard. Where is my picture of Wilfred Brimley to go with you diabeetus? My husband is an endocrinologist so he gets a copy of Diabetes every month in the mail. I get no end of pleasure announcing he's got "Diabeetus." Oh the small joys of life. Back to your friendly GC race war.

[*winter*]

Yay! Dr Phil is back

That is my only contribution to this thread.