Should undergrad fraternity and sorority chapters be abolished?

[trebleclef]

Due to several cases of severe forms of hazing and several other factors, some members of fraternities and sororities believe that undergrad chapters should be abolished. Greeks are a significant part of campus life. How do you feel this will affect the student body?

[amycat412]

See and I believe that students that haze would find a way to mistreat other students whether or not they were in a GLO. Maybe they'd be more prone to fights in bars and parties, maybe they'd play a team or intramural sport and take it out in that form--but its a group mentality that unfortunately, some people are prone to. Hazers are in the minority compared to the number of Greeks, and number of students overall. Don't make the mistake of over generalizing. You cannot sanction 240,000 members (using my GLOs' #) because of the actions of 5. That is no more fair than saying because one middle aged man shot his wife, then all middle aged married men are suspect for the same behavior. At my school, there were no incidences of hazing by a GLO in my 4 1/2 years as an undergrad, but our "world famous" marching band and flag team were known to require some pretty heinous acts of its new members. So do you get rid of the marching band? No. You sanction the individuals and instititue education on the matter. People will fight for what they love. We love our GLO's and will fight for them long past our college days. Hazing has no place in our organizations, and will not go unsanctioned. But the strong chapters who follow the rules should not be punished ofr the few that don't.

[This message has been edited by amycat412 (edited June 27, 2001).]

[trebleclef]

I am sorry if I offended anyone. I was not directing this statement to one particular Greek fraternity or sorority. This question stems from a subject that has been a major in the NPLC. I DO NOT believe that the undergrad chapters should be abolished. I REPEAT. I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT THE UNDERGRAD CHAPTERS SHOULD BE ABOLISHED. I strongly support them and attend their functions regularly. They encourage education, community service, and a common love for mankind. I have relatives who were members in undergrad chapters and they are still VITAL members today.

[SweetestDiva]

Goodness y'all! First you say we're too mean to new posters.. now they can't even get their first post up before they get attacked and accused. Some of y'all need to simmer down... or start your own chapter of Super Sleuths or something and solve some real mysteries.

[Tom Earp]

trebelchef, I have never heard of undergrads saying Greek Orgs. should be kicked off of campus!
We have a long list of distinguished Alums.
If not for the Greek Orgs. on campus, homecoming would be a bust! Commitees on campus would be empty, grade averages would be lower, and there would not be as money in donations for your school!
My Fraternity does not condone hazing, we were the first to not have pledges but Associate Members who are part of the Fraternity from when they first come into our fold.
unfortunatly, hazing comes from a few misguided people and not the majority, BUT we all have to suffer the aftermath because we are Greeks!
Schools who wish to throw Greeks off campus are in a knee jerk reaction and NO forsight of what could be down the road. I for one do not care about giving money to my school, I paid to get my education and if not for my Fraternity, I could care less about going back!

Homecoming and NO GREEKS, a bunch of high school bands and horse riders with the sanitation dept. fallowing behind!

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Tom Earp LX Z#1
Pittsburg State U. (Kansas)

[33girl]

Originally posted by trebleclef:
I am sorry if I offended anyone. I was not directing this statement to one particular Greek fraternity or sorority. This question stems from a subject that has been a major in the NPLC.

trebleclef, if you are asking a question that is specific to the NPHC (I assume that is what you meant) you should state that explicitly. I am aware that NPHC organizations gain many members through graduate chapters, however, for NPC and NIC organizations that is not the case. Less than 5% (if that) of members join after college. To abolish college chapters of these groups would be to abolish the groups themselves. That's why you got the responses you got.

[AXPAlum]

The idea of abolishing undergraduate chapters would, in effect, destroy the greek system simply. Members join while in college, not while they are alumni. It is true some are initiated here and there as alumni or honorary members, but the majority of brothers/sisters come from the undergraduate chapter. It would, simply, be illogical for any greek organization to want to remove their respective chapters. It just wouldn't make any sense at all. Does anyone have a different opinion?

I think that abolishing undergrads would work in the NHPC since as someone said before, alot of people wait to join when they attend grad. I know I have a couple of friends doing that and I probably would have to if I hadnt decided to join NPC instead. As for the NIC and NPC it definately wouldnt work because undergrads make up the whole thing pretty much. It exterminate the systems completely. I agree with two things. 1) some people make things into more than what it is. Yes hazing is hazing. However do we really need to report a sorority because they made their pledges have a sleepover in the basement and told them to do crossword puzzles? How about reporting serious stuff, like bleach being poured on guys and girls standing in their underwear and having people degrade them and circling the fat on them.2) even newbies deserve to speak, and I believe this is relevant b/c it has been an issue at my school.

[aopirose]

IMHO, I think that it will have a negative effect on the student body. There would be fewer options to develop leadership skills, contribute to philanthropy, or to establish life-long friendships. I would never have met my closest friends or my husband if I had not been Greek. Our paths would have never crossed if we didn't have Greek life in common.

I can understand the statement of abolishing undergraduate chapters being made as a knee-jerk reaction. However, I look at it this way. Since the incidents may involve college students, do you close the college?

[carnation]

Trebleclef, I don't know if you're trying to start something but why would you think that undergrad Greek members would say, "Yeah, because of the stupidity of some far-off chapter that has no relation to mine, I think all undergrad chapters should be banned"? And why would you think that people on this board would agree with that? We're here to discuss Greek life and its betterment and its advantages--do you really think the regulars here would agree? Que pendeja!

[KayDeeCareBear]

Carnation, I actually think she has a valid question. I think she's just trying to find some stuff out. So, here's my opinion:

A dog bites someone. Should dogs be made illegal?

A little boy falls off a swing on a playground. Should swings be made illegal?

There is a car accident, and a few people are seriously hurt. Should cars be made illegal?

There is an isolated incident of hazing on a campus, and someone is hurt. Should GLO's be made illegal?

See, People In General - (whom I affectionately refer to as PIGs) like to take isolated incidents such as hazing, and instead of trying to make the situation better, they just do away with it so they won't have to deal with it... or, they look for something to blame. A few crazy college students that are affiliated with a sorority or fraternity do something wrong, and the public eye turns to their Greek Organization. People make a big deal (out of nothing is some cases) and innocent Greeks suffer for it. So, anyway, that's my opinion.

[bigdu]

i'm not a man of many words so i'll sum it up like this, trebleclef are ya ill???

[Rain Man]

Originally posted by carnation:
Trebleclef, I don't know if you're trying to start something but why would you think that undergrad Greek members would say, "Yeah, because of the stupidity of some far-off chapter that has no relation to mine, I think all undergrad chapters should be banned"? And why would you think that people on this board would agree with that? We're here to discuss Greek life and its betterment and its advantages--do you really think the regulars here would agree? Que pendeja!

Whoa, now hold on there, Carnation. To some extent, that HAS been discussed, although it has been primarily with certain NPHC organizations who are tired of being bombarded with hazing incidents and lawsuits that has affected their org. While I do not agree with such actions--IMHO it's tantamount to treating a skinned elbow by amputation, based on what I heard, it has been proposed as a last ditch effort to keep the organization afloat and to prevent bankruptcy from all the numerous lawsuits.

While I see where you are coming from, Carnation, I do not think trebleclef is trying to start something negative either.

RM

[SSS1365]

You can't get rid of them all just because some of them have gone too far with hazing, etc. I know that my chapter does not haze, and I'm sure there are many others that do not haze. On my campus, they're VERY strict about hazing. If a you're caught, you may lose school recognition (depending on what it is and how bad it is) and you will be reported to your national organization. I just really think it should be handled on an individual basis.

[Tom Earp]

SSS1--- sorry cant remember all of that without writing down!
the few hurt the many! Bad news if airwaved good news is relegated to the back if shown!
I shall call them do rightous ( ACLU) have screwed up this country more than people know! YOU HAVE TO BE PC OR YOU WILL BE SUED!!!!!!
Because of some indescretions of STUPIDITY AND MORONIC DUMBNES it makes all of look bad!
LXA has an annual food drive that gives more food to the needy than anyother Organization except the US Postoffice! We also have a hot tub a thon that gives money to the Ron Mc D house! We are not the lonley ones as all or most of the Greek Orgs, do the same!
Do You hear of that A resounding NO NO NO!

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Tom Earp LX Z#1
Pittsburg State U. (Kansas)