meanies

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

When will these girls stop being stupid bitches so the sorority chapters who are NOT like this can stop being looked down on?

Chances are, the culprit who posted the pig picture was a "stupid bitch" before she became Greek and I doubt one article will make her change her ways.

I'm not condoning her actions -- just pointing out that it's unfair to assume that being in a sorority makes you behave that way.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by banditone

No need to be THAT pc. If a stupid bitch is a stupid bitch, then there is nothing wrong with calling a stupid bitch that.

Well, it's probably unnecessary. Sure sometimes we all get mad and say stuff, and I’m sure I’ve said similar things or worse. But I like to think, and maybe I’m deluding myself, that if I were complaining about how other people represented greek life, I might try to do it in, um, more refined language.

All we know about the situation in question is that at least one person made a mean poster, and that at least one person didn’t like how the girls were lined up for a video.

We can read into it all the middle school motivation that we want, and certainly the pig poster makes you wonder, but considering image during recruitment, which like it or not, is a pretty image driven process in a lot of cases, in the form of thinking through how to line up for the video might not make a whole group of girls “stupid bitches.”

Is appearance alone how I think decisions should be made? No. Are appearance and reputation big factors in recruitment? yeah.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

Well, it's probably unnecessary. Sure sometimes we all get mad and say stuff, and I’m sure I’ve said similar things or worse. But I like to think, and maybe I’m deluding myself, that if I were complaining about how other people represented greek life, I might try to do it in, um, more refined language.

All we know about the situation in question is that at least one person made a mean poster, and that at least one person didn’t like how the girls were lined up for a video.

We can read into it all the middle school motivation that we want, and certainly the pig poster makes you wonder, but considering image during recruitment, which like it or not, is a pretty image driven process in a lot of cases, in the form of thinking through how to line up for the video might not make a whole group of girls “stupid bitches.”

Is appearance alone how I think decisions should be made? No. Are appearance and reputation big factors in recruitment? yeah.

I really don't think anyone called that entire chapter "stupid bitches" it was people who do things "like this."

Someone who goes out of their way to make a malicious poster does not do so in a vacuum. Other girls knew and/or participated.

[ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

Well, it's probably unnecessary. Sure sometimes we all get mad and say stuff, and I’m sure I’ve said similar things or worse. But I like to think, and maybe I’m deluding myself, that if I were complaining about how other people represented greek life, I might try to do it in, um, more refined language.

All we know about the situation in question is that at least one person made a mean poster, and that at least one person didn’t like how the girls were lined up for a video.

We can read into it all the middle school motivation that we want, and certainly the pig poster makes you wonder, but considering image during recruitment, which like it or not, is a pretty image driven process in a lot of cases, in the form of thinking through how to line up for the video might not make a whole group of girls “stupid bitches.”

Is appearance alone how I think decisions should be made? No. Are appearance and reputation big factors in recruitment? yeah.

Personally I keep it clean so I can keep my letters in my signature...but seriously I think it's deserved. It's not fair to call the entire chapter that at all, but someone (I bet it wasn't just ONE person, either) put up that poster...and they deserve the title.

Like I said, I don't agree with hurting people's feelings for a recruitment video, but I've seen people intentionally left out of pictures or recruitment...at least they were included...and we also don't know the whole story on that one. I don't think that's something to pass judgement on yet.

But the poster? Yes I pass judgement and no, there's no excuse, whether or not we have the whole story.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

I really don't think anyone called that entire chapter "stupid bitches" it was people who do things "like this."

Someone who goes out of their way to make a malicious poster does not do so in a vacuum. Other girls knew and/or participated.

You are probably right, but while the sorority may have provided the poster-making mean ones with a victim, it probably wasn't the cause of their behavior.

I wonder how it was handled internally.

I never defended the poster. It was a cruel thing to do.

[James]

It seems like a group of girls just didn't like this one girl.

I have seen heavy girls in "hot" sororities that were loved, and thin attractive girls that were despised.

It sounds she may have a personality that turns people off. It also sounds like she is high strung and super-sensitive.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

You are probably right, but while the sorority may have provided the poster-making mean ones with a victim, it probably wasn't the cause of their behavior.

I wonder how it was handled internally.

I never defended the poster. It was a cruel thing to do.

Again, no one said that they were stupid bitches because they were in a sorority. Just that they make sororities on the whole look bad. Even if the video line up was not a big deal, it clearly hurt some feelings. See my other posts for my thoughts on the actual topic.

Girls who intentionally hurt others girls (their sisters!) like this deserve the title.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by James

It seems like a group of girls just didn't like this one girl.

I have seen heavy girls in "hot" sororities that were loved, and thin attractive girls that were despised.

It sounds she may have a personality that turns people off. It also sounds like she is high strung and super-sensitive.

I agree.

Originally Posted by James

It seems like a group of girls just didn't like this one girl.

I have seen heavy girls in "hot" sororities that were loved, and thin attractive girls that were despised.

It sounds she may have a personality that turns people off. It also sounds like she is high strung and super-sensitive.

I agree.

At the same time, if someone called me fat or thought I was fat, the folks at the campus newspaper would be the LAST people I would tell.

For all we know Ms. Sullivan might be someone with a shitty attitude who uses her body type to scream discrimination.

It's a she said/she said situation and I can't believe someone thought it was newsworthy to publish an article about an internal catfight between members.

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

We can read into it all the middle school motivation that we want, and certainly the pig poster makes you wonder, but considering image during recruitment, which like it or not, is a pretty image driven process in a lot of cases, in the form of thinking through how to line up for the video might not make a whole group of girls “stupid bitches.”

Is appearance alone how I think decisions should be made? No. Are appearance and reputation big factors in recruitment? yeah.

Speak for your own campus. My chapter, as well as another on campus, are pretty diverse when it comes to looks (whether it be weight or other things) and we've had no problems recruiting. There were times that one or the other didn't get as high of numbers, but it was a year by year basis. Hit or miss.

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Again, no one said that they were stupid bitches because they were in a sorority. Just that they make sororities on the whole look bad. Even if the video line up was not a big deal, it clearly hurt some feelings. See my other posts for my thoughts on the actual topic.

Girls who intentionally hurt others girls (their sisters!) like this deserve the title.

Bahhhh thank you! Girls, individually, who think like this. Not whole chapter. That video lineup may have been a good move, had the girls not found out about it. But still, it really sucks that girls have to feel this way, especially since these days there is not one girl who doesn't have some kind of insecurity. Like, how would that particular girl had a big nose. And then some girl during voting says "I don't want this girl. She has a big nose. Ew."

And hence I agree... Girls who intentionally hurt other girls like this deserve the title.

[afboiler]

I went to Purdue and lived right across the street from Alpha Chi Omega....I think most houses at Purdue due the line up thing for Rush (or whatever it is called now) I know my house did....we put the perky girls up front and every year it seemed like someone was upset about where they were in the line....but in the end it never became a big deal.. lets be honest there is no way that 80 girls living in a house together will all be best friends.....however they can treat each other with respect..and putting a picture of a pig on someone door and saying she gained weight is not respectful in any way. Karma is a bitch and whoever did it will get there's one day.

[UGAalum94]

PM Mama,

Are you saying that image did not figure into recruitment at your school at all? If you have more than one chapter, I'm having a hard time believing that's true.

I'm not saying that at every campus groups worry about image so much that they place girls in recruitment line ups a certain way, but if somehow, on your campus, no PNM made a decision about a group and no chapters made decisions about PNM based on image, then you all are way above the average greek system, and I'd like to know how you did it. How did you all structure recruitment to allow you to get to authentically know each and every PNM and for each PNM to know each member of each chapter?


I agree that groups don't have to buy in to the image game when they plan for recruitment, and the video line-up in this story may have been unusually harsh. But a campus on which image matters not at all seems a little too good to be true.


Girls who intentionally hurt other girls like this probably do deserve the title, but calling them that doesn't reflect better on you. If you're complaining about how other people affect your image, then think about what you are projecting when you use this language. Do you look better having called someone a "stupid bitch"?

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

PM Mama,

Are you saying that image did not figure into recruitment at your school at all? If you have more than one chapter, I'm having a hard time believing that's true.

I'm not saying that at every campus groups worry about image so much that they place girls in recruitment line ups a certain way, but if somehow, on your campus, no PNM made a decision about a group and no chapters made decisions about PNM based on image, then you all are way above the average greek system, and I'd like to know how you did it. How did you all structure recruitment to allow you to get to authentically know each and every PNM and for each PNM to know each member of each chapter?


I agree that groups don't have to buy in to the image game when they plan for recruitment, and the video line-up in this story may have been unusually harsh. But a campus on which image matters not at all seems a little too good to be true.


Girls who intentionally hurt other girls like this probably do deserve the title, but calling them that doesn't reflect better on you. If you're complaining about how other people affect your image, then think about what you are projecting when you use this language. Do you look better having called someone a "stupid bitch"?

I've already said that the two sororities on my campus that have no trouble recruiting have very diverse images. We both had plus size girls, skinny girls, girls who put a lot of work into their images, girls who went to school in sweats (commuter campus... yes it happens). I'm proud to say that my chapter cared more about whether a girl would fit in in terms of personality, rather than if a girl was skinny or the "ideal sorority girl". Now whether individual sisters felt strongly about image, I'm not sure because no one really ever mentioned it outloud during recruitment. Our groupings, or "line-ups", were based on personality and how outgoing a girl was.

Keep in mind that commuter campuses with smaller Greek systems have the advantage of actually (somewhat) getting to know potential members. Panhel has activities during the summer where the presidents and membership heads get to meet PNMs. We had a Greek open house the first or second week of the semester. And then there was formal recruitment. A good quota on our campus was between 10-15. So yes it was easy to get to know the girls without solely judging them on image. I think it's a shame that other chapters don't get this opportunity.

And as for caring how I look when calling out a "stupid bitch"... I don't. Those are the girls who feed into the sorority stereotype and I don't think it's fair to us girls who were/are there for the sisterhood.

[UGAalum94]

I don't think that everyone concerned at all with image is a "Stepford" group. I think many groups play up the diversity of members, even if it's just superficial diversity.

At really big schools, with large groups, a large number of groups, and a large number of PNM, unfortunately not everyone can make a decision based on deep evaluation of character. (I say that sincerely. It's a shame that people don't really get to know potential sisters better before they decide which ones get bids.)

Groups and PNM have to decide to put their best foot forward in the limited time they've got, but I agree that they shouldn't put sisterhood second to do it.

[RU OX Alum]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

Yep, someone in that group was mean to do that pig poster thing, for sure.

On the other hand, who would you put in the front of the group for the video that isn't going to hurt someone's feelings?

I'd probably put the people most involved with campus activities so they'd be recognized and the officers of the group, but I'm not sure that putting the most visually pleasing people in the entirely visual presentation is exactly cruelty to the rest of the group.

Unless the Officers are otherwise actively involved in campus I don't think they should be in front. Just because someone is a good leader/president/officer/whatever doesn't mean that person should automatically be the spokesperson. Most people who bear the title President couldn't give a speach if their life depended on it, yet they never seem to shut up.

On the other hand, people who are very active in campus probably shouldn't be officers.