Helicopters, Snowplows and Recruitment

[Theta1234]

So, there has been a lot of discussion (and funny stories) regarding snowplow parents. However, the REAL question for here is “what is too much?” regarding parental involvement before/during recruitment.

I struggled with this during my daughter’s recruitment. I mean, in our hearts we all want our Lil’ Poundcake to find their “home.” However, some of us Southern Mommas know that just filling out the online Panhellenic form and submitting the required single picture (no recs, no social resume, etc.) won’t get that Lil’ Poundcake too far...

So, what say you? When do parents cross the line into helicopter or snowplow territory?

[carnation]

That mom in the tree at Ole Miss comes to mind.

[Xidelt]

When they get a hotel room in town to help Dumplin' through recruitment.

[DGTess]

IMHO, they go too far when they push snowflake into *any* action the student would not take for herself.

When they obtain recs, vice pointing daughter to the resource; when they complete paperwork prior to rush; when they keep track of every detail of daughter's rush week ... When they *do* instead of *advise*

This is *daughter's* life, not mom's.

ETA: I'm not a southerner. I knew my life would not end if I didn't go greek. I knew daughter's would not end if she chose not to involve herself in a Greek system (UTexas) that does not fit her personality at all.

[APhi2KD]

Originally Posted by DGTess

IMHO, they go too far when they push snowflake into *any* action the student would not take for herself.

When they obtain recs, vice pointing daughter to the resource; when they complete paperwork prior to rush; when they keep track of every detail of daughter's rush week ... When they *do* instead of *advise*

This is *daughter's* life, not mom's.

ETA: I'm not a southerner. I knew my life would not end if I didn't go greek. I knew daughter's would not end if she chose not to involve herself in a Greek system (UTexas) that does not fit her personality at all.

I disagree. Moms in trees aside, sorority recruitment is one instance where normal rules don’t apply. There are an insane number of subtle dos and don’ts that the uninformed are unaware of. And if (in many cases) your daughter has ONE good shot at this stressful process, the more guidance you can provide, the better.

It’s not like it was in my day where I walked in completely naive and had my happy ending. Will your baby survive regardless of the outcome? Yes. But we all know it’s an emotionally-charged and painful process for both parents and daughters, so why not help your kiddo even the field as much as possible?

[DGTess]

Originally Posted by APhi2KD

I disagree. Moms in trees aside, sorority recruitment is one instance where normal rules don’t apply. There are an insane number of subtle dos and don’ts that the uninformed are unaware of. And if (in many cases) your daughter has ONE good shot at this stressful process, the more guidance you can provide, the better.

It’s not like it was in my day where I walked in completely naive and had my happy ending. Will your baby survive regardless of the outcome? Yes. But we all know it’s an emotionally-charged and painful process for both parents and daughters, so why not help your kiddo even the field as much as possible?

I guess we will have to disagree. Your line of thinking seems to be predicated on "it's better to be Greek than not". Please correct me if I'm wrong. From that line, I understand. But I don't believe Greek life is for everyone, not even our daughters. From my perspective, only she gets to play.

But I also recognize I would not go Greek today, with the structure and (what I consider) BS of the system. Even at my chapter, which has changed from the 20-25 women of my time into a structured, rules-bound, 100-member group.

[APhi2KD]

Originally Posted by DGTess

Your line of thinking seems to be predicated on "it's better to be Greek than not". Please correct me if I'm wrong.

I never stated Greek was better. But we’re discussing how deeply parents get involved in the recruitment process, so I naturally assumed the default was a daughter who wished to enter Greek life. Did I miss something?

[Theta1234]

Ok, here’s some more food for fodder. At incredibly competitive Southern schools—and some in the Midwest and on the coasts as well, it’s well, competitive.

The reality is all of those 1,500 plus girls going through are probably very similar—highly accomplished, smart, etc. Some moms text their friends to make sure their daughters know about lil’ Poundcake (man, I’m loving this name) coming through and asks them to make sure the PNM gets a nice welcome—aka, pass her name and pictures around to your friends to help increase recognition. Some moms will bypass their friends and directly text the daughters. Heli, snowplow or acceptable?

When it comes to recs, do you have your whole crew write recs and letters of support or do you just go with one—or perhaps two for good measure? Is it the person who know lil’ Poundcake the most or the person who has the greatest title/most influence in the group?

Where are the lines? Is the line that this is initiated by the parents and not the girls? What if the PNM asks mom for help?

On the flip side, I’ve also seen it where a chapter really likes a girl and they assume she likes them, but she hasn’t really said the words, so an advisor will call the rec writer who will call the mom and have her call her daughter to “coach” her on what to say during the next round to let the girls know that she really wants to be an XYZ. This may just be a Southern thing, but recruitment is so much more than filling out a form and showing up to recruitment week with a big smile and a stunning personality. Honestly, I’m not sure I could have survived the current recruitment culture. My “poor” momma went to a small liberal arts school in the Midwest that did not have Greek life. Much of it just boggles her mind, but she does love hearing a good story so she loves us to talk
about it...

[VioletsAreBlue]

How do people define guidance? I think that's the real question.

Honestly, there are plenty of scenarios where the normal rules don't apply. That's life and life is not fair. Sorority recruitment isn't an exception to anything. We're watching what happens - in real time - when people think they are exceptions and when they think their kids are exceptions. And look at what's happened.

I'd suggest that moms need to take a collective step back and then a collective deep breath. Support your child. Give advice. Give guidance. But that's a big step away from getting involved in what the student is supposed to be doing themselves.

And - I say this out of curiosity - what has made the process as intense as it is now? I'd argue that the alumnae and parents have played a role in that. I get that won't be a popular opinion. But there are colleges and universities across the country that don't have moms hanging in trees, and their greek systems are thriving, their chapters are growing, and their nationals are quite happy with their performance.

I've always wondered what would happen if one year at Ole Miss or Bama - for example - the moms and alumnae would take a back seat and let recruitment and membership selection be run 100% by the collegiate membership. I truly believe that some people think it would be an absolute disaster. But honestly, if we are trusting that these women are representatives of the ideals of our sorority, if we trust them to hold leadership positions within our organizations, if we trust them to wear our letters - why don't we trust them to select their own sisterhood? Why don't we trust our own daughters who we've raised into capable adult young women, to manage their recruitment experience?

So yes, I'd say offer guidance, and support for your daughter. But after that - step out of it. I often hear people say that they don't think they'd survive rush if they went through it now. Of course you would survive. Your outcome might have been different, which is kind of bizarre to consider that you might have found yourself in different letters, but you would survive. I actually think the girl that goes in blind and naive might actually have a better experience than the girl who goes in with mom pulling strings and working connections every step of the way because, intentional or not, that level of involvement also sets a stage full of pressure and expectations.

Poundcake, Snowflake and Dumpling are much more capable than people give them credit for. College is the environment where they can try new things, make mistakes, fall on their butts, explore who they are, change who they are and spread those wings. And that includes sorority recruitment.

[DGTess]

Originally Posted by VioletsAreBlue

How do people define guidance? I think that's the real question.

Honestly, there are plenty of scenarios where the normal rules don't apply. That's life and life is not fair. Sorority recruitment isn't an exception to anything. We're watching what happens - in real time - when people think they are exceptions and when they think their kids are exceptions. And look at what's happened.

I'd suggest that moms need to take a collective step back and then a collective deep breath. Support your child. Give advice. Give guidance. But that's a big step away from getting involved in what the student is supposed to be doing themselves.

And - I say this out of curiosity - what has made the process as intense as it is now? I'd argue that the alumnae and parents have played a role in that. I get that won't be a popular opinion. But there are colleges and universities across the country that don't have moms hanging in trees, and their greek systems are thriving, their chapters are growing, and their nationals are quite happy with their performance.

I've always wondered what would happen if one year at Ole Miss or Bama - for example - the moms and alumnae would take a back seat and let recruitment and membership selection be run 100% by the collegiate membership. I truly believe that some people think it would be an absolute disaster. But honestly, if we are trusting that these women are representatives of the ideals of our sorority, if we trust them to hold leadership positions within our organizations, if we trust them to wear our letters - why don't we trust them to select their own sisterhood? Why don't we trust our own daughters who we've raised into capable adult young women, to manage their recruitment experience?

So yes, I'd say offer guidance, and support for your daughter. But after that - step out of it. I often hear people say that they don't think they'd survive rush if they went through it now. Of course you would survive. Your outcome might have been different, which is kind of bizarre to consider that you might have found yourself in different letters, but you would survive. I actually think the girl that goes in blind and naive might actually have a better experience than the girl who goes in with mom pulling strings and working connections every step of the way because, intentional or not, that level of involvement also sets a stage full of pressure and expectations.

Poundcake, Snowflake and Dumpling are much more capable than people give them credit for. College is the environment where they can try new things, make mistakes, fall on their butts, explore who they are, change who they are and spread those wings. And that includes sorority recruitment.

Hear, hear!!!!!!!!!

[33girl]

Originally Posted by VioletsAreBlue

I've always wondered what would happen if one year at Ole Miss or Bama - for example - the moms and alumnae would take a back seat and let recruitment and membership selection be run 100% by the collegiate membership. I truly believe that some people think it would be an absolute disaster. But honestly, if we are trusting that these women are representatives of the ideals of our sorority, if we trust them to hold leadership positions within our organizations, if we trust them to wear our letters - why don't we trust them to select their own sisterhood? Why don't we trust our own daughters who we've raised into capable adult young women, to manage their recruitment experience?

I’m sure that part of the reluctance to do this is the fact that many of these chapters (not the sorority as a national entity, the CHAPTER) have assets equivalent to that of multimillion dollar corporations.

[APhi2KD]

Originally Posted by 33girl

I’m sure that part of the reluctance to do this is the fact that many of these chapters (not the sorority as a national entity, the CHAPTER) have assets equivalent to that of multimillion dollar corporations.

Truth.

Another thought— many of the women sticking their fingers in these chapters’ pies do so merely to feed their own worth. Sticking it to someone else’s pumpkin is the ultimate form of revenge, no?

[Cheerio]

Originally Posted by VioletsAreBlue

I've always wondered what would happen if one year at Ole Miss or Bama - for example - the moms and alumnae would take a back seat and let recruitment and membership selection be run 100% by the collegiate membership. I truly believe that some people think it would be an absolute disaster. But honestly, if we are trusting that these women are representatives of the ideals of our sorority, if we trust them to hold leadership positions within our organizations, if we trust them to wear our letters - why don't we trust them to select their own sisterhood? Why don't we trust our own daughters who we've raised into capable adult young women, to manage their recruitment experience?

This may come under the heading "Too Many Questions", but here goes...

Do alums in sororities not trust their collegiate members based on the (possible) fact alums don't see newer members as "worthy" or "up to the standard" they themselves fit as pledges thirty years ago?

Would modern sorority chapters prefer to make it their business to "mold" their new members into "better" representatives of womanhood, and no longer accept any new member "just as she is"?

And would that brand of "molding" be the type of sorority experience current college students desire?

Are there truly young students today who believe that when joining a sorority, the sorority should "mold" your behavior and make you a "better" "more popular" or "more desirable" person for the rest of your life just because of your particular greek letter affiliation?

Has it become fashionable to join a sorority simply to be more beloved/accepted by/popular/cool with other human beings?

Or are current college women lacking the means to create their own identity, and need their sorority to give them one because Mommy and Daddy are no longer there to give them one?

[AnchorAlumna]

Originally Posted by Cheerio

Do alums in sororities not trust their collegiate members based on the (possible) fact alums don't see newer members as "worthy" or "up to the standard" they themselves fit as pledges thirty years ago?

Sending a rec does NOT mean that I don't trust our collegiate members.
It means that I have insight into a PNM's personality and character that they won't have just from reading a resume or talking to her for 3 minutes.
I'm giving them the info to do with what they will. It might be a warning ("take this girl and nobody from my town will pledge ABC sorority in this century") or it might be a cheer ("Sweet, fabulous girl! A loyal friend and compassionate leader!").
Who they extend a bid to is still up to them.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by VioletsAreBlue

Poundcake, Snowflake and Dumpling are much more capable than people give them credit for. College is the environment where they can try new things, make mistakes, fall on their butts, explore who they are, change who they are and spread those wings. And that includes sorority recruitment.

But part of the problem is, the majority of these large rushes occur before Snowflake is truly even a college student - she’s bound to a sorority before she’s even had one minute of class time. She hasn’t had a chance to try or change or explore. The first thing she is doing in college is trying to impress a thousand women and pray that she lands somewhere that makes her happy and that is socially acceptable. That’s a lot to expect an 18 year old to get through unassisted, especially one who may not be naturally fearless and gregarious.