Toast Song

lurker · #1 01-03-2005, 02:30 AM

So changing the Toast Song again did not happen at the 2004 National Convention. What are everyones feelings on this? Had it made it out of committee, the delegates from my chapter would have voted to change it (we're a predominantly female chapter, and we already sing "true to alpha phi omega" as opposed to "men of alpha phi omega." Do you forsee this ever changing?

We also sing "brothers clasp the hands of SISTERS" as opposed to brothers. It's odd for all of the girls in our chapter to refer to ourselves as brothers. What's everyones thoughts on this?

This board is too dead! Theres nothing like controversy to spice things up!

YILFS and APO luv
ashley

GoldnBlue2004 · #2 01-03-2005, 02:49 AM

Personally, I don't feel that there is a need to change our toast song. We should stick with only one version of the toast song. I mean we recognize that this is a coed organization, but this is also a fraternity meaning that this is a BROTHERHOOD. If members wanted to sing sisters or call each other soror or sister then they should have respectfully joined a sorority. If your chapter is dominated by more females than males then deal with it. When things are changed it only becomes confusing for others to adapt to. Let the toast song be and let it remain.

Senusret I · #3 01-03-2005, 07:27 AM

I really hope people realize once and for all that the Brothers on the whole don't want the song to change.

And, as I say every two years, I don't see why some musically inclined soul doesn't decide to write some additional fraternity songs....

CasanovaAPQ · #4 01-03-2005, 03:02 PM

it would make more sense to write another song reflecting the whole co-ed thing than to change the toast song. I do not agree with changing the toast song and will never agree nor sing the toast song any other way. Alpha phi Omega has lost so many traditions so let just keep the one we have.

GoldnBlue2004 · #5 01-03-2005, 04:48 PM

I agree with my brothers on this one. We have lost so much tradition in our beloved fraternity. Let the toast song remain as it is. As far as other songs, I cannot assist with that one, but I can come up with a few chants.

D-E-L-T-A P-H-I..............
First chapter at an HBCU
Known as Delta Phi

We stand loyal and we stand true.......
Holding our head high to the gold and blue......

D-E-L-T-A P-H-I.........
First chapter at an HBCU
Know as Delta Phi

SagnastyChic · #6 01-03-2005, 07:34 PM

From the female prespective....

Although there are men in teh frat I am in (zeta phi) , we are still predominately female, and personally, I DO NOT think the toast song shoul dbe changed. Let me put you up on game...

That toast song is apart of the rich legacy of our frat, and to up and change it in my eyes is sort of disrespectful. Here's my suggestion to you---since you guys are predominately female, write some songs for your chapter that acknowledge the strong presence of female and at the same time revels in the legacy of brotherhood that our frat so greatly admires. I know with the chapter of Zeta Phi, we have made many song significant to our chapter...from the olds heads who songs sounded like doo wop, to the new flava we currently have our pledges sing.

Now there is one thing you should always remember, you joined this fraternity with full knowledge that there are no 'sisters' in this frat and no woman is acknowledge that way here.

My advice to you is to look at the toast song as though one looks at the bible. Yeah, everything is refered to in the male since, but it represent all of mankind, since woMAN came from MAN. You're still represent whether it says man or person. just look at teh song objectively instead of subjectively.

Good luck

33girl · #7 01-03-2005, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SagnastyChic
From the female prespective....

Although there are men in teh frat I am in (zeta phi) , we are still predominately female, and personally, I DO NOT think the toast song shoul dbe changed. Let me put you up on game...

That toast song is apart of the rich legacy of our frat, and to up and change it in my eyes is sort of disrespectful. Here's my suggestion to you---since you guys are predominately female, write some songs for your chapter that acknowledge the strong presence of female and at the same time revels in the legacy of brotherhood that our frat so greatly admires. I know with the chapter of Zeta Phi, we have made many song significant to our chapter...from the olds heads who songs sounded like doo wop, to the new flava we currently have our pledges sing.

Now there is one thing you should always remember, you joined this fraternity with full knowledge that there are no 'sisters' in this frat and no woman is acknowledge that way here.

My advice to you is to look at the toast song as though one looks at the bible. Yeah, everything is refered to in the male since, but it represent all of mankind, since woMAN came from MAN. You're still represent whether it says man or person. just look at teh song objectively instead of subjectively.

Good luck

Amen. I'll go so far as if to say that if you think the toast song should be changed because you find the wording offensive, you should probably resign from APO.

X-orcist · #8 01-03-2005, 11:13 PM

I'm gonna have to agree. Delta Phi is now predominately all females and would hate to see the toast song changed. I knew coming into this organization that is was a fraternity based on brotherhood and that's what I love about it. Women are able to enter into this frat and be on the same level as a man. So why change a song that holds so much history and dignity of this great fraternity.

Just because we are females and we are called 'brothers' doesn't make us inferior it makes us unique. Be true to yourself and think about why you chose this service FRATERNITY.

naraht · #9 01-03-2005, 11:17 PM

I can remember losing a member of an interest group over the issue.

Randy

SexySuperstar · #10 01-04-2005, 01:28 AM

I never think that the toast song should be changed but I will admit that at Epsilon Mu(UMD- College Park) we added a verse.

Sing we now both men and women, brothers all are we
Hearts as one, we praise together our diversity
Ever growing, ever learning, so that we may be
Joined in Alpha Phi Omega, for eternity.

We never chaneged the fact that we are all brothers. We just expanded on the fact that we're all brothers(not matter what the sex of the person is).

Attractive#7 · #11 01-03-2007, 06:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SexySuperstar

I never think that the toast song should be changed but I will admit that at Epsilon Mu(UMD- College Park) we added a verse.

Sing we now both men and women, brothers all are we
Hearts as one, we praise together our diversity
Ever growing, ever learning, so that we may be
Joined in Alpha Phi Omega, for eternity.

We never chaneged the fact that we are all brothers. We just expanded on the fact that we're all brothers(not matter what the sex of the person is).

I think this is beautiful and would be a beautiful addition as a 3rd verse of our beloved Toast Song. I do not want the 1st 2 verses of the Toast Song to change. I love the song as is. I do think adding a 3rd verse would be a neat idea. By the way, we haven't always had this song, nor 2 verses to it. From our national website:

1. The lyrics to the first verse of this song were created in 1931 by Dale Bartlett of Iota chapter at Park College. The second verse was written by Robert Northwood of Epsilon Mu at the University of Maryland and were adopted as part of the Toast Song at the National Convention in 1964. http://www.apo.org/pages/show/About_...ons/Toast_Song

naraht · #12 01-04-2005, 01:48 AM

Unofficial Third Verse)
Back your girl into a corner,
Turn the lights down low.
Place one hand upon her bosom,
The other down below.
When she starts to shake and shiver,
Tell her so she'll know--
That's the secret handshake of
The men of A-Phi-O.

(Unofficial Fourth Verse, in retaliation by the female brothers to the Third Verse)
Lead your guy on to the dance floor
Press your bodies tight
Tell him what he wants to hear
That he'll get some tonight
Let him walk you to your doorstep
Let him think you're cheap
Then send him home in agony
Where he can BEAT HIS MEAT

lurker · #13 01-04-2005, 02:23 AM

OK, obviously I'm in the minority here. But I do have a few things to point out.

1. Saying that I should resign from APO because I feel the toast song is outdated (not that I'm saying its bad, but had the toast song been written AFTER the fraternity turned coed, the words would surely be different) is flat out rude. Anyone who would do that is obviously not in APO for the right reasons.

2. I find that adding unofficial verses (especially lewd ones) is a lot more disrespectful than simply changing a couple words.

3. I'm obviously from a more liberal region than most. I'm not disrespecting the organization. Every single person in my chapter agrees that it should change.

4. Just because things change or should change does not mean they were bad in the first place. Simply outdated.

5. If the words were already "true to alpha phi omega" you would have nothing to complain about. Why specify "men" if not necessary (and yes I understand the whole men meaning people standpoint, but why even raise the question?)

The quasi-rude posts really aren't necessary. Just because i have a different viewpoint doesn't mean you need to jump on my back.

DeltaPyrite · #14 09-12-2006, 11:53 AM

Just found this forum and I guess I'm going to stir up this pot that's been dead for two years. Just because there are some issues in this thread that I can't leave untouched.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lurker

2. I find that adding unofficial verses (especially lewd ones) is a lot more disrespectful than simply changing a couple words.

Big fat word. I can't believe people in this thread are getting riled up about altering two or three words in the toast song to reflect the fact that we include women (and have for thirty years!), but no one aside from lurker was offended by those two crass verses naraht posted that demean our fraternity, our women, and our men. Disgusting.

Quote:

Alsom going back to the words that you all sing in your chapter (since you all are female) is disrespectful to my beloved organization.

I don't see how an all-inclusive version of the song that reflects the growth of the fraternity is disrespectful to it. To the women and men who sing the gender-inclusive version of the song APO is their beloved organization. It is not just yours, it is all of ours.

Quote:

I felt sick when I traveled to another section and heard them sing, "Friends of Alpha Phi Omega... " I kindly stepped back and asked what new fraternity did I enter, but I forgot some things are done quite DIFFERENTLY in other places.

I guess it's all perspective, because I felt sick when I went to Co-Sectionals and saw a group of mostly women singing the words "Men of Alpha Phi Omega." I guess I forgot some things are done quite differently in other places...

Quote:

Yes change is good and is needed in any org to survive and grow but to lose history or to totally forget our proud history is bad which has happened to APO in the last 30 years.

I find it totally disgusting that you attribute the loss of our history only back to the moment women were admitted to the fraternity. Furnish some proof that there were no members who didn't know our founding date, didn't know how the shield was made, etc. until 30 years ago and then I'll start to take you seriously... until then, you seem to be just a guy who's really bitter that there are women in his fraternity, and you need to Deal. With. It.

Quote:

In some ways its humorous in that people like Jesse Bridges feel that the requirement that all chapters (especially to him, the HBCUs) activate/reactivate co-ed in his mind has already pushed us to being a Frarority.

This brought up a totally logistical question that maybe someone can answer for me, just because I'm really curious.
If an initiated female member of APO transfers to a school that has a male-only chapter, would she be allowed to affiliate into that chapter? Obviously nationals allows chapters who have been male-only to remain that way for new members, but can they, under the national bylaws, deny membership to an initiated brother who has transferred to their school?

33girl · #15 09-12-2006, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeltaPyrite

Big fat word. I can't believe people in this thread are getting riled up about altering two or three words in the toast song to reflect the fact that we include women (and have for thirty years!), but no one aside from lurker was offended by those two crass verses naraht posted that demean our fraternity, our women, and our men. Disgusting.

The difference is those "two or three words" are two or three VERY IMPORTANT words.

Every fraternity and sorority I've ever come in contact with has "unofficial" songs - the one naraht quoted is one I've heard numerous groups use, so it certainly isn't an "APO song." It's nothing to get offended over, unless of course you're PC to the gazillionth power.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeltaPyrite

To the women and men who sing the gender-inclusive version of the song APO is their beloved organization. It is not just yours, it is all of ours.

So if we DON'T sing or approve of the altered version, it's NOT our beloved organization?

What the??

I'm linking this thread, because it sums up what I want to say when people get hung up about all this "gender" business.

http://www.greekchat.com/gcforums/sh...ad.php?t=48391