How Moms Should Treat Their Legacy Daughters - Page 16

FSUZeta · #**226** 07-23-2010, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gusteau

Well I don't thinks it's sinister, but rather a misguided attempt to equalize the playing field.

or give politically correct answers!

i was on another site, which shall remain nameless, and a pnm was asking whether it was necessary to have recs. two posters answered her question with the standard,"it is the responsibility of the sorority to get a rec, for those girls who don't have them and they will have ample opportunity to get them during rush week. This was concerning Auburn and i couldn't help but think that the answerers were either panhellenic officers or recruitment guides spouting the party line.

I posted an answer that the pnm needed to get her own recs.to all the chapters asap.

dgdramadawg · #**227** 07-23-2010, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FSUZeta

I posted an answer that the pnm needed to get her own recs.to all the chapters asap.

A PNM was asking me about recs for UGA yesterday; she had heard conflicting things about whether she needed them or whether the chapters would get them for her. Here's what I told her, and what I think every PNM should be told for an SEC school or similarly competitive recruitment.

Yes. You need recs. And yes. It is the responsibility of the chapter to get them for you. Both are true.
But the fact is that the chapters just do not have the time to get recs for every girl going through recruitment, so getting them in advance ensures that you have them. You can't count on the chapters to get recs for you if there are 1200 girls going through and you are one of a small group of girls who didn't get them ahead of time. It's possible that a chapter would go out of their way to get a rec for you, but you just can't bank on it.

Titchou · #**228** 07-23-2010, 01:23 PM

The core of the problem is that it is up to each group whether or not they require recs. NPC can't mandate that. So, therefore, CPH can't do it either. However, we all know that's not reality in certain places - here in the SEC for sure. These are places where the rules are counter to what happens. In a perfect world, the chapters who require recs would get them on their own. But with up to 1600 PNMs, it just won't work. Heck, I went thru rush in 1963 at Alabama and we (my mother and I) got all my recs that summer. My aunt lived in Tuscaloosa and knew advisers at every chapter so I went down there several times and met them all and it was done. That was 47 years ago! Things have not changed....

BAMA2 · #**229** 07-23-2010, 04:48 PM

Check out Alabama's recruitment website. It has an excellent section on recs. It tells PNMs that they should get them for all 15 sororities. It also explains what they are and what they are not.

As to girls who still need recs for SEC schools (other than Vandy and Ole Miss who have deferred recruitment), it may be almost too late. Most members are heading back in the next week or so to prepare for rush. The last thing many of them are going to want to deal with are last second recs!

honeychile · #**230** 07-23-2010, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Mom

No she was "released" the morning of Pref Day. She was asked back to several houses and kept her options open but was cut.

My heart hurts for you and your daughter. It sounds to me that the other sororities who were interested in her thought it was a "done deal" that she would go ADPi. If she's sincerely interested in Greek Life, I hope she gives it another try and is successful. She's already WAL with a mother like you!

AZ-AlphaXi · #**231** 07-23-2010, 06:05 PM

Interesting statistic from the Auburn recruitment online handbook:

In 2009, 714 of our 1114 potential members were legacies. But, only 220 joined a sorority they are a legacy to. The rest joined other groups or did not join at all. Legacies do not have any particular advantage when it comes to receiving bids.

FleurGirl · #**232** 07-23-2010, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Mom

No she was "released" the morning of Pref Day. She was asked back to several houses and kept her options open but was cut.

I may be way off base, but maybe recieving 20-30 letters of rec kind of put the chapter off... I mean 3, or 4, or even 5 might be reasonable, but if I were reading through 30 recs for one girl, I'd be pretty annoyed, and maybe even think she had some kind of an attitude... regardless of whether or not that's true. Who knows though, it could've been anything. I hope she'll consider re-rushing in the future, and I'm glad to hear she's been doing other things and still having a good college experience.

TSteven · #**233** 07-23-2010, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AZ-AlphaXi

Interesting statistic from the Auburn recruitment online handbook:

In 2009, 714 of our 1114 potential members were legacies. But, only 220 joined a sorority they are a legacy to. The rest joined other groups or did not join at all. Legacies do not have any particular advantage when it comes to receiving bids.

One needs to be careful in interpreting these statistics. All that we really know from the above statistics is that 30.81% of the legacies joined their legacy chapter.

1. It is unknown how many of the legacies that did not join their legacy group were released by the legacy chapter or if they - the PNM - released their legacy chapter.

2. It is unknown how many of the 220 legacies that did join their legacy sorority would not have been extended a bid to any other chapter. In other words, had they not been legacies, they may not have received *any* bid. To be crude about it, being a legacy was the main reason behind their receiving their bid.

3. It is unknown how many of the legacies that joined a different sorority were extend a bid simply because they were a legacy to any sorority. In other words, XYZ chapter might feel that an ABC legacy is better than a PNM that is not a legacy to any group.

4. It is unknown how many in-house legacies were extended a bid to their legacy versus those legacies that were not in-house. As has been noted, not all legacies may be equal, so being in-house might have been an advantage. Or not.

Again, these are all hypothetical, but the bottom line is that we really don't really know how a PNM's legacy effected there recruitment.

So perhaps the likelihood that legacies may not have a particular advantage to receive/accept a bid to their legacy chapter, just being a NPC legacy may still have been an advantage overall. Or not.

Titchou · #**234** 07-23-2010, 07:06 PM

#3: In my 47 years of membership in an NPC GLO I have never heard of such!

Just interested · #**235** 07-23-2010, 07:29 PM

TSteven

Thanks for the headache!

carnation · #**236** 07-23-2010, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AZ-AlphaXi

Interesting statistic from the Auburn recruitment online handbook:In 2009, 714 of our 1114 potential members were legacies. But, only 220 joined a sorority they are a legacy to. The rest joined other groups or did not join at all. Legacies do not have any particular advantage when it comes to receiving bids.

Argghh. A pledge sister's daughter is rushing there this year. Several of us are trying to figure a way to let her know about what AU rush is like these days without hurting her feelings and making her think that we think her daughter's not outstanding. She is outstanding. So are hundreds of others. However, our sister has lived far from AU for many years and doesn't know about the changes. I know what we need to do but selecting the right words is hard.

KSUViolet06 · #**237** 07-23-2010, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnation

Argghh. A pledge sister's daughter is rushing there this year. Several of us are trying to figure a way to let her know about what AU rush is like these days without hurting her feelings and making her think that we think her daughter's not outstanding. She is outstanding. So are hundreds of others. However, our sister has lived far from AU for many years and doesn't know about the changes. I know what we need to do but selecting the right words is hard.

Yeah, there is no nice way to say that. You just have to be honest, in a nice way.

Even if she is slightly offended by it or doesn't believe you, at least she can't say she never heard it could happen (if it happens that she is cut from Pi Phi).

Psi U MC Vito · #**238** 07-23-2010, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TSteven

One needs to be careful in interpreting these statistics. All that we really know from the above statistics is that 30.81% of the legacies joined their legacy chapter.

1. It is unknown how many of the legacies that did not join their legacy group were released by the legacy chapter or if they - the PNM - released their legacy chapter.

2. It is unknown how many of the 220 legacies that did join their legacy sorority would not have been extended a bid to any other chapter. In other words, had they not been legacies, they may not have received *any* bid. To be crude about it, being a legacy was the main reason behind their receiving their bid.

3. It is unknown how many of the legacies that joined a different sorority were extend a bid simply because they were a legacy to any sorority. In other words, XYZ chapter might feel that an ABC legacy is better than a PNM that is not a legacy to any group.

4. It is unknown how many in-house legacies were extended a bid to their legacy versus those legacies that were not in-house. As has been noted, not all legacies may be equal, so being in-house might have been an advantage. Or not.

Again, these are all hypothetical, but the bottom line is that we really don't really know how a PNM's legacy effected there recruitment.

So perhaps the likelihood that legacies may not have a particular advantage to receive/accept a bid to their legacy chapter, just being a NPC legacy may still have been an advantage overall. Or not.

Not to mention there is no mention of PNMs with multiple legacies, which also skews the numbers.

BAMA2 · #**239** 07-23-2010, 08:23 PM

Carnation--

Perhaps you can give her this statistic. The year my daughter went through rush at Alabama (2008) there were over 200 legacies to the chapter she pledged. Obviously, there was no way the chapter could take all the legacies in a pledge class even if they wanted to! I believe around 50 of the legacies actually ended up in her pledge class. This left a lot of unhappy alums but the members were in a no win situation.

TSteven · #**240** 07-23-2010, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou

#3: In my 47 years of membership in an NPC GLO I have never heard of such!

That may be true, but unless you (general you) are at all the other GLOs' membership selection vote, you won't know why or how *they* voted.

Perhaps it is a Southern fraternity thing, but knowing that a rushee is a legacy ("His Daddy is a Bama XYZ while his Momma is an Ole Miss ABC") may carry some weight in membership selection. Whether it is right or wrong, some members may feel that the legacy rushee should understand the responsibilities of what it means to be Greek better - i.e. good grades, financial and time obligations etc. Thus while not being a legacy to the particular fraternity, his legacy status may have a positive influence.

For what it is worth, I have heard of NPC sorority members saying that they love getting other sororities' legacies. Some have said they like legacies in general for the reasons similar to what I wrote above - i.e. "what it means to be Greek". While others have given silly reasons like "We love to steal other chapters' legacies."

Quote:

Originally Posted by Just interested

TSteven

Thanks for the headache!

I am to please.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psi U MC Vito

Not to mention there is no mention of PNMs with multiple legacies, which also skews the numbers.

And this!

Again, the bottom line is just because 30.81 % of the legacies were extended a bid to their legacy chapter, does not mean that the other legacies did not have some sort of advantage over those PNMs who were not legacies. Unless you are at every chapter's membership selection vote, you won't know.