Bush Addresses Urban League

[Love_Spell_6]

Although I'm a lone Bush supporter in many of these forums...he made some very good points in his address to the urban league. Much respect to my prez!!

"Does the Democrat Party take African-American voters for granted? It's a fair question," Bush told the Urban League's annual convention. "I know plenty of politicians assume they have your vote. But did they earn it, and do they deserve it?"

Bush drew applause each time he ticked off one of his questions to the group: "Is it a good thing for the African-American community to be represented mainly by one political party?"

"Have the traditional solutions of the Democrat Party truly served the African-American people?"

"There is an alternative this year," Bush said. "Take a look at my agenda."

Read Rest Below:
http://www.freep.com/news/statewire/...2_20040723.htm

[Little32]

I guess my question would be what have the traditional solutions of the republican done for us? I mean really. Everyone seems to talk a good game, but who has truly delivered?
I read the article, and Bush has some interesting ideas; helping small business owners is an agenda I support. But after his no child left behind act which sounds good on its surface, but which, from what I can tell from talking with other educators, has left a good deal of children behind, I take everything he says with a grain of salt.
Also, the article mentioned that he did not speak abou this opposition of affirmative action. How do you say that you are a friend of the black community when you continue to dismantle programs that intended to help that community, but offer nothing in their place.
I have read your posts in other forums. I acknowledge that you are entitled to your opinion. I did not post mine so that I might be belittled or attacked for it. I we can be civil and respectful, perhaps the discussion can continue.

[Love_Spell_6]

Originally posted by Iconoclastic
Sure many children have been left behind. Why? The standard is in place. If they can't meet those standards, it is up to the school system, parents, and child to get it together. If Blacks would vote Republican, or tell their democratic slavemasters to give them vouchers or say good-bye to your next term, let's see if their child wouldn't get to go to a real school. The issue is not Bush's plan, but the people involved. I know about social promotion. That's a liberal, democratic agenda to promote self-esteem over stupidity. Go to a predominantly Black school and see how our children are acting. I will tell you: like a bunch of fools.

Bush's tax cuts put more money in my pocket than one of Clinton's tax increases. If Bush had his way, our Black women would be having their babies instead of killing them, and tracking down those sorry Black boys who got them pregnant and make them pay child support. It would also make those boys and girls think twice before fornicating. The Dems attitude toward the Black community reminds me of that old Stevie Wonder song, "You Haven't Done Nuthin"

Iconoclastic you bring up some very good points...and so did President Bush in his address to the Urban League...its funny how since he made some very good points..no one really wants to respond or talk about it. Our community is famous for making excuses for our shortcomings and blaming everybody else except ourselves. Its but so much a government policy can do i.e. NO Child left behind..when our families are not taking care of business at home. You want to know why OUR children are being left behind???? (Here comes my Soap Box)

*Because 70% of all black children are born out of wedlock
*Because 62% of black families with children are headed by a single parent
*Because 85% of black children do not live in a home with their fathers
*Because Only 15%-20% of black children born today will grow up with two parents until age 16.
* Because Over 80% of long term child poverty occurs in broken or never married homes.
*Because Black men in America engage in polygamous relationships 3 and 1/2 times that of White or Hispanic.
* Because "The Black Family has crumbled more in the last 30 years than it did the entire 14 decades since slavery" - Dr. Julian Hare, Dir. - San Francisco Black Think Tank.

****Stats taken from: http://www.saveus.org/

I've said this before, Its not about party, ...I just think it's sickening that the black community has so much allegiance to a party that in my opinion does more to add to the problems than solve them.

[Love_Spell_6]

Originally posted by Little32

I have read your posts in other forums. I acknowledge that you are entitled to your opinion. I did not post mine so that I might be belittled or attacked for it. I we can be civil and respectful, perhaps the discussion can continue.

THis is how NOT to get me to respond to what you're saying I am not going to be boxed into responding how you want me to.

[Honeykiss1974]

I won't have time to read the article until later today, but this quote speaks VOLUMES.....

"The Black Family has crumbled more in the last 30 years than it did the entire 14 decades since slavery" - Dr. Julian Hare, Dir. - San Francisco Black Think Tank.

And as Love-Spell mentioned, this doesn't even have nothing to do with parties and affiliation.

[Eclipse]

When looking at the statistics that LoveSpell posted things certainly look dim....There is much work to do and I don't think it is an either/or proposition.

Both the individuals AND the government need to step up to the plate a bit more.

Yes, WE (our churches, community and civic organization, etc.) need to teach the value of delayed gratification in everything. Our government needs to make sure that there are opportunities so that young people feel that there is something worth waiting for. When I read statistics that say black men and many more times likely to be unemployed and unemployed for longer periods of time, I get sad. How can you be a father and a provider if you cannot provide?

Personnally, neither party speaks to me. The article said

Bush's speech to the Urban League, his third since becoming president, came as a new poll showed African-Americans overwhelmingly support John Kerry. The poll also showed black voters have yet to entirely warm up to Bush's Democratic challenger.

This to me says there are MANY religious, increasingly conservative Black folks (like me) who are looking for a reason to support someone other than Kerry. Unfortunately, my brand of "compassionate conservatism" does not look like what I see coming from the Republican party. Equally unfortunate, however, my brand of "liberalism" does not always match the Dems either.

What to do, what to do....

[Bamboozled]

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6

*Because 70% of all black children are born out of wedlock
*Because 62% of black families with children are headed by a single parent
*Because 85% of black children do not live in a home with their fathers
*Because Only 15%-20% of black children born today will grow up with two parents until age 16.
* Because Over 80% of long term child poverty occurs in broken or never married homes.
*Because Black men in America engage in polygamous relationships 3 and 1/2 times that of White or Hispanic.
* Because "The Black Family has crumbled more in the last 30 years than it did the entire 14 decades since slavery" - Dr. Julian Hare, Dir. - San Francisco Black Think Tank.
****Stats taken from: http://www.saveus.org/

Since you chose to pick and choose what statistics you wanted to post, I went to YOUR website (http://www.saveus.org/) and also found the following:

• 70% of African-Americans do NOT live below the poverty line.
• 61% of middle-class Blacks own stock.
• 40% live in suburban neighborhoods.
• ½ trillion dollars/year generated and circulated.
• Several named as wealthiest individuals in the nation.
• Black households earning over $100,000/yr. increased tenfold since 1960's.
• 39 black members of Congress - 8 times as many as 1964.
• More than ½ of 50 states, including Washington D.C., have black mayors.
• Blacks are directors of major corporations, university presidents, astronauts, political leaders and military generals.
Who would have believed an African American (Glenn Plummer) would be Chairman/CEO of the National Religious
Broadcasters and (Colin Powell) US Secretary of State?
• The number of Blacks with high school and college diplomas tripled since 1960's.

I just ask that if you want to tell it, tell the whole, unbiased story.

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6
its funny how since he made some very good points..no one really wants to respond or talk about it.

For some reason, you really seem determined to separate yourself from the pack, which is cool, I guess. However, I'm sure there are many conservative, Republican, African Americans who claim to love the Lord around here. The difference is, they aren't constantly screaming, "Look at me.... please look at me..... I swear I'm different!". I think THAT'S why no one is choosing to engage you in debate.

[Little32]

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6
THis is how NOT to get me to respond to what you're saying I am not going to be boxed into responding how you want me to.

I have had a lot of conversations with people who have conservative perspectives. I find them, for the most part, dismissive of any opinions that are not the same as theirs. They are not only dismissive, but condescending in their responses. I, myself, don't intend to participate in those kinds of conversations. There is a way to debate with civility and open-mindedness. So what I was trying to communicate is that if you choose to respond in the former manner,I am not going to carry on a conversation with you.

So my question to all of you is what happens to the children who are left behind. What happens to the children who, unfortunately, don't have parents who will advocate for them (either because they can't, won't, or don't know how)? Whose responsibility do those children become? What is the eventual effect on society if they are ignored or forsaken?

I mean you can say as much as you want that the family should bear some of the responsibility, which I agree with. But families don't come in these neat little boxes and function like the Cosbys and the Cleavers, as some would suggest is the only appropriate way. Families come in all shape and forms, and the lack of a father or a relatively young mother is not a recipe for failure(says the product of a single parent home--with a young mother--who is now working on a doctorate). And the fact of the matter--which we seem to lose sight of in assigning the blame--is that it is children, who can not do for themselves, that pay the price in the end. I don't guess it is fair to children that they are condemned because of their parents or the systems failings.

Also, as a product of predominantly black schools for most of my life, including an HBCU degree, I don't think that a good education has anything to do with the demographic break down of the school. As an educator, I just don't know how this now child left behind act can really help--in the short or long term. It is yet another band-aid, that doesn't even begin to address the actual problems.I

[Love_Spell_6]

Originally posted by Bamboozled
Since you chose to pick and choose what statistics you wanted to post, I went to YOUR website (http://www.saveus.org/) and also found the following:

• 70% of African-Americans do NOT live below the poverty line.
• 61% of middle-class Blacks own stock.
• 40% live in suburban neighborhoods.
• ½ trillion dollars/year generated and circulated.
• Several named as wealthiest individuals in the nation.
• Black households earning over $100,000/yr. increased tenfold since 1960's.
• 39 black members of Congress - 8 times as many as 1964.
• More than ½ of 50 states, including Washington D.C., have black mayors.
• Blacks are directors of major corporations, university presidents, astronauts, political leaders and military generals.
Who would have believed an African American (Glenn Plummer) would be Chairman/CEO of the National Religious
Broadcasters and (Colin Powell) US Secretary of State?
• The number of Blacks with high school and college diplomas tripled since 1960's.

I just ask that if you want to tell it, tell the whole, unbiased story.

For some reason, you really seem determined to separate yourself from the pack, which is cool, I guess. However, I'm sure there are many conservative, Republican, African Americans who claim to love the Lord around here. The difference is, they aren't constantly screaming, "Look at me.... please look at me..... I swear I'm different!". I think THAT'S why no one is choosing to engage you in debate.

Sweety if i didn't want anyone to read the article, I wouldn't have posted the link if anything you proved my point more by posting that part of the fact sheet..because it goes against a lot of the liberal rhetoric that claim african americans are doing oh so bad and its all the fault of the economy....maybe you should look at the facts and don't get so hung up on why and how I say what I say and do what I do...and the comment am i comfortable in my own skin is cute to say the least...

And how did it become MY website?? Why when I post its gotta be Look at me?? You sound a little intimidated by my posture...cause you didn't attack the facts (cause you can't) you chose to attack me personally. Kinda sad... And folks don't want to engage me in debate because they know I convict them! I don't live my life according to a party..I live it according to the plan Jesus left for us...so if there are so many on GC that claim to love the Lord...they will have to deal with Jesus on why they choose to hide their light under a bush instead of letting it SHINE!!

YOu sound like a perfect candidate for my fan club

Now can we get back to the topic in the thread..or is this gonna turn into another LoveSpell_6 fan club moment

Gurl you have no idea how comfortable I am in my beautiful skin! The question is (in my best Winans voice) ...are you?

[Little32]

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6
Sweety if i didn't want anyone to read the article, I wouldn't have posted the link if anything you proved my point more by posting that part of the fact sheet..because it goes against a lot of the liberal rhetoric that claim african americans are doing oh so bad and its all the fault of the economy....maybe you should look at the facts and don't get so hung up on why and how I say what I say and do what I do...and the comment am i comfortable in my own skin is cute to say the least...

And how did it become MY website?? Why when I post its gotta be Look at me?? You sound a little intimidated by my posture...cause you didn't attack the facts (cause you can't) you chose to attack me personally. Kinda sad... And folks don't want to engage me in debate because they know I convict them! I don't live my life according to a party..I live it according to the plan Jesus left for us...so if there are so many on GC that claim to love the Lord...they will have to deal with Jesus on why they choose to hide their light under a bush instead of letting it SHINE!!

YOu sound like a perfect candidate for my fan club

Now can we get back to the topic in the thread..or is this gonna turn into another LoveSpell_6 fan club moment

Gurl you have no idea how comfortable I am in my beautiful skin! The question is (in my best Winans voice) ...are you?

This is a perfect example of my point. Did you even bother to look at my post, which raised some legitimate questions--as did Bamboozled--, or did you just look for a post that would accomodate best your inflammatory tendencies?

[Bamboozled]

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6
Sweety if i didn't want anyone to read the article, I wouldn't have posted the link if anything you proved my point more by posting that part of the fact sheet..because it goes against a lot of the liberal rhetoric that claim african americans are doing oh so bad and its all the fault of the economy....maybe you should look at the facts and don't get so hung up on why and how I say what I say and do what I do...and the comment am i comfortable in my own skin is cute to say the least...

Please refain from calling me sweetie, babe, hon (or honey) or any other condescending term with which you tend to start all your "convicting" posts. It's not very Christ like.

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6
And how did it become MY website??

By stating "YOUR" website, I was merely inferring that it was the one YOU posted, as opposed to one I sought out myself to find contradictory facts. Is that a difficult concept?

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6
Why when I post its gotta be Look at me?? You sound a little intimidated by my posture...cause you didn't attack the facts (cause you can't) you chose to attack me personally. Kinda sad... And folks don't want to engage me in debate because they know I convict them! I don't live my life according to a party..I live it according to the plan Jesus left for us...so if there are so many on GC that claim to love the Lord...they will have to deal with Jesus on why they choose to hide their light under a bush instead of letting it SHINE!!

I’m not intimidated by your posture in the least bit… just annoyed. You know how some people always have to tell you know how rich they are, how pretty they are, how religious they are? Well, 90% of the time, those people lack the very thing of which they are trying to convince you. That’s how I read you. Almost every single post you make regarding politics and religion begins with something like, "I know I’m alone in this…”, “I know nobody else feels me on this…”, “My opinion differs so much from all you people of GC (besides Rudey of course)", etc… Narcissistic, much? As if you’re just so much more enlightened than the masses. You’re not a novelty.

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6
YOu sound like a perfect candidate for my fan club !!

I think you should be concerned about your own memberships, LOL.

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6
Now can we get back to the topic in the thread..or is this gonna turn into another LoveSpell_6 fan club moment

I never got off topic. I posted facts to offset the negativity imposed by the facts you posted. You seemed to think that no one was responding because we were all just stumped by Bush’s comments. I let you know that that isn’t the case at all.

Originally posted by Love_Spell_6
Gurl you have no idea how comfortable I am in my beautiful skin! The question is (in my best Winans voice) ...are you?

No doubt and I don’t think anyone on GC is questioning ME.

I know I'm taking away from the 4 people that actually want to respond to you, so I will keep the rest of my comments to myself. If you care to continue, please PM me. Thanks.

[Love_Spell_6]

Originally posted by Bamboozled


I know I'm taking away from the 4 people that actually want to respond to you, so I will keep the rest of my comments to myself. If you care to continue, please PM me. Thanks.

That was cute..hope you're done now...i have no need to PM you cause i never attacked you...i actually don't give a darn how you feel about me...its you and some other GCers that are so pre-occupied with me.... i'm cooler than a fan....

[TheEpitome1920]

*slowly backs away from the thread*

[Honeykiss1974]

Originally posted by Eclipse

Personnally, neither party speaks to me. The article said

Bush's speech to the Urban League, his third since becoming president, came as a new poll showed African-Americans overwhelmingly support John Kerry. The poll also showed black voters have yet to entirely warm up to Bush's Democratic challenger.

This to me says there are MANY religious, increasingly conservative Black folks (like me) who are looking for a reason to support someone other than Kerry. Unfortunately, my brand of "compassionate conservatism" does not look like what I see coming from the Republican party. Equally unfortunate, however, my brand of "liberalism" does not always match the Dems either.

What to do, what to do....

There are many blacks (whether they will admit it or not) in this predictament as well.

I personally am not a fan of Kerry for my reasons and on the flip side, I am not a big fan of Bush for other reasons, but what is the REAL alternative? For me, it will be moral issues that will be my deciding factor, as will it may be for others that are in the same predicament. If I could just combine what I liked in each candidate (a conservative with a good head for money and the underserved, then there would be no problem. )

The deterioration of the Black family can not be fixed by any ONE party nor has it been caused by any ONE party. The question is still how will we save us? Can we put aside blind loyalty to a party to help our kids?

This quote from an editorial by Clarence Page says it best to me

That’s why I find it interesting to imagine party leaders who, on an issue like this one, are willing to open the door, at least wide enough for some experimentation. When old ideas have played out, it makes sense to try some news ones, even if they come from your political opponents.

After all, as John F. Kennedy once said, sometimes party loyalty asks too much.

By Clarence Page

Since we are now talking about education, what's wrong with holding people accountable for their actions? (in this case, underperforming schools). Education spending increases, but a student's progress doesn't? Somethings wrong here. Maybe the NCLB act will reveal who REALLY is preventing our kids from achieving academic success (and not the teachers as a lot of people tend to believe).

And on a final note....

No one needs to put disclaimers on their post IF your intentions is to participate in a discussion and not a Verbal Smackdown 2004. We all can come from different points of view and still discuss the topic at hand.

[Love_Spell_6]

Originally posted by Honeykiss1974
There are many blacks (whether they will admit it or not) in this predictament as well.

I personally am not a fan of Kerry for my reasons and on the flip side, I am not a big fan of Bush for other reasons, but what is the REAL alternative? For me, it will be moral issues that will be my deciding factor, as will it may be for others that are in the same predicament. If I could just combine what I liked in each candidate (a conservative with a good head for money and the underserved, then there would be no problem. )

The deterioration of the Black family can not be fixed by any ONE party nor has it been caused by any ONE party. The question is still how will we save us? Can we put aside blind loyalty to a party to help our kids?

Since we are now talking about education, what's wrong with holding people accountable for their actions? (in this case, underperforming schools). Education spending increases, but a student's progress doesn't? Somethings wrong here. Maybe the NCLB act will reveal who REALLY is preventing our kids from achieving academic success (and not the teachers as a lot of people tend to believe).

And on a final note....

No one needs to put disclaimers on their post IF your intentions is to participate in a discussion and not a Verbal Smackdown 2004. We all can come from different points of view and still discuss the topic at hand.

Good post HK74
I agree with everything you're saying...and I don't know if our community as a whole is at the point where we're really accepting responsibility for our actions, and further willing to do what it takes to change things. I mean we're at the point where if you do question how "we" handle things...we're outcasts i.e. Bill Cosby! To me, only when we do that..AND really try to live according to Biblical truth will things change.